The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5281

VickyCaramel wrote: Does he guess who's who? Does he have an army of spies? Or just call anyone who disagrees with him a slymepitter.

He probably comes here and has a look himself - Occam's razor, and all that. Not that he'd admit it, as it would be akin to a bishop confessing to an interest in The Lesser Key of Solomon, or something.

#5282

That's what Oolon said when he started posting here. Though, to be fair I think you'd actually be missed over at Pharyngula.

#5283

Louis, are you aware of the Pharnygula wiki page that they had up that smeared Phil Giordana?

#5284

http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... pologizes/

Screencap for those who cannot bear to visit the blog:

conlon apologizes.gif: (28.18 KiB) Downloaded 201 times

#5285

Louis wrote:

PZ's a big boy, he can manage his blog his way, just like you (plural/whatever) can manage this place your way. It's no skin off my nose that other people have different standards to mine. PZ's are different to mine. Yours are (likely) different to mine. So? I don't speak for the guy, I don't speak for you, I speak for me.

That's why I'm glad you've decided to join. You pretty much summed up what we've been saying all along.

#5286

Tigzy wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote: Does he guess who's who? Does he have an army of spies? Or just call anyone who disagrees with him a slymepitter.
He probably comes here and has a look himself - Occam's razor, and all that. Not that he'd admit it, as it would be akin to a bishop confessing to an interest in The Lesser Key of Solomon, or something.

[insert armchair psychology here] Yeah, I bet he reads it.

#5287

fascination wrote:Louis, are you aware of the Pharnygula wiki page that they had up that smeared Phil Giordana?

I think I've said it before, but this page was setup by Strange Gods Before Me, not Myers. The fact that he didn't do anything about it pissed me off, as it was endorsed under the "Pharyngula" banner, but now the page is gone, and the only leftovers are on Phawrongula Wiki. Anyway, no harm done, nobody cares enough, and I'm not that important.

#5288

AbsurdWalls wrote:
Apples wrote:Pretty good little shitstorm over at the A+ biased moderators thread -- Julian prolonging his flounce and Wind exposing Flewellen's Lance Armstrongish unwillingness to admit to the forum's cliquey backchannel secret/private threads and chats.

Flewellen: "Seriously, if people here wanted a space to talk privately without having to be scrutinized by the likes of the Slymepit, what would be the harm? Really?"

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic ... start=1350
Shit's blowin' up:
julian wrote: I remember it being something like a nomination process. Someone mentions your name, they see if you've done or said anything problematic. If no one complains, you're added and can view it.

It's (from what remember) nothing sinister. Just a place where people batted around silliness and occasionally something important about their lives they'd rather be kept secret.

Flewellyn wrote:We had something like that for awhile, took it down because it wasn't deemed necessary anymore. We might establish it again if members feel the need.

Do you remember one of the other things being a rule about "Don't divulge details, or even the existence"? Because you just violated that trust.

This has so much potential. I hope A+ delivers again.

#5289

Louis wrote:So if I do come over here and post (which I am exceptionally sure will not get me banned from anywhere on FTB) how long before I'm just the punching bag held responsible for All The Evils (Real and Perceived) Of FTB et al? This all seems a little...unnecessary to me. Granted I'm far from polite about this place and its posters (perhaps wrongly in some instances I admit in advance) because the posters from here I've encountered, admittedly all at Pharyngula (really the only place I bother to post on the web now, due to time constraints etc) haven't really impressed me. Sorry. Hey, I'm sure I won't impress you either! Big whoop.

There is a very wide variety of views here. The people posting on Pharyngula are the ones who want to post there. I think it is unfair to assign guilt to people by association, and for that reason I would never support using a single member from FTB as a punching bag responsible for what goes on there.

Louis wrote:This isn't about sides, I couldn't give less of a shit about all that, it's about reality. I could bang on about whys and wherefores and whatnot but why bother? What do I need to talk to you about here? What is there to talk about?

The question is whether the discussion is as PZ says:

PZ wrote:For instance, the Internet community of atheists is racked with these paroxysms of argument over, of all things, the status of women. Weâ€™re trying to decide whether women are fuck toys and eye candy for the privileged white men, or whether we are colleagues together in this movement. And I would have said some time ago: all thatâ€™s easy, thatâ€™s settled, we know the answer is that they are equal partners in this effort. But surprisingly, that debate is going on on the Internet right now. I guess misogyny is not the sole prerogative of Christian and Islamic fundamentalists. There are also some atheists that feel this way.

If you accept that (which I don't think you do) then you probably won't get much out of this place. If you think the discussion in reality is more nuanced than that then you're in the right place. In my experience this isn't about the status of women, or non-white people, or non-straight people. It is about what a particular clique is getting up to with that claimed motivation.

#5290

Louis wrote:And yes, your newest member, albeit until I get bored which could be quite rapidly, is the Louis from Pharyngula that Metalogic42 quoted. I seriously doubt anyone has a real problem with that. Maybe I'm wrong about that too. So what's it to be?

Louis

BTW.... I do not have an issue and speaking for myself, and only myself seeing as I am a minority (the number of real life actual MRAs here can be counted on the fingers of one hand), I really have no problem hanging out here or with you.

After all with the exception of the MRAs most of the men here are "brother punishers" and "chill boys" who seek female approval, and are completely subservient to the Matriarchy if not actively supporting the Gynocracy wot control the vagina supply and serve as their lackeys and oppressors in keeping all men everywhere suffering under the jackboots of the Feminazis.

