You is all a bunch of poofs!

KiwiInOz
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2461

Post by KiwiInOz » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:42 pm

And the shooter was a fucking Australian. Close the borders.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2462

Post by AndrewV69 » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:58 pm

Looks like he did a livestream. Someone saved a 17 min video which I just watched.

He used(wasted) a bunch of ammo. Went back to his car to resupply, then went back in and shot the people who he had already shot again. Heading back to the car he shot & then finished off a woman on the way back to his car (she was screaming). Then he drove off running her over in the process. He also shot targets through his front and side window while he was driving.

Anyway,

It does not look to me as though he displayed much discipline apart from 3 round bursts. No, I am not going to post a link to the video.

Brive1987
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2463

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:08 am

I have assembled a detailed and comprehensive immediate action.

Mr Dick-Wick and his family should be strung up.
White Australian males should be placed under watch.
Lauren Southern should broom handled.
8Chan should be banned.
Facebook and all other involved social media should be banned.
High capacity magazines should be banned. No. Actually all guns should be banned.
All alt right wingers should be arrested.
Muslims should be escorted to a friendly nation, for their own protection.
Anyone who has ever questioned ethnically diverse immigration policies should be arrested.
Trump should be impeached.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2464

Post by piginthecity » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:48 am

Brive1987 wrote: I have assembled a detailed and comprehensive immediate action.

Mr Dick-Wick and his family should be strung up.
White Australian males should be placed under watch.
Lauren Southern should broom handled.
8Chan should be banned.
Facebook and all other involved social media should be banned.
High capacity magazines should be banned. No. Actually all guns should be banned.
All alt right wingers should be arrested.
Muslims should be escorted to a friendly nation, for their own protection.
Anyone who has ever questioned ethnically diverse immigration policies should be arrested.
Trump should be impeached.
I don't care that you're a shitposter, I am too. What's ridiculous about you is that you this and then expect to be taken seriously when it suits.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2465

Post by MarcusAu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:16 am

Brive1987 wrote: I have assembled a detailed and comprehensive immediate action.
...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DfJc0Une5g

Brive1987
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2466

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:28 am

piginthecity wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: I have assembled a detailed and comprehensive immediate action.

Mr Dick-Wick and his family should be strung up.
White Australian males should be placed under watch.
Lauren Southern should broom handled.
8Chan should be banned.
Facebook and all other involved social media should be banned.
High capacity magazines should be banned. No. Actually all guns should be banned.
All alt right wingers should be arrested.
Muslims should be escorted to a friendly nation, for their own protection.
Anyone who has ever questioned ethnically diverse immigration policies should be arrested.
Trump should be impeached.
I don't care that you're a shitposter, I am too. What's ridiculous about you is that you this and then expect to be taken seriously when it suits.
Don’t begrudge me my attempted versatility. I am quite confident my list will cover off a large percentage of the normal and woke response. The fact I don’t know whether I’m shit posting or not (or even if there is a difference here) is what makes this a wild ride.

I quite understand if you choose to get off the roller coaster.

Kirbmarc
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2467

Post by Kirbmarc » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:33 am

Brive1987 wrote: Don’t begrudge me my attempted versatility. I am quite confident my list will cover off a large percentage of the normal and woke response. The fact I don’t know whether I’m shit posting or not (or even if there is a difference here) is what makes this a wild ride.

I quite understand if you choose to get off the roller coaster.
Perhaps a more rational approach to the problem would be to try to understand why narratives based on prophecies of impending doom instead of trying to find a solution to cultural and value problems might inspire people to insane actions.

Without the need to ban anyone, or arrest anyone for wrong-thinking. But fostering self-reflection.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2468

Post by Kirbmarc » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:38 am

When someone claims that immigration is a "great replacement", that immigrants in general are a threat collectively, that collectives are what really matters, not laws or individual behavior, that some countries are doomed because of that, that liberal democratic values should take a backseat in favor of "defending traditions" from "globalism" and that assimilation is impossible or next to impossible, calling instead for people to get "mad as hell" about the coming apocalypse, someone might take those things seriously and go out and do something to the "invaders" or those who let the "invaders" in.

