Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

[Zenspace]

Jeezus H. Fuckin' Christ!

Go out into the real world for a couple of days to get stuff done and the whole frackin' world goes to hell in a handbasket. As usual, it looks like you cretins didn't miss a beat either. Bugger, over 10 pages to catch up on and barely a boring post in the lot. I just finished a marathon catchup just to get it all in, washed down with a healthy dose of Lagavulin 16 Year Old just to keep my brain a little grounded and only mildly fried. I failed. :lol:

exhaustion.jpg

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[Steersman]

Steers is over at Nugent's blog telling people to stop ad hominemming Aratina Cage by pointing out that Aratina Cage spells out as A rat in a Cage.

Fuck, I thought Steers could spell.

:clap:

I can spell; one might argue that you, and others, stutter by putting in spaces where none are called for ….

[Steersman]

I don’t see any comments from him after he was banned by PZ in #1337 ….

Sooner or later, PZ's going to have to ban himself.

You might be right on that, but considering this post maybe Pteryxx is going to be the next to be consigned to the dungeon:

Pteryxx 24 March 2013 at 3:42 pm (UTC -5)

*headshake*

The “Dear men. Die.” rant is copypasted from a blog in 2010, was placed on an anti-ManBoobz site last summer, and now the pitters have a post about it.

Unless he has some super-sekret minions who are lurking about feeding information back to him so he doesn’t get any direct contamination ….

[ConcentratedH2O, OM]

I don’t see any comments from him after he was banned by PZ in #1337 ….

Sooner or later, PZ's going to have to ban himself.

You might be right on that, but considering this post maybe Pteryxx is going to be the next to be consigned to the dungeon:

Pteryxx 24 March 2013 at 3:42 pm (UTC -5)

*headshake*

The “Dear men. Die.” rant is copypasted from a blog in 2010, was placed on an anti-ManBoobz site last summer, and now the pitters have a post about it.

Unless he has some super-sekret minions who are lurking about feeding information back to him so he doesn’t get any direct contamination ….

She uses a couple of dongles, with the male ends inserted into the female openings, to avoid 'Pit infection.

[DownThunder]

Thunderf00t isn't letting go of this feminism problem, is he? How many other "high" profile individuals would have been chased away or beaten down, or backed down, by now?

[JackSkeptic]

Jeezus H. Fuckin' Christ!

Go out into the real world for a couple of days to get stuff done and the whole frackin' world goes to hell in a handbasket. As usual, it looks like you cretins didn't miss a beat either. Bugger, over 10 pages to catch up on and barely a boring post in the lot. I just finished a marathon catchup just to get it all in, washed down with a healthy dose of Lagavulin 16 Year Old just to keep my brain a little grounded and only mildly fried. I failed. :lol:

exhaustion.jpg

You'll enjoy Bloody Sunday:