Deconvert or Never Believed?

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What is your theistical history?

Used to believe, but deconverted.
15
45%
Never believed.
15
45%
Still believe in some form of deity.
1
3%
I am God.
2
6%
 
Total votes: 33

John Greg
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Deconvert or Never Believed?

#1

Post by John Greg »

So, it seems to me that religious deconverts, meaning people who once were religious/theist but no longer believe in a deity, are generally as fanatical, e.g., John Loftus, as those individuals who are still religious. Yes, of course there are exceptions, but I think the rule holds together fairly well. It would seem that for most deconverts there still exists the need to believe, dogmatically, somewhat fanatically in something ... so to speak.

Anyway, I am curious. Are you a deconvert, a still believe, or are you a never believed in the first place?

I included the last option so that on the rather slim off-chance that either Lord PeeZus or Richard Carrier should drop by they will have an appropriate choice.

Metalogic42
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#2

Post by Metalogic42 »

I deconverted. I would hope that I'm not dogmatic about anything - or at least if I am, someone would call me out on it.

another lurker
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#3

Post by another lurker »

Never believed.

When I was little I had problems with the concept of 'god' and creation because if the world needed a creator, then who created god?

I even asked my mom if I could go to bible school so that I could learn the facts behind all this, but sadly, I learned not a thing.

Some years later, when I was a teen, I went to bible camp with a friend and omfg, I can totally understand how people are not only scared into believing, but brainwashed. The pastor there kept telling me, over and over, how I would burn in hell and suffer extreme agony if I did not believe. I just HAD to get out of there and was grateful when it was all over because it scared the shit out of me.

PS The fucker spoke in tongues which was part creepy part hilarious.

16bitheretic
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#4

Post by 16bitheretic »

I chose "I am God" on the poll. Not that I want to seem egotistical...

Anyways, I think my family was only truly attempting to be culturally Christian, or CINO (Christian In Name Only). When my grandparents came to America I suspect they started going to Christian church to fit in and become more "westernized". To this day they still go to a local Christian church but they never pray before family meals, there's no crosses anywhere, they have a Bible that I think has never been read much, and there's a small statue of Buddha in their flower garden.

My mom and dad were also church-goers and I believed in God as a kid, but we were never really hardcore at all. I thought church was boring, I think my brother mainly went to church youth activities for pizza and basketball, and my parents never really pushed religion much until I was in high school. For a brief period they started pushing me more into it because my brother was having personal and academic trouble in college and they didn't want me to follow suit and lose focus on my life or whatever. When I rebelled by briefly becoming a LaVeyan Satanist, they relented and went back to being "Easter and Christmas" Christians, I got bored of Satanism when it was no longer a massive family rift, and over time I realized I was I was an atheist when I started to actually think about religion and read more on it.

Matt Cavanaugh
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#5

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Metalogic42 wrote:I deconverted. I would hope that I'm not dogmatic about anything - or at least if I am, someone would call me out on it.
You're dogmatic about insisting you're never dogmatic. Drives me up the fucking wall. :liar:

Matt Cavanaugh
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#6

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

16bitheretic wrote:I chose "I am God" on the poll. Not that I want to seem egotistical...
Ha! And I thought Dick Carrier had de-lurked.

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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#7

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Me:
* Raised Catholic, in a mostly secular family and in a "leftie" parish -- guitar-playing priests, felt banners, lay ministers, no communion rail;
* Family was, however, active in the church: mom, dad & me (youth seat) served on parish council;
* Crazy about science as a child; it did not jive with stuff taught in Sunday School;
* Had a 'soft' apostasy at age 10 during a night bawling in bed. Swept it under the rug with an 'it's a test!' apology for God and His cruel world;
* Bored to tears by Mass, ages 10-16;
* CYA was fun, though, as it included making out with girls in the pews of the darkened church;
* Used to hang out with mellow priests, smoke cigars & shoot the breeze. They were always the last to leave my parents' parties, and made more sense drunk than most people do sober. (Jebbies, of course);
* Love-bombed / brain-washed at 16 in a weekend program called "Emmaus". Remember holding hands & crying a lot. Came out of Emmaus wearing a honkin' big cross 'round my neck, ready to preach the gospel, serve on a U-boot, or blow up an Israeli bus;
* A teacher, a former monk, told me in private: "You won't get this joke now, but soon I know you will: a man needs God like a fish needs a bicycle." Broke some rules there, but God bless his heathen soul!
* Full and complete apostasy 2 weeks later. Never looked back;
* Did Spend a couple of years fishing for some scientific basis for afterlife;
* Happy now with reality. Buddhism as philosophy helped a lot, as did Stoicism and Epicureanism;
* An atheist girlfriend, who disabused me of afterlife wishes, gave me her copy of The Selfish Gene, and fucked me senseless while talking dirty herpetology, had no small impact.