This is something that has happened before, with Brievik and the attack of the HIAS synagogue. And now it's happened again. Perhaps it's time to wonder whether "triggering" people or wanting to get people angry is really productive.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2469

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:52 am

A comment that could be as equally (and perhaps more pointedly) directed towards Democrat firebrands as Ockers.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2470

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:03 am

Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Don’t begrudge me my attempted versatility. I am quite confident my list will cover off a large percentage of the normal and woke response. The fact I don’t know whether I’m shit posting or not (or even if there is a difference here) is what makes this a wild ride.

I quite understand if you choose to get off the roller coaster.
Perhaps a more rational approach to the problem would be to try to understand why narratives based on prophecies of impending doom instead of trying to find a solution to cultural and value problems might inspire people to insane actions.

Without the need to ban anyone, or arrest anyone for wrong-thinking. But fostering self-reflection.
Clearly your argument fails as the perfect time for any group to organise as a defensive collective is prior to the actualisation of an existential threat. The trick is properly aligning threat and response. Something of an epic fail occurred here ....

I’d be perfectly happy to pull the lever on his drop. I also like girls very much, but I’d be equally happy to kick the chair of a rapist from under him.

I’m intrigued at your rush to score a big picture “win” from this incident. Are you seriously connecting the dots between Brevik eight years ago, this dickhead and some sort of material terrorist movement equivalent to ISIS and state sponsored Islamist strikes into the West?

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2471

Post by Kirbmarc » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:05 am

Brive1987 wrote: A comment that could be as equally (and perhaps more pointedly) directed towards Democrat firebrands as Ockers.
In this case, the terrorist nutter was clearly inspired by the alt-right. Deflecting and projecting are lame tactics.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2472

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:06 am


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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2473

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:09 am

You made a lame argument dealing in superficial absolutes.
Perhaps it's time to wonder whether "triggering" people or wanting to get people angry is really productive.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2474

Post by Kirbmarc » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:11 am

Brive1987 wrote: I’m intrigued at your rush to score a big picture “win” from this incident. Are you seriously connecting the dots between Brevik eight years ago, this dickhead and some sort of material terrorist movement equivalent to ISIS and state sponsored Islamist strikes into the West?
It's not a matter of material support and I'm not drawing any equivalencies to ISIS. The point of the matter is that certain arguments might trigger certain responses, especially if they're based on hyperbolic and apocalyptic narratives like "the Great Replacement".

Imagine someone going on a punching spree in a Republican convention because they were inspired by the "punch the Nazi" memes of the SocJus. Would you say that I was drawing equivalencies to ISIS if I said that the "punch a Nazi" crowd need to tone it down and think about what kind of messages they're promoting?

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2475

Post by Kirbmarc » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:13 am

Brive1987 wrote:
I never thought Southern would approve of the Christchurch alt-right terrorist. But she seems clueless about the impact of her ideas.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2476

Post by Kirbmarc » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:15 am

Brive1987 wrote: You made a lame argument dealing in superficial absolutes.
Perhaps it's time to wonder whether "triggering" people or wanting to get people angry is really productive.
More whataboutism and deflection.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2477

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:22 am

Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: I’m intrigued at your rush to score a big picture “win” from this incident. Are you seriously connecting the dots between Brevik eight years ago, this dickhead and some sort of material terrorist movement equivalent to ISIS and state sponsored Islamist strikes into the West?
It's not a matter of material support and I'm not drawing any equivalencies to ISIS. The point of the matter is that certain arguments might trigger certain responses, especially if they're based on hyperbolic and apocalyptic narratives like "the Great Replacement".