So I guess if I can tolerate them I can tolerate you.

#5291

@VickyCaramel

Ah, but I forget - he's admitted to having a read here once, and unsurprisingly enough, he was less than impressed. He got particularly cross at a pic of a fat woman being sick that was posted here. Just think - if he comes here today, he'll have a pic of your buzzums to be cross at, too.

#5292

(Ophelia has posted JTC's apology on her blog. Literally the next post is her making a teenage girl's suicide all about her.)

#5293

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
fascination wrote:Louis, are you aware of the Pharnygula wiki page that they had up that smeared Phil Giordana?
I think I've said it before, but this page was setup by Strange Gods Before Me, not Myers. The fact that he didn't do anything about it pissed me off, as it was endorsed under the "Pharyngula" banner, but now the page is gone, and the only leftovers are on Phawrongula Wiki. Anyway, no harm done, nobody cares enough, and I'm not that important.

I know Phil but Myers approves everything that goes onto that Wiki. That page was a disgrace hon. I'm glad that it didn't do any real damage to you though. It definitely had the potential to.

#5294

Louis (http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic ... 937#p51937) said:

I'd really be very, very surprised if PZ banned me for a handful of posts here. He just isn't that sort of person....

Well, that largely points to either a myopic personal bias in favour of PeeZus or, more likely, a fairly major lack of awareness of PeeZus's actual actions.

PeeZus has enDungeonated several people who post here; people who never even posted at Pharyngula or, so far as I am aware, any other FfTB blog. His reasons for doing so, and he stated it as such, were because by posting at the Pyt, regardless of what the post content was, they proved themselves to be sexist, misogynist, anti-feminist MRA assholes who are actual Marc Lepine style mass murderers-in-waiting.

How you missed that is rather beyond me.

#5295

Tigzy wrote:@VickyCaramel

Ah, but I forget - he's admitted to having a read here once, and unsurprisingly enough, he was less than impressed. He got particularly cross at a pic of a fat woman being sick that was posted here. Just think - if he comes here today, he'll have a pic of your buzzums to be cross at, too.

Got to say I was absolutely furious at those tits.

Fucking livid.

#5296

VickyCaramel wrote:
[spoiler]
cunt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:Excuse my guys, I think I might be lost.

I heard that you chaps were responsible for all the evil in the world. Could somebody please direct me to the threads where you plot your diabolical schemes?
Sure, first you have to post me your tits via PM. I will judge them, and make a decision to divulge the secret password. Good luck.
http://www.picpaste.com/extpics/tits-niuKWP8C.jpg[/spoiler]There ya go!

*spew*

Fucken hell! No fool like an old fool! Fucking coffee all over the fucken laptop! FUCK!

#5297

AbsurdWalls wrote:(Ophelia has posted JTC's apology on her blog. Literally the next post is her making a teenage girl's suicide all about her.)

I posted a screencap for those who do not wish to visit OB's blog

viewtopic.php?p=51942#p51942

#5298

Phil: New snake? I has an envy! I want another snake, but sadly it will not be for a while. Constrictors (my preferred terrarium occupants) and 3 year old kids go together like...well a large snake and lunch. Good luck for the wedding stuff. I thought it was last year? Best laid plans, eh?

Metalogic42: Hi! Cheers for the welcome. No punching bag? But how will I get my Victim Points? {Sigh} I guess I'll have to settle for conversation. I'll refrain from calling you any kind of annoyed anal ape until so proven to my satisfaction. Fair? ;-)

As for the other FTB posters coming here, why would they? What they, we, see isn't massively inspiring. I'm not trolling you guys, hell, why would I bother? I think I would be out-trolled in a second anyway. That's actually a compliment btw! I just like to test out my own preconceptions. Maybe I'm feeling silly this evening. No idea. Let's see how it turns out.

Second: what is there to talk about? Pretty much whatever you want. Do you think words like "cunt" shouldn't be used as insults? Do you think PZ's deleting tactics are ok? Do you think rape culture exists? Pick something, and I'll tell you what I think, and then you can respond.

I'm familiar with the process! The "cunt" thing and the "rape culture" thing are relatively huge topics in a way. I'll discuss anything, but just like when someone identified with this place wanders into Pharyngula, I appreciate I might end up being the lone voice replying to myriad posters, and that's just time consuming. Not something I have a lot of. Let's just say reading a few pages and posting here is an experiment. Again, not a criticism, but my days of enthusiastically being the only atheist on a christian message board looking for a serious discussion (i.e. not trolling) are long over. My days of being the lone atheist trolling a christian message board never really happened, and are even longer over for the tiny time they did. Who knows, maybe my SIWOTI syndrome will kick in and I'll never stop being a pain in the arse.

The PZ deleting tactics, not sure what you're referring to, so whether it's okay or not I can't say, but it strikes me that this is one of those free speech areas that might be worth chatting about. It's probably the least likely to inflame the passions! I hope! ;-)

#5299

VickyCaramel wrote:If chill girls are allowed in the rape forum, count me in.

When you get in, can you ask them if broken down Scotsmen* are allowed in too?

Cheers!

*I wear a kilt and would be very easy to rape.

#5300

Godfuckindammit.
I disappear for 2 days and you rapey assholes have like a gazillion pages to go through. Somebody give me the cliffnotes, cause I ain't doing Slymepit 101 to get up to speed.