Unlike many, I do not harbor much resentment for organized religion. Everyone was very nice to me, and meant well. I do regret, though, not being able to play more on Sundays.

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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#8

Post by another lurker »

My favourite podcast 'cognitive dissonance' had people phone in with their de-conversion stories. One stood out. Long story short, a young man prayed to god to be turned into a werewolf. It didn't happen. And because of this, he decided, there could be no god. If there was a god, his prayers would have been answered.

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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#9

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

I changed religions for a day. One Summer, us Catholic kids got shipped to a Bible Camp run by the Baptists, cuz they were way more organized than usn's. I was maybe 7 or 8. I came home and told my mother I wanted to be a Baptist. Nonplussed, she asked why. "Because the Baptists have sticker books!"

Lsuoma
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#10

Post by Lsuoma »

I'm a Born-Again Piss Tank.

KiwiInOz
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#11

Post by KiwiInOz »

Was christened catholic. Had a catholic grandmother who took us to Church when we stayed with her. Went to CCD for a couple of weeks at the insistence of an aunt. Stopped after going back home and telling my step sister she'd be going to hell because she wasn't christened. Stepmother (daughter of a Baptist minister) soon had us all going to Sunday school. Didn't really believe but didn't not believe. Was interested in dinosaurs and science, so didn't believe the young earth creationists who taught scripture at school. Dad (lapsed catholic) got pissed off when we brought Jack Chick tracts back from a camp. Stopped any semblance of going to church and belief when I left home at 17/18. Decided I was atheist soon after.

Got married in a catholic church for my wife and had the kids christened. Eldest, daughter, doesn't believe, but would like there to be fairies at the bottom of the garden. The two sons are atheist through and through. Wife no longer goes to church.

Aneris
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#12

Post by Aneris »

I ticked the option that I did not believe. This isn't entirely true. I did believe in all kinds of things when I was a child (certainly under 8) with no apparent consistency or system. I have written about it just yesterday. This is probably true for most children. But I always was very imaginative, too. As soon as I discovered the idea that things can be fiction, everything went in there, together with my own fabrications.

It was when I began keeping some sort of mental hygiene and structuring everything, not just the real thing. Supernatural elements just didn't fit in. I'm apparently a hardcore “Intuitive”. Instead of having had concious thoughts about the real world, I just included “what made sense” and there were no supernatural entities. I loved fairytales and mythologies. I come to think that religion just “intuitively” appeared like what I knew was fantasy and fiction and so it went into that category. I also empathized with what people probably believed in earlier times and was horrified, which made me very angry at organized religion early on. I think that it is the most evil thing ever conceived.

I don't know if the theory of dogmatist deconverts holds water. I don't know the individuals well enough to tell. It is always possible that there are some elements, having authorities to turn to, wanting to be “right”, wanting to know the Truth™ which has appeal to some people, whether they formerly believed in such things or not.

The SJW people certainly have a religious mindset. It reminded me already about it on my first encounter with them on Pharyngula, before I knew what SJW means or before I could tune-in to some theories on the Slymepit (I also had never heard of the Slymepit at the time). Their behavior just reminded me so strongly of religious believers.

KiwiInOz
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#13

Post by KiwiInOz »

A bit like you Aneris, except that I ticked the Used to believe button, even though it was very weak belief. My deconversion was bit like waking up and having a yawn and a stretch and recognising that day time was reality.

I was a bit of an apatheist really. Then I got better.

Tribble
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#14

Post by Tribble »

Deconverted. Hell, was studying to move up the preacher hierarchy from deacon to pastor. But, to tell the truth, I not sure I ever really believed so walking away was both quick and easy, like flipping a light switch. But behind it is a long, complicated story involving trying at least a dozen religions, including Judaism, over a dozen years (from 12 to 24) and it bores the hell out even me and it's my story. :)

FlyingV
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#15

Post by FlyingV »

Deconverted, although I was never a hardcore believer. My parents took us to church mainly to be closer with our family that went to that church for a short time in my adolescence. I didn't give religion much of a thought until one of my good friends decided to convert to Catholicism, and she would talk about it....a lot....all the time. I supported her and even went to confession with her. I thought she was cray cray for wearing a scapular in case she dies and for thinking that telling some dude her sins would make it better. That made me start thinking about my own beliefs. It's also cray cray to wear a cross or to pray to make it all better. Sometimes, you don't see the crazy in yourself until you see it someone else first.