Imagine someone going on a punching spree in a Republican convention because they were inspired by the "punch the Nazi" memes of the SocJus. Would you say that I was drawing equivalencies to ISIS if I said that the "punch a Nazi" crowd need to tone it down and think about what kind of messages they're promoting?
I think there are ways and means to discuss the cultural implications of demographic change.
I also think open discussion and a wider overton window would draw the oxygen from break-through pundits.
However, there is also a conversation to be had about the abstracted polarisation encouraged by the Internet.

Today is probably not the day to have these higher level discussions.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2478

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:24 am

Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: You made a lame argument dealing in superficial absolutes.
Perhaps it's time to wonder whether "triggering" people or wanting to get people angry is really productive.
https..://youtu.be/tJCDe7vdFfw
More whataboutism and deflection.
No. You made a shit argument. Incitement and agitation based on competing collectives is a tool used by all sides and it isn’t going away.

shoutinghorse
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2479

Post by shoutinghorse » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:38 am

Just hang on to them there reins a moment longer folks.

False Flag Alert. :hand:


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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2480

Post by Hunt » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:49 am

Brive1987 wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: You made a lame argument dealing in superficial absolutes.
Perhaps it's time to wonder whether "triggering" people or wanting to get people angry is really productive.
https..://youtu.be/tJCDe7vdFfw
More whataboutism and deflection.
No. You made a shit argument. Incitement and agitation based on competing collectives is a tool used by all sides and it isn’t going away.
I think you're both right (what an appeaser!). It's not a shit argument (that's why it's controversial) and it's not going away. Case in point: I've been watching some abortion debate youtubes that revisit the topic of George Tiller, the doctor murdered by a pro-life nut. I remember when it happened, the pro-life crowd had a collective "oh-shit" moment, a very, very brief moment of self-reflection. Then, as I remember, they rationalized and got back to business as usual.

It's going to be the same story over and over. There will always be that fringe lunatic who takes things off the deep end. Both sides then seek to use it as confirmation that they're correct.

Can you live with the consequences of free speech?

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2481

Post by shoutinghorse » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:50 am

There's more. Could we be witnessing a Smollet on steroids? :shock:


Keating
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2482

Post by Keating » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:06 am

I'm having a hard time processing this. I can sort of understand why you'd want to fly a plane into buildings, or kill the children of a political party you disagree with. What I can't understand is why you'd blame name drop someone like Candace Owens, and then tell people to subscribe to PewDiePie before going on an evil killing spree while playing the Remove Kebab song. The entire manifesto is nothing but memes; I can't see the angle that makes sense.

Accelerationism maybe?

MarcusAu
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2483

Post by MarcusAu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:18 am

Keating wrote: I'm having a hard time processing this. I can sort of understand why you'd want to fly a plane into buildings, or kill the children of a political party you disagree with. What I can't understand is why you'd blame name drop someone like Candace Owens, and then tell people to subscribe to PewDiePie before going on an evil killing spree while playing the Remove Kebab song. The entire manifesto is nothing but memes; I can't see the angle that makes sense.

Accelerationism maybe?
If you can't understand his motivations the fault lies with you. Next you will be saying that Time CubeTM theory does not make sense.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2484

Post by John D » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:34 am

Let's face it. Western culture has become disgusting.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2485

Post by MarcusAu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:37 am

I still find that it has much to offer.

SM1957
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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2486

Post by SM1957 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:11 am

A deranged terrorist shitposts the name 'Candace Owens' and suddenly she is the inspiration for killing Muslims.

Isn't that as logical as claiming that because Shamima Begum named her baby Jarrah, then ISIS were Islamic and derived their ideology by careful study of the lives of the Companions of the Prophet?

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2487

Post by Hunt » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:12 am

Well, I just watched the full 16 min video. For some reason I thought I had to. Pretty gruesome. If that's a false flag, the guy is a better actor than me.