#5301

another lurker wrote:http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... pologizes/

Screencap for those who cannot bear to visit the blog:

conlon apologizes.gif

Everyone meaning everyone else but her and those who agree with her. Fostering hatred and rage against the pit, Vacula, Shermer, etc... that's all acceptable. what a hypocrite. You want to stop fostering hatred, start with your own behavior before judging others.

#5302

Loving Abbie's talk. Viruses, Viruses everywhere.

Also, as has been mentioned before: just because a bloke said something, it doesn't mean you said it. Because we're not a political party. Just a pub of completely unlikeminded folks.

Hello Louis and any other new folk. Hi Jerry if you're here too.

I'm going to the zoo today! YEY!

#5303

ERV wrote:What is this I dont even

[youtube]4c1ftt-TV6Q[/youtube]

Great talk, even though Im also a grad student in your field I learned something new - that the name "virophage" is highly misleading.

#5304

another lurker wrote:
AbsurdWalls wrote:(Ophelia has posted JTC's apology on her blog. Literally the next post is her making a teenage girl's suicide all about her.)
I posted a screencap for those who do not wish to visit OB's blog

viewtopic.php?p=51942#p51942

If Pruney's looking for an incitement to suicide to add to the bag, I can point her in the direction of Wowbagger 'Seriously, I want you to die in a fire' OM...

#5305

VickyCaramel wrote:
cunt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:Excuse my guys, I think I might be lost.

I heard that you chaps were responsible for all the evil in the world. Could somebody please direct me to the threads where you plot your diabolical schemes?
Sure, first you have to post me your tits via PM. I will judge them, and make a decision to divulge the secret password. Good luck.
http://www.picpaste.com/extpics/tits-niuKWP8C.jpg
There ya go!

These are very nice and I have duly rated the cleavage as top-notch. I will need to see the underside of the breasts and a glimpse of the nipples before letting go of our top-secret pass. At the moment, you are a very impressive candidate. PM me.

#5306

Here it is...the first ever, shall we say, initiative to send Slymepitters to atheist/skeptic conferences! Thanks to help (and the idea) from Damion Reinhardt, a fundraiser has been launched to help send me to Women in Secularism 2.

Donors who reach certain levels will receive certain goods including twitter shoutouts, facebook mentions, signed conference swag, exclusive Karla Porter handcrafted necklaces, exclusive interviews with me, and your conference-appropriate t-shirt of choice for me to wear on conference days.

20 percent of donations to this initiative will be sent to Operation Smile in honor of The Slymepit and Renee Hendricks.

Please share this initiative through blogs, websites, social media, etc. to help make this happen!

Youtube:

[youtube]Ek9i7GEsjeU[/youtube]

Direct links to the fundraiser's page:

http://www.rockethub.com/projects/13633 ... cularism-2

http://www.tinyurl.com/FundJustin

Blog post on this:

http://skepticink.com/justinvacula/2013 ... ularism-2/

Help make this happen...and thanks in advance for donations/shares/mirrors/promotion :)

I'll also start a new thread in addition to this post.

#5307

I'm trying to get my head around OB's "Why won't you leave me alone?" recent posts. Should say for myself that I've only ever interacted with her the once, but looking at it as her stance towards the 'pit as a whole, I have some thoughts and questions to share:

1. Does she leave us alone when she calls people who disagree with her Slymepitters, regardless of who they are?
2. Was she leaving us alone by suggesting in the first place that we were going to end up throwing acid at her?
3. Was she leaving Justin Vacula alone when she went on his Facebook page to interact with him?
4. Are tweets that mention her coming from accounts she has blocked reasonably not directed a her?
5. Are the people who won't leave her alone actually her allies who dig up this stuff to send to her?
6. Does she want to be left alone? Or does she do these things to provoke a reaction?
7. Could she be left alone whilst still allowing people to respond to her output in the space of ideas?
8. If not, is her output really worth responding to?
9. Can OB be safely ignored?
10. Is it possible to organise for OB not to feel harassed by the Slymepit?
11. Even when she thinks any low-profile opposition to her views comes from here?

#5308

Louis, you wouldn't be a "lone voice" as much as you might think. There is quite a bit of disagreement here on the Pit. Steersman does it all of the time :) .

#5309

codelette wrote:Godfuckindammit.
I disappear for 2 days and you rapey assholes have like a gazillion pages to go through. Somebody give me the cliffnotes, cause I ain't doing Slymepit 101 to get up to speed.

Current drama:

A+ forum is going balls up as more moderators and members throw their toys out of the pram.
It's a beautiful fucking thing.

OB compares internet haterz to getting acid thrown in her face.
Bloke (occasional pitter) tells her she should get acid thrown in her face, and also recommends a forceful facial.
OB uses this to demonstrate how evil the pit is, despite the fact it has already been established the pit is the root of all evil, also the patriarchy.

The 'pit gets more members who comment that the 'pit is not as evil as it seems from the outside.
Silly people know nothing of our secret backchannel that we just can't stop talking about, where we plot the real evil.
Also, this is where we keep our patriarchy machine.

ERV talks about viruses at FREEOK, and scares the fucking fuck out of me with phrases like killer flu.

#5310

Cunt,

1) I don't really care about the word "cunt" by the way. I care how it is used, sure, I don't agree with it's use as an insult (for various reasons), but I am not some shrinking violet. But nice try with the name. Funny. Briefly.

2) If you want me to get into which Pharyngula posters I think are great and which I think are not great and for what reasons, sorry but no dice. Like I said, the interblog dramatics just piss me off, I'm so uninterested my balls ache even thinking about it. I will say that there are a large number of people over there that, as I have got to know them, I rather like. I'm not surprised by that. I imagine that many of you are perfectly personable human beings. All the chest beating and tribal politics makes me yawn.