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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#16

Post by VickyCaramel »

My mothers side of the family were actually very involved in the church of England... but they were also involved in other institutions connected with it via the military, schools and universities and a nice old lady who happens to be head of the Church.

Come to think about it, my grandparents attended church multiple times a week, but I don't recall them ever talking about actual religion or faith, only maintenance, restoration, administration, charity, events, memorials.

Mother was very busy when I was a child and didn't have much time to think about it so I was never indoctrinated. Really it wasn't anything I gave much thought to, god and Jesus were given to me with the same conviction as Father Christmas and the Tooth Fairy.

Then when my parents divorced and their businesses fell apart, my mother became born again, and over the years has become more or less fanatical (she does suffer some mental problems), joining churches which borrow from America. So over the years she has leaned towards creationism and most recently has been pounding the streets handing out leaflets condemning gay marriage.

So I went from never thinking about it, to having to react to the idiocy of my mothers often fundamentalist and fanatical beliefs. So you can put me in the fanatically anti-religion camp.

(By contrast, my father joined several secular and humanist organization although he wasn't very active).

spiffigt
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#17

Post by spiffigt »

Never believed. Just lucky I guess since I grew up in the Swedish bible belt and none of my close relatives are believers. (or were in the case of dead grandparents)

TheMan
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Re: Deconvert or Never Believed?

#18

Post by TheMan »

Not sure how I will make this long story short.

There was a time when I wanted to become a catholic priest. I was about 11 yo.

I was born in Sydney, 1962. I've only realised this recently (last xmas) but I wasn't raised to believe in God or the Catholic story. My dad always told stories of how the local churched ripped his family off some expensive family eirlooms when my father was young and near death after an accident. But he also kept a bible in the house but never "preached from it" but I'm fairly sure he kept it because it was his Dad's bible and I'm guessing he has "dad" issues (like I have).

In 1971, my Mum got word that my grandmother had become ill due to diabeties and she was going to lose her eyesight. We traveled to Malta by ship, it took a month, and when we arrived I was greated by a blind old woman who was my grandmother (GM).

Mum only told me this (last xmas) that GM was a fundamentalist Catholic and was shocked we kids (my younger sister) had not done the Holy Communion and the Confirmation and it needed to be sorted right away. For a blind old woman she was a scary woman. I had to go to church every Sunday...as did everyone else in Malta at the time.

Three years of indoctrination, I was a pious kid and studied the scriptures and did the right things. I helped my GM..I had become her personal nurse even to the extent of injecting her with insulin, cooking for her (I introduced her to chips/fries). I was the perfect Catholic kid.

in 1973 my Dad, not living with us at the time, went back to Sydney and in 1974 we followed. There was a lot of family shit I won't go into here but when I arrived back in Sydney I was scared I was going to be lead astray by the devil..just like the priest told me when I said good by to him and my fellow bible students back in Malta. I have to say at this point...I have no problems with the priest in Malta...they were dutiful, caring and never tried to do anythng inappropriate. I revered them. I respected them...

I remember one time after not going to church for a couple of weeks I walked past a church...I had no clue that Church of England was different to Catholics. There was only one kind of church in Malta (probably not true even back then). I walked in spoke with the priest..told him my worries. He explained the differences between the churches but he was willing to listen to my confessions and thoughts. I only knew how to say the Hail Mary and the Lords prayer in Maltese...he told e it didn;t matter what language it was in.

I felt good....but that confusion about religions, Prtestants, Catholics...and the greek school kids in my class were doing something called Orthodox. Well... I started questioning...asking difficult questions.

Then I guess I was around 12... I started masturbating...then I made a pact with the devil. Now I am an atheist.... but I still have a healthy interest in peoples interpretation of the gospels and other religions including other belief stories.

Now I just need to work out how this skeptic thing works...but I suspect I have been practising that for a long time and get in trouble at school for asking the cheeky tough questions.

Any questions?

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