I think he's just nuts, plain and simple.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2488

Post by screwtape » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:41 am

The wretched events in Christchurch made me have a thought. It's pretty clear that many natives of desirable-residence countries are unhappy about the immigration policies of their governments, rightly or wrongly - it doesn't matter for this thought. It might not be immigration: it could be an issue like Brexit, or any other highly-charged matter where the public and their government don't seem to be on the same page. Some will tolerate their dissatisfaction better than others, but there will be a point at which the least stable, poorest impulse-control, most prone to violence people will say 'enough!' and do something stupid like this. Such individuals are like canaries in a coal mine in the sense that they give early warning of public discontent. For every gun-toting mass murderer there must be many more who feel similarly, but would never do such an evil thing. I don't mean to legitimise such shooters in any way, but if they are a symptom of an underlying and widespread unhappiness in the populace, it raises questions:

1. Should governments take notice of these kind of events as indicators that they ought to reconsider policy?
2. If they do, is that just giving in to terrorism?
3. Should we study the phenomenon? Presumably we can very roughly quantify the level of public dissatisfaction among ordinary law-abiding citizens from the number/severity of such outrages.

Just idle thoughts whilst waiting for the breakfast egg to boil.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2489

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:46 am

screwtape wrote: Just idle thoughts whilst waiting for the breakfast egg to boil.
Dude, why are you being so coy? Just call it 'wanking' like the rest of us, we're all adults here.


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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2491

Post by Matt Cavanaugh » Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:02 am

Lsuoma wrote:
shoutinghorse wrote: Cromwell played by an Irishman? I can't imagine that went down well with anyone.
I'm surprised you Droghedad that up!
Very few people would even get that joke. much less come up with it!

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2492

Post by MarcusAu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:24 am

If he wanted to be really offensive (by which I mean intellectually, rather than physically, obviously) he could have mentioned 'Von Tempsky'.

He was a Polish mercenary who helped out in the Maori Wars in the 19th century. Controversy (as always) was raised in recent memory because there was a street named after him - and some found it offensive.

But you know if you can put up with a town named 'Cromwell' you can put up with anything.


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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2494

Post by free thoughtpolice » Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:54 am

From the other side of the spectrum, at FTB the Great American Satanist blames mainstream atheism. He doesn't come out and name Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins but I think you can guess who he means:
Mass murder in New Zealand. I’m really glad there isn’t anyone on the blogroll here anymore in overt denial of the reality of islamophobia. I’d like to encourage any readers that still have any question about that in their head to really really interrogate themselves about it.

You don’t have to come as far as I have, to seeing the mainstream atheist movement as a major catalyst of it, but at least see.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2495

Post by free thoughtpolice » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:06 am

SM1957 wrote: A deranged terrorist shitposts the name 'Candace Owens' and suddenly she is the inspiration for killing Muslims.

Isn't that as logical as claiming that because Shamima Begum named her baby Jarrah, then ISIS were Islamic and derived their ideology by careful study of the lives of the Companions of the Prophet?
The Pewdepie and Candace Owens thing were shitposts.
That ISIS are islamic and have derived their ideology from studying the Muhammad and his merry band of thugs is a fact.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2496

Post by Steersman » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:16 am

ConcentratedH2O, OM wrote:
screwtape wrote: Just idle thoughts whilst waiting for the breakfast egg to boil.
Dude, why are you being so coy? Just call it 'wanking' like the rest of us, we're all adults here.
Some of us are. Others here have a predilection for childish & overly graphic insults of other people who are unlikely to ever visit this "den of iniquity", and which seem based on a serious degree of butthurt ...

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2497

Post by Steersman » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:20 am

free thoughtpolice wrote: From the other side of the spectrum, at FTB the Great American Satanist blames mainstream atheism. He doesn't come out and name Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins but I think you can guess who he means:
Mass murder in New Zealand. I’m really glad there isn’t anyone on the blogroll here anymore in overt denial of the reality of islamophobia. I’d like to encourage any readers that still have any question about that in their head to really really interrogate themselves about it.