3) Whether or not I'll be missed at Pharyngula, I don't intend to be. Most of the time I like it over there.

#5311

fascination wrote:Louis, you wouldn't be a "lone voice" as much as you might think. There is quite a bit of disagreement here on the Pit. Steersman does it all of the time :) .

Yeah, about 50% of the 'pit is people arguing with each other. It's awesome.

#5312

cunt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
cunt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:Excuse my guys, I think I might be lost.

I heard that you chaps were responsible for all the evil in the world. Could somebody please direct me to the threads where you plot your diabolical schemes?
Sure, first you have to post me your tits via PM. I will judge them, and make a decision to divulge the secret password. Good luck.
http://www.picpaste.com/extpics/tits-niuKWP8C.jpg
There ya go!
These are very nice and I have duly rated the cleavage as top-notch. I will need to see the underside of the breasts and a glimpse of the nipples before letting go of our top-secret pass. At the moment, you are a very impressive candidate. PM me.

I'm sure if you hunt around on the web, you will be able to find what you seek.

Luckily, nobody can stay mad at my bewbage for long. Seems I have already upset PZ and destroyed a lap top, so I think i had better draw a beaded line under this.

#5313

codelette wrote:Godfuckindammit.
I disappear for 2 days and you rapey assholes have like a gazillion pages to go through. Somebody give me the cliffnotes, cause I ain't doing Slymepit 101 to get up to speed.

I'm a bit behind myself but:
1)Ophelia Benson wrote a blogpost which compared an acid attack on a male victim to her ongoing plight with people disagreeing with her online (she said at the end of the acid attack post "maybe I should start wearing protection?")
2)Some bloke called Jerry Conlon, who has posted here about 10 times since November and is therefore considered a pitter, responded to her on twitter with "you deserve an acid attack" (or words to that effect), got called out for it on here and gave Ophelia much vindication.
3)The slymepit officially declared me the greatest person ever since the Ultimate Warrior from WWF.

#5314

fascination wrote:Louis, are you aware of the Pharnygula wiki page that they had up that smeared Phil Giordana?

Yup. I said it was disgusting at the time, I think it was disgusting now. That sort of shit doesn't belong anywhere. I only wish (and apologies Phil) that I'd been louder and more people had been loud about it too. It was unambiguously an arsehole act. Whether or not PZ endorsed it (I don't know) or tacitly endorsed it by knowing and saying nothing (I don't know about that either), I think it was the wrong thing to do.

#5315

Louis wrote:Hi Metalogic42 and Phil,

So if I do come over here and post (which I am exceptionally sure will not get me banned from anywhere on FTB) how long before I'm just the punching bag held responsible for All The Evils (Real and Perceived) Of FTB et al? This all seems a little...unnecessary to me. Granted I'm far from polite about this place and its posters (perhaps wrongly in some instances I admit in advance) because the posters from here I've encountered, admittedly all at Pharyngula (really the only place I bother to post on the web now, due to time constraints etc) haven't really impressed me. Sorry. Hey, I'm sure I won't impress you either! Big whoop.

This isn't about sides, I couldn't give less of a shit about all that, it's about reality. I could bang on about whys and wherefores and whatnot but why bother? What do I need to talk to you about here? What is there to talk about?

And yes, your newest member, albeit until I get bored which could be quite rapidly, is the Louis from Pharyngula that Metalogic42 quoted. I seriously doubt anyone has a real problem with that. Maybe I'm wrong about that too. So what's it to be?

Louis

Hello Louis, you won't remember me, I obviously never posted at FTB under this stupid nym, and I was never a huge commenter there either so you probably don't remember my old nym from there. But I used to be a regular there going way back to before FTB.

I remember you posted once in one of the endless threads about how your wife was ignored by the realtor when you were looking for a house, and she really wanted to tell him to shove it up his ass, but you had both decided that the deal on the house was too good and you were going to have to bite your lip. I was tempted to respond with something like there being a big gray area between sucking it up and flouncing out of the office and losing out on the deal - like your wife saying, "excuse me, do you mind not ignoring me?" or words to that effect. But, I didn't, because I was certain I would have got shat on by the commentariat for mansplaining (via you) to your wife. In the scheme of things this is very small potatoes but it exemplifies how I felt about the place: a little intimidated.

I agree with much of the general "leanings" of the FTB blog crew on question of feminism and social justice. But that's not good enough over there. You have to be on board with every single detail of the fine print. You have to dot every "i" and cross every "t" in the right place. They say you don't but it just isn't true.

I felt one little "i" did not need a dot on it and said so, and I was immediately piled on by others and shunned regarding a meatspace event I was going to (I don't want to give more details). There's no nuance over there. You're either with the Horde on everything or you're a bad person. Now... that might be slightly less the case for those in the inner circle of the Horde, of which you are clearly one. You will probably get mild criticism for coming here but you won't get told to do things with porcupines. Still, they just think they are right about every single fucking thing and do not brook disagreement.

So that's why I'm here. Serious comment over. Back to being an idiot. (Sorry, that's ABLEIST :dance: )

#5316

Louis: I think people here would like to have some insight of what the hell is going on WRT the Pit over there. Don't you think there are a lot of exagerations and misrepresentations (sexists, misogynists, rape apologists...etc) from there and other places? BTW, out of the 5 posts before I hit 'submit', 4 were by women.

#5317

Tony Parsehole wrote:
codelette wrote:Godfuckindammit.
I disappear for 2 days and you rapey assholes have like a gazillion pages to go through. Somebody give me the cliffnotes, cause I ain't doing Slymepit 101 to get up to speed.
I'm a bit behind myself but:
1)Ophelia Benson wrote a blogpost which compared an acid attack on a male victim to her ongoing plight with people disagreeing with her online (she said at the end of the acid attack post "maybe I should start wearing protection?")
2)Some bloke called Jerry Conlon, who has posted here about 10 times since November and is therefore considered a pitter, responded to her on twitter with "you deserve an acid attack" (or words to that effect), got called out for it on here and gave Ophelia much vindication.
3)The slymepit officially declared me the greatest person ever since the Ultimate Warrior from WWF.

Codelette, did you see the video that was posted where DPR Jones finally gives his opinion Watson/Elevatorgate (basically the whole drama for the past year and a half)? DPR had some very interesting comments and they were not flattering to Watson, to say the least.

#5318

AbsurdWalls wrote:
<snip>

The question is whether the discussion is as PZ says:

PZ wrote:For instance, the Internet community of atheists is racked with these paroxysms of argument over, of all things, the status of women. Weâ€™re trying to decide whether women are fuck toys and eye candy for the privileged white men, or whether we are colleagues together in this movement. And I would have said some time ago: all thatâ€™s easy, thatâ€™s settled, we know the answer is that they are equal partners in this effort. But surprisingly, that debate is going on on the Internet right now. I guess misogyny is not the sole prerogative of Christian and Islamic fundamentalists. There are also some atheists that feel this way.
If you accept that (which I don't think you do) then you probably won't get much out of this place. If you think the discussion in reality is more nuanced than that then you're in the right place. In my experience this isn't about the status of women, or non-white people, or non-straight people. It is about what a particular clique is getting up to with that claimed motivation.

Is PZ's summary the whole situation in my opinion? No. But I think it is remarkably accurate for some of the "opposed groups". So yes, to a very large degree I do accept that. I know PZ would be perfectly happy to admit there's vast degrees more nuance to the situation too, based on conversations with him. Although that said, I don't really want to get into the role of "PZ Defender" (or anyone defender), not because I don't agree with him on some things and not others, but because I think it plays too easily into the Us vs Them Bloggery Bollocks that annoys me.

Expand on your "clique" comment a bit for me please. I'm not sure what you mean precisely.

#5319

Can somebody please pass Louis the crab juice? It may help neutralize the kool aid.

#5320

Louis wrote:Metalogic42: Hi! Cheers for the welcome. No punching bag? But how will I get my Victim Points? {Sigh} I guess I'll have to settle for conversation. I'll refrain from calling you any kind of annoyed anal ape until so proven to my satisfaction. Fair? ;-)

As for the other FTB posters coming here, why would they? What they, we, see isn't massively inspiring. I'm not trolling you guys, hell, why would I bother? I think I would be out-trolled in a second anyway. That's actually a compliment btw! I just like to test out my own preconceptions. Maybe I'm feeling silly this evening. No idea. Let's see how it turns out.

What many FTB commentors see is often completely made up. Case in point, the recent acid-throwing brouhaha. You can't believe anything PZ or OB say about us, because they hate us collectively. For them, it's not about what each individual person here is saying, it's what the slymepit as a concept is saying. Except, the slymepit doesn't say anything. Only its members do.

If FTB commentors would actually come here more often, and be uninspired by what each individual (as opposed to the nonexistent collective) is saying, that's fine. For a good example of what I mean, check one of my posts from earlier today, where I quoted several FTB comments individually, and responded to each. Does PZ ever quote slymepit comments like this? No, he just vaguely alludes to something the ephemeral slymepit collective said.

The PZ deleting tactics, not sure what you're referring to, so whether it's okay or not I can't say, but it strikes me that this is one of those free speech areas that might be worth chatting about. It's probably the least likely to inflame the passions! I hope! ;-)

Well, it's not even about the deleting per se. Rather, it's that he never engages with criticism, anywhere. If he was prone to come here and address criticisms, then his strict moderation on his own blog would be fine. That's not how one does proper skepticism.

#5321

fascination wrote:
Tony Parsehole wrote:
codelette wrote:Godfuckindammit.
I disappear for 2 days and you rapey assholes have like a gazillion pages to go through. Somebody give me the cliffnotes, cause I ain't doing Slymepit 101 to get up to speed.
I'm a bit behind myself but:
1)Ophelia Benson wrote a blogpost which compared an acid attack on a male victim to her ongoing plight with people disagreeing with her online (she said at the end of the acid attack post "maybe I should start wearing protection?")
2)Some bloke called Jerry Conlon, who has posted here about 10 times since November and is therefore considered a pitter, responded to her on twitter with "you deserve an acid attack" (or words to that effect), got called out for it on here and gave Ophelia much vindication.
3)The slymepit officially declared me the greatest person ever since the Ultimate Warrior from WWF.
Codelette, did you see the video that was posted where DPR Jones finally gives his opinion Watson/Elevatorgate (basically the whole drama for the past year and a half)? DPR had some very interesting comments and they were not flattering to Watson, to say the least.

Oh yeah, and that. Definitely worth a look.

#5322

rayshul wrote:The 'pit gets more members who comment that the 'pit is not as evil as it seems from the outside.