You don’t have to come as far as I have, to seeing the mainstream atheist movement as a major catalyst of it, but at least see.
Whole lotta virtue-signalling going on - "oh woe is us!" - with diddly-squat - largely - in the way of a willingness to address the roots of the problem:


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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2498

Post by Steersman » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:22 am

Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: A comment that could be as equally (and perhaps more pointedly) directed towards Democrat firebrands as Ockers.
In this case, the terrorist nutter was clearly inspired by the alt-right. Deflecting and projecting are lame tactics.
Stochastic terrorism - too bad more don''t appreciate the concept of collective responsibility ...

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2499

Post by KiwiInOz » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:23 am

screwtape wrote: The wretched events in Christchurch made me have a thought. It's pretty clear that many natives of desirable-residence countries are unhappy about the immigration policies of their governments, rightly or wrongly - it doesn't matter for this thought. It might not be immigration: it could be an issue like Brexit, or any other highly-charged matter where the public and their government don't seem to be on the same page. Some will tolerate their dissatisfaction better than others, but there will be a point at which the least stable, poorest impulse-control, most prone to violence people will say 'enough!' and do something stupid like this. Such individuals are like canaries in a coal mine in the sense that they give early warning of public discontent. For every gun-toting mass murderer there must be many more who feel similarly, but would never do such an evil thing. I don't mean to legitimise such shooters in any way, but if they are a symptom of an underlying and widespread unhappiness in the populace, it raises questions:

1. Should governments take notice of these kind of events as indicators that they ought to reconsider policy?
2. If they do, is that just giving in to terrorism?
3. Should we study the phenomenon? Presumably we can very roughly quantify the level of public dissatisfaction among ordinary law-abiding citizens from the number/severity of such outrages.

Just idle thoughts whilst waiting for the breakfast egg to boil.
I think that you are probably right. I now see increased calls to tackle Islamophobia, but that is just looking at a symptom not the cause.

And like Hunt, I think that Kirbmarc and Brive are both partially correct in their arguments and therefore wrong in totality. Each see a part of a complex system and suggest an answer, which is correct from their perspective but is unlikely to provide a solution that works.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2500

Post by Steersman » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:31 am

Bhurzum wrote:
Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:28 pm
AndrewV69 wrote: Welp,

I am not surprised. I am not going to be surprised in the future either.
I'm surprised it didn't happen sooner. Not saying I agree with the idea of gunning down civvies (honest!) ...
A likely story ... ;-)
Bhurzum wrote:
Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:28 pm
... but there are plenty of wired-to-the-moon types out there (left, right, black, white etc) who are itching to let the lead fly. I honestly thought the Arianna Grande (sp?) bombing would have sparked a violent backlash - the lack of retaliation cost me £50 in a wager with my sis-in-law.

Yup, it's a grim state of affairs...
"Ariana Grande" - learn something new everyday - the Manchester Arena bombing.

But "grim" indeed.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2501

Post by Steersman » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:44 am

KiwiInOz wrote:
screwtape wrote: The wretched events in Christchurch made me have a thought. It's pretty clear that many natives of desirable-residence countries are unhappy about the immigration policies of their governments, rightly or wrongly - it doesn't matter for this thought. It might not be immigration: it could be an issue like Brexit, or any other highly-charged matter where the public and their government don't seem to be on the same page. Some will tolerate their dissatisfaction better than others, but there will be a point at which the least stable, poorest impulse-control, most prone to violence people will say 'enough!' and do something stupid like this. Such individuals are like canaries in a coal mine in the sense that they give early warning of public discontent. For every gun-toting mass murderer there must be many more who feel similarly, but would never do such an evil thing. I don't mean to legitimise such shooters in any way, but if they are a symptom of an underlying and widespread unhappiness in the populace, it raises questions:

1. Should governments take notice of these kind of events as indicators that they ought to reconsider policy?
2. If they do, is that just giving in to terrorism?
3. Should we study the phenomenon? Presumably we can very roughly quantify the level of public dissatisfaction among ordinary law-abiding citizens from the number/severity of such outrages.