Technically referred to as evilness transcendence, an unusual fact of some communities on the net is that no matter how evil it is portrayed by others on the outside, on the inside it can be a pretty darn ethical place to communicate. Walk into what was portrayed as Sauron's lair and you're in a plane of sanity that dwarfs any feminist safe space.

[youtube]4_nO8LSqTsY[/youtube]

#5323

KarlVonMox wrote:
ERV wrote:What is this I dont even

[youtube]4c1ftt-TV6Q[/youtube]
Great talk, even though Im also a grad student in your field I learned something new - that the name "virophage" is highly misleading.

Very nice virus -apologist post. Watched the whole thing and now I'm dehydrated. Also disappointed at Abbie being part of the government plot to deny us the Zombie Apocalypse.

I remember way back when I was fascinated by the Bacteriopage T-4, which looks like a demented little lunar lander. Not just because of it's aesthetics, but the question of instrumentalism...If you think of an atom you probably get a completely functional but inaccurate image of a planetary model, or maybe some fuzzy valence shell stuff. We do that all the time.

The problem is when we start thinking of our representation as the thing itself.

http://living-in-washingtondc.com/image ... -small.jpg

Washington DC really isn't laid out like this.

As a visual person I was intrigued by the representations vs. what it "actually" looked like.

Was it actually this regular?

http://www.bacteriophagetherapy.info/EC ... -Solo1.jpg

Or was it a sloppy little thing like this:

http://www.dform.com/projects/t4/gif/t4.gif

And then better imagining:

http://www.zyvexlabs.com/EIPBNuG/EIPBN% ... /05Ion.jpg

Maybe you have to be obsessed with "what things really are like" as I am, but it struck me that the purely schematic representations made us miss something or forced the territory to look like the map.

Just one of my little obsessions. Edward Tufte would be proud.

#5324

Metalogic42 wrote:
Louis wrote:Metalogic42: Hi! Cheers for the welcome. No punching bag? But how will I get my Victim Points? {Sigh} I guess I'll have to settle for conversation. I'll refrain from calling you any kind of annoyed anal ape until so proven to my satisfaction. Fair? ;-)

As for the other FTB posters coming here, why would they? What they, we, see isn't massively inspiring. I'm not trolling you guys, hell, why would I bother? I think I would be out-trolled in a second anyway. That's actually a compliment btw! I just like to test out my own preconceptions. Maybe I'm feeling silly this evening. No idea. Let's see how it turns out.
What many FTB commentors see is often completely made up. Case in point, the recent acid-throwing brouhaha. You can't believe anything PZ or OB say about us, because they hate us collectively. For them, it's not about what each individual person here is saying, it's what the slymepit as a concept is saying. Except, the slymepit doesn't say anything. Only its members do.

Preaching to the choir, I guess. That's mostly the point Louis made in something I quoted a few posts above. He understands it. Others may not, and that's probably none of his bloody business.

#5325

rayshul wrote: Current drama:
A+ forum is going balls up as more moderators and members throw their toys out of the pram.

That undersells what's going on as "business as usual".

In detail: somebody has let slip to Wind that there is a secret forum where everybody actually posts (wondering why it was so dead?). In that space apparently people are less... careful than they are in the open space. The implication is that's where all the real discussion happens, including deciding who gets shunned, who gets dogpiled etc. Obviously you would be forgiven for thinking there could be no such organisation involved in running A+ considering their conduct so far, but there you go.

The response to this was initially denial. Then a couple of people let slip that it was true. Denial and admission overlapped for a while, but they settled on admitting it happened and then pumping Wind to find out who his source was by trying to butter him up (saying he was being manipulated into hurting the forum). Rightly, they are concerned that their EVEN-SAFER space has been infiltrated by somebody who doesn't like A+, which is completely un-fucking-surprising when you consider that is ALWAYS what happens with secret places like that. People who posted compromising personal details on there are no-doubt shitting bricks at the idea that this guy is going to release it (to clarify my own stance: that would be a pretty horrible thing to do).

Unfortunately for them, Wind's response was to deny his source. The people there KNOW he must have a source, but can't get it out of him. I wouldn't be surprised if they crack into the forum to find out (Wind and his source were dumb enough to converse by PM).

If you think I'm enjoying this too much, I've given my reason before. The people who run the A+ forum are bullies. The existence of that place hurts the innocent people that sign up. I want it to have a reputation for being the hostile place it is, because at the moment it advertises itself to abuse survivors and it is not suitable for them.

#5326

Louis wrote:Cunt,

1) I don't really care about the word "cunt" by the way. I care how it is used, sure, I don't agree with it's use as an insult (for various reasons), but I am not some shrinking violet. But nice try with the name. Funny. Briefly.

2) If you want me to get into which Pharyngula posters I think are great and which I think are not great and for what reasons, sorry but no dice. Like I said, the interblog dramatics just piss me off, I'm so uninterested my balls ache even thinking about it. I will say that there are a large number of people over there that, as I have got to know them, I rather like. I'm not surprised by that. I imagine that many of you are perfectly personable human beings. All the chest beating and tribal politics makes me yawn.

3) Whether or not I'll be missed at Pharyngula, I don't intend to be. Most of the time I like it over there.

Damn, I really thought it would blow your tiny minds... What a fail. Tribal politics make me yawn too, this is why these people don't come under criticism for the crime of posting on the wrong side.

Obviously though you have some other point to make or you wouldn't be here. Don't keep us guessing. I'm taking your avoidance of the Nerd question as a "yes".

#5327

Mykeru wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
Actually been lurking for a long, long time. Thought I should join the roll call. Numbers matter.
And "taking back" the term "Chill Girl" should annoy them no end. If you can co-opt "sister punisher" too, then you've really got something.

I suddenly had this picture in my head of a buxom female pitter showing with the words "chill girl" emblazened on a slightly too tight white t-shirt. I watch too much porn.

#5328

Tony Parsehole wrote:
codelette wrote:Godfuckindammit.
I disappear for 2 days and you rapey assholes have like a gazillion pages to go through. Somebody give me the cliffnotes, cause I ain't doing Slymepit 101 to get up to speed.
I'm a bit behind myself but:
1)Ophelia Benson wrote a blogpost which compared an acid attack on a male victim to her ongoing plight with people disagreeing with her online (she said at the end of the acid attack post "maybe I should start wearing protection?")
2)Some bloke called Jerry Conlon, who has posted here about 10 times since November and is therefore considered a pitter, responded to her on twitter with "you deserve an acid attack" (or words to that effect), got called out for it on here and gave Ophelia much vindication.
3)The slymepit officially declared me the greatest person ever since the Ultimate Warrior from WWF.

And I reaffirm your title. Thanks for the cliffnotes!
[youtube]E-WHW-QNswE[/youtube]

#5329

Louis wrote:
fascination wrote:Louis, are you aware of the Pharnygula wiki page that they had up that smeared Phil Giordana?
Yup. I said it was disgusting at the time, I think it was disgusting now. That sort of shit doesn't belong anywhere. I only wish (and apologies Phil) that I'd been louder and more people had been loud about it too. It was unambiguously an arsehole act. Whether or not PZ endorsed it (I don't know) or tacitly endorsed it by knowing and saying nothing (I don't know about that either), I think it was the wrong thing to do.

Thank you for answering. I appreciate that you stood up at the time and said something. I know that it must have been uncomfortable. As far as I know, Myers was aware and he has to approve what they put up on that Wiki. That is not the only example of FTB smearing someone but i used that one because you know Phil. They are known for this kind of crap.
Anyway, you seem like a nice guy Louis and I hope you stay at the Pit for awhile!

#5330

fascination wrote: Codelette, did you see the video that was posted where DPR Jones finally gives his opinion Watson/Elevatorgate (basically the whole drama for the past year and a half)? DPR had some very interesting comments and they were not flattering to Watson, to say the least.

Nope. Who is DPR Jones? Post a link to the video, please.

#5331

AbsurdWalls wrote:
rayshul wrote: Current drama:
A+ forum is going balls up as more moderators and members throw their toys out of the pram.
That undersells what's going on as "business as usual".

In detail: somebody has let slip to Wind that there is a secret forum where everybody actually posts (wondering why it was so dead?). In that space apparently people are less... careful than they are in the open space. The implication is that's where all the real discussion happens, including deciding who gets shunned, who gets dogpiled etc. Obviously you would be forgiven for thinking there could be no such organisation involved in running A+ considering their conduct so far, but there you go.

The response to this was initially denial. Then a couple of people let slip that it was true. Denial and admission overlapped for a while, but they settled on admitting it happened and then pumping Wind to find out who his source was by trying to butter him up (saying he was being manipulated into hurting the forum). Rightly, they are concerned that their EVEN-SAFER space has been infiltrated by somebody who doesn't like A+, which is completely un-fucking-surprising when you consider that is ALWAYS what happens with secret places like that. People who posted compromising personal details on there are no-doubt shitting bricks at the idea that this guy is going to release it (to clarify my own stance: that would be a pretty horrible thing to do).

Unfortunately for them, Wind's response was to deny his source. The people there KNOW he must have a source, but can't get it out of him. I wouldn't be surprised if they crack into the forum to find out (Wind and his source were dumb enough to converse by PM).

If you think I'm enjoying this too much, I've given my reason before. The people who run the A+ forum are bullies. The existence of that place hurts the innocent people that sign up. I want it to have a reputation for being the hostile place it is, because at the moment it advertises itself to abuse survivors and it is not suitable for them.

I just think it's fuckin funny that a forum which prides itself on being against so many societal stratifications - class, race, gender, privilege, and so on - has conned itself into being utterly stratified, with its secret forum for 'more trustworthy' members. :lol:

#5332

AbsurdWalls wrote:
If you think I'm enjoying this too much, I've given my reason before. The people who run the A+ forum are bullies. The existence of that place hurts the innocent people that sign up. I want it to have a reputation for being the hostile place it is, because at the moment it advertises itself to abuse survivors and it is not suitable for them.

No, not too much by a long shot. The people running the FTB/A+/SCK/CFI cons are, without exception predatory bullies. They don't advertise that way. They do People's Republic stuff like advertising themselves as for "free inquiry", "equality" and "social justice" and appeal to damaged people with their "safe space" horseshit.

They fucking groom damaged people. Then they beat the living shit out of damaged people.

As someone who has been around social services working for Head Start and with people at Child Protective Services and knows abuse survivors and has been touched by violence myself, lost friends to it, it's the last place a person who is vulnerable should go for support.

No nice way to say it: P.Z. Meyers, Ophelia Benson, Rebecca Watson, Melody Hensley are predators, the fucking lot of them.