Just idle thoughts whilst waiting for the breakfast egg to boil.
I think that you are probably right. I now see increased calls to tackle Islamophobia, but that is just looking at a symptom not the cause.

And like Hunt, I think that Kirbmarc and Brive are both partially correct in their arguments and therefore wrong in totality. Each see a part of a complex system and suggest an answer, which is correct from their perspective but is unlikely to provide a solution that works.
Indeed.
Toronto van attack: lone-wolf or stochastic terrorism?

.... But while many commentators — including, as noted above, Barbara Kay at The Post Millennial and Jonathan Kay at The National Post, and, most recently Debra Soh at The Globe and Mail — have weighed-in to caution against seeing that tragedy as yet another instance of “lone-wolf jihadism”, against “viewing mass killing as tribal warfare”, against blaming “toxic masculinity”, it seems clear that such instances are the tips of a profoundly dangerous “iceberg”, and that they are the all too common examples of a metastasizing cancer eating away at the body politic. No doubt such individuals are the proximate and direct causes of the carnage they produce when they explode — literally or figuratively, but it doesn’t help at all to absolve those who have stoked the fires which have produced the intolerable pressures that have indirectly contributed to such explosions.

And for which we might all take some responsibility for [by] allowing that latter group to do so — even if only for their crime of “inciting hatred against any identifiable group, [particularly] where such incitement is likely to lead to a breach of the peace.” Not at all a popular opinion, but there seems some justification for arguing that we all should take, or be obliged to take, some responsibility for the actions of other members of our individual “tribes”. As Muslim reformer Asra Nomani put it in a Washington Post article some three years ago:
When Rupert Murdoch recently tweeted, “Maybe most Moslems peaceful, but until they recognize and destroy their growing jihadist cancer they must be held responsible,” he was criticized for indelicately saying all Muslims were responsible for the acts of a few. But I do believe we bear collective responsibility for the problems in our communities.
May her “tribe” increase. But for instance, or more prosaically, a Daily Kos article of 2011 argued that such cases were the all too common manifestations of what they called “stochastic terrorism” which they defined as:
“… the use of mass communications to stir up random lone wolves to carry out violent or terrorist acts that are statistically predictable but individually unpredictable. ….

The stochastic terrorist is the person who uses mass media to broadcast memes that incite unstable people to commit violent acts.

One or more unstable people responds to the incitement by becoming a lone wolf and committing a violent act. While their action may have been statistically predictable …, the specific person and the specific act are not predictable (yet).

The stochastic terrorist then has plausible deniability ….”
To reiterate, while those individual “lone wolves” have to bear the lion’s share of the blame for their actions, it seems clear that those other individuals who have contributed to the toxic and corrosive brews of hate that those lone wolves have steeped themselves in have to take a significant portion of that blame. While most individuals are more or less capable of withstanding untenable “incitements to violence”, it is also clear that we have an overabundance of “unstable people” who aren’t and who are too easily pushed over the edge. A state of affairs for which society itself shares some degree of culpability. ....
As the modern day prophet Walt Kelly once put it, "We have seen the enemy, and he is us."

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2502

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:48 am

Keating wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:06 am
I'm having a hard time processing this. I can sort of understand why you'd want to fly a plane into buildings, or kill the children of a political party you disagree with. What I can't understand is why you'd blame name drop someone like Candace Owens, and then tell people to subscribe to PewDiePie before going on an evil killing spree while playing the Remove Kebab song. The entire manifesto is nothing but memes; I can't see the angle that makes sense.

Accelerationism maybe?
Seems we don't have to guess.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nsd9w3dHrI

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2503

Post by free thoughtpolice » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:49 am

Steersman wrote:
As the modern day prophet Walt Kelly once put it, "We have seen the enemy, and he is us."
Clearly a monstrous stochastic terrorist that is inciting people to commit suicide.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2504

Post by MarcusAu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:50 am

There's not a problem in the world that a government doesn't think it can solve with greater surveillance and more power to prosecute it's citizens.

I'd like to see an account of how and why the current system failed before a solution is implemented.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2505

Post by MarcusAu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:51 am

free thoughtpolice wrote: Steersman wrote:
As the modern day prophet Walt Kelly once put it, "We have seen the enemy, and he is us."
Clearly a monstrous stochastic terrorist that is inciting people to commit suicide.
And he really needed to get out more. Never met a man he didn't like, indeed.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2506

Post by Keating » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:10 pm

screwtape wrote: The wretched events in Christchurch made me have a thought. It's pretty clear that many natives of desirable-residence countries are unhappy about the immigration policies of their governments, rightly or wrongly - it doesn't matter for this thought. It might not be immigration: it could be an issue like Brexit, or any other highly-charged matter where the public and their government don't seem to be on the same page. Some will tolerate their dissatisfaction better than others, but there will be a point at which the least stable, poorest impulse-control, most prone to violence people will say 'enough!' and do something stupid like this. Such individuals are like canaries in a coal mine in the sense that they give early warning of public discontent. For every gun-toting mass murderer there must be many more who feel similarly, but would never do such an evil thing. I don't mean to legitimise such shooters in any way, but if they are a symptom of an underlying and widespread unhappiness in the populace, it raises questions:

1. Should governments take notice of these kind of events as indicators that they ought to reconsider policy?
2. If they do, is that just giving in to terrorism?
3. Should we study the phenomenon? Presumably we can very roughly quantify the level of public dissatisfaction among ordinary law-abiding citizens from the number/severity of such outrages.

Just idle thoughts whilst waiting for the breakfast egg to boil.
I think the "anywheres versus somewheres" framing is a big part of the puzzle. I'd definitely be a somewhere, others here are probably anywheres.


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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2507

Post by CommanderTuvok » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:14 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote: From the other side of the spectrum, at FTB the Great American Satanist blames mainstream atheism. He doesn't come out and name Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins but I think you can guess who he means:
Mass murder in New Zealand. I’m really glad there isn’t anyone on the blogroll here anymore in overt denial of the reality of islamophobia. I’d like to encourage any readers that still have any question about that in their head to really really interrogate themselves about it.

You don’t have to come as far as I have, to seeing the mainstream atheist movement as a major catalyst of it, but at least see.
Neither Dawkins or Harris ripped up a page from the Koran for a silly stunt, like PZ Myers did, nor did they ever come out with the sot of vitriol that CJ Werleman and Dan Arel came out with.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2508

Post by shoutinghorse » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:22 pm

Bhurzum wrote: I honestly thought the Arianna Grande (sp?) bombing would have sparked a violent backlash
I'd violently bomb Ariana Grande's back doors in. :drool:

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2509

Post by free thoughtpolice » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:24 pm

CommanderTuvok wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote: From the other side of the spectrum, at FTB the Great American Satanist blames mainstream atheism. He doesn't come out and name Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins but I think you can guess who he means:
Mass murder in New Zealand. I’m really glad there isn’t anyone on the blogroll here anymore in overt denial of the reality of islamophobia. I’d like to encourage any readers that still have any question about that in their head to really really interrogate themselves about it.

You don’t have to come as far as I have, to seeing the mainstream atheist movement as a major catalyst of it, but at least see.
Neither Dawkins or Harris ripped up a page from the Koran for a silly stunt, like PZ Myers did, nor did they ever come out with the sot of vitriol that CJ Werleman and Dan Arel came out with.
I was almost surprised that PZ hasn't come out and blamed Dawkins, Harris, or anyone else that didn't let him into the horsey cult by name for planning the shooting. Maybe the big lawyer's bill that keeps coming in the mail has damped his enthusiasm for trashing his betters.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2510

Post by shoutinghorse » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:50 pm