#5333

Damn, that "hidden thread" conversation at A+ is awesome :popcorn:

#5334

So a few months ago I was actually having a pleasant conversation on youtube PMs with a feminist person. She wanted to know about flaming porcupines and rusty knives. Unfortunately all those old Pharyngula threads had all the comments removed. I wonder what Louis thinks of such remarks and thinks about the deletion a year later of such remarks. Is it to simply deny it happened at all? Do other current FTBers know about how hostile the old Sb (science blogs) Pharyngula crowd was to people? Btw, that realtor story sounds familiar. I think I read that in one of those old deleted threads I posted on.

#5335

comslave wrote:
Mykeru wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
Actually been lurking for a long, long time. Thought I should join the roll call. Numbers matter.
And "taking back" the term "Chill Girl" should annoy them no end. If you can co-opt "sister punisher" too, then you've really got something.
I suddenly had this picture in my head of a buxom female pitter showing with the words "chill girl" emblazened on a slightly too tight white t-shirt. I watch too much porn.

Vicky, there's your cue.

#5336

I am loving the "secret forum" discussion on A+ at the minute. It's absolute gold.
Thanks for the heads up everybody.
http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic ... start=1350

#5337

fascination wrote:
Tony Parsehole wrote:
codelette wrote:Godfuckindammit.
I disappear for 2 days and you rapey assholes have like a gazillion pages to go through. Somebody give me the cliffnotes, cause I ain't doing Slymepit 101 to get up to speed.
I'm a bit behind myself but:
1)Ophelia Benson wrote a blogpost which compared an acid attack on a male victim to her ongoing plight with people disagreeing with her online (she said at the end of the acid attack post "maybe I should start wearing protection?")
2)Some bloke called Jerry Conlon, who has posted here about 10 times since November and is therefore considered a pitter, responded to her on twitter with "you deserve an acid attack" (or words to that effect), got called out for it on here and gave Ophelia much vindication.
3)The slymepit officially declared me the greatest person ever since the Ultimate Warrior from WWF.
Codelette, did you see the video that was posted where DPR Jones finally gives his opinion Watson/Elevatorgate (basically the whole drama for the past year and a half)? DPR had some very interesting comments and they were not flattering to Watson, to say the least.

Here's the DPRJones video for anyone who hasn't seen it.

[youtube]lX7GcUrDCMY[/youtube]

#5338

Cunning Punt,

Pharyngula IS intimidating. Deliberately. This is a feature, not a bug. It's not for everyone. Just like I don't necessarily want to post at Place X because their environment doesn't suit me (for example I'd be fucked if there were a no swearing policy. I loves me a swear I do), I don't expect that Pharyngula gets everyone's juices flowing either. Why would I? Different strokes for different folks. It's not wrong to like or dislike the posting environment there, it just is a matter of personal preference.

As for the "you have to dot every i and cross every t" thing, again I disagree. Yes there are intemperate people who will jump on any error, I'm occasionally one of them if I've had a bad day and want to spread the joy around! ;-) But there is more nuance there than you suspect. What there isn't, at this current time (and this has been the case for a while now) is a lot of tolerance for leading people through the basics on certain subjects. It's not about disagreement, it's about having to explain the same damned thing a million times to a large number of rather clueless shitheads. I'm not including you, or specifically anyone, in that category by the way. I'll explain.

We've all dealt with creationists, right? We've all had to give them "science 101 for abominable shitheads", we've all referred them to the Index of Creationist Claims, perhaps by page number. Creationist claims are so familiar as to be painful, there's not a lot of change because they tend to rest on a few foundational misunderstandings or lies about things people commonly misunderstand. I hate to say it, because I am possibly putting myself in the position of Feminism Defender (and I really can't be arsed at the moment), but the social sciences, of which feminism is a part, are also worthy of academic study. There are facts, theories, details that need to be understood. Caricaturing it as random ideology is lazy and untrue.

For the last 2 or 3 years there has been an uptick in certain...let's say...phenomena. The number and unpleasantness of various species of sexists crawling out of the woodwork has increased. Some people, rightly or wrongly, are pissed off about leading every one of those people by the hand through the basics. They long, instead for a space where they can discuss things at a slightly less basic level without hand holding and where they can also discuss things that intersect with those things. It's that simple. A group of perfectly normal human beings wanting a place to converse about stuff that interests them without 99% of the bullshit that that seems to attract.

Oh and I'm not with the Horde on everything. No one in the Horde is with the Horde on everything. You might not have seen that, but I have. Quite a bit.

#5339

VickyCaramel wrote:
cunt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
cunt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:Excuse my guys, I think I might be lost.

I heard that you chaps were responsible for all the evil in the world. Could somebody please direct me to the threads where you plot your diabolical schemes?
Sure, first you have to post me your tits via PM. I will judge them, and make a decision to divulge the secret password. Good luck.
http://www.picpaste.com/extpics/tits-niuKWP8C.jpg
There ya go!
These are very nice and I have duly rated the cleavage as top-notch. I will need to see the underside of the breasts and a glimpse of the nipples before letting go of our top-secret pass. At the moment, you are a very impressive candidate. PM me.
I'm sure if you hunt around on the web, you will be able to find what you seek.

Luckily, nobody can stay mad at my bewbage for long. Seems I have already upset PZ and destroyed a lap top, so I think i had better draw a beaded line under this.

It's not.... you're not... no.. it can't be.... The Trophy Wifeâ„¢? Have you come here too?

#5340

Yep, good on you Louis for not buying into the ridiculous 'visiting/posting on a particular forum makes you a bad person' idea.

It was always just a cheap way of dismissing opposition anyway. I think people are wising up to that fact more and more.