Keating wrote: I think the "anywheres versus somewheres" framing is a big part of the puzzle. I'd definitely be a somewhere, others here are probably anywheres.
You can put me firmly in the 'Somewhere' camp too. .. At 51:10. he says "you don't want a winner takes all Brexit either" Why fucking not, that's how it works. That's like saying we don't want a winner takes all cup final, if our team only win 2-1 we'll let them put the cup in their trophy cabinet. :roll:

Champagne Socialists really are the fucking worst.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2511

Post by some guy » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:23 pm


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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2512

Post by Bhurzum » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:28 pm

shoutinghorse wrote:
Bhurzum wrote: I honestly thought the Arianna Grande (sp?) bombing would have sparked a violent backlash
I'd violently bomb Ariana Grande's back doors in. :drool:
I'd unload my mags all over her kisser. Maybe we could arm-wrestle on her back as we tag-team her? Loser gets the beers in...

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2513

Post by rayshul » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:32 pm

So fun story, they've restricted nationally our ability to access parts of the internet, kiwifarms and the chans in particular. This is nuts.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2514

Post by rayshul » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:41 pm

Voat is also gone

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2515

Post by MarcusAu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:14 pm

Sometimes I think it would be better for the government to do nothing - than to run around like chickens with their heads cut off.


Refreshing my somewhat vague recollection of NZ history - it looks to be the worst mass shooting since the Japanese revolt during WWII at Featherston.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_m ... ew_Zealand

and the highest number of deaths since the 1931 Napier earthquake. (The Mt Erebus disaster happened in Antarctica).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_d ... death_toll


Bizarrely, Ridiculously, Stupid.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2516

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:32 pm

some guy wrote: https..://twitter.com/LydiaBurrell/status/1106608002579206144
“Asked her to explain” <> “blamed”.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2517

Post by shoutinghorse » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:51 pm

Bhurzum wrote:
shoutinghorse wrote:
Bhurzum wrote: I honestly thought the Arianna Grande (sp?) bombing would have sparked a violent backlash
I'd violently bomb Ariana Grande's back doors in. :drool:
I'd unload my mags all over her kisser. Maybe we could arm-wrestle on her back as we tag-team her? Loser gets the beers in...
You're fucking wierd. :?

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2518

Post by Brive1987 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:15 pm

Pool is correct to hang this on accelerationism. And to blame the MSM as witting or unwitting enablers. This could well explain the individuals dynamics and predict the likely outcome.

But Pool is also part of the problem he is describing. Jesus Tim. There is no hot culture war. There aren’t material armies of militant identitarians. We aren’t at the gates of a civil war. “Dramatic escalation” “fracturing of reality” really man?

His terms and imprecise definitions of left and right are infuriating.

There is a significant debate of ideas (intersecting with politics) going on between regressive liberals and the racial right. There are free speech and free gun libertarians circling the fray, off to the other side we have nationalists of various hues vs globalists/post nationalism, a secondary debate is occurring between hard and soft social justice vs social conservatives, in the kitchen we have the new millennial communists slagging the daggy neo-libs.

It’s dickheads like Pool that create a simplistic conspiracy-like, Marvel-esque narrative which the media & tech companies buy into. This time it’s not ZOG, it’s the left-right (whatever the fuck that means) horsemen of the apocalypse riding us down.

Extreme, vanishingly rare, exceptional evil events, not part of a broader trend, do little to define the broader conversations. Ie the conversations engaging the 5% of the population who actually give an either way shit.

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Re: You is all a bunch of poofs!

#2519

Post by Bhurzum » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:19 pm

shoutinghorse wrote:
Bhurzum wrote:
shoutinghorse wrote:
Bhurzum wrote: I honestly thought the Arianna Grande (sp?) bombing would have sparked a violent backlash
I'd violently bomb Ariana Grande's back doors in. :drool:
I'd unload my mags all over her kisser. Maybe we could arm-wrestle on her back as we tag-team her? Loser gets the beers in...
You're fucking wierd. :?
It could be worse - we could do a "Newton's cradle" with her.

(I just made myself sick!)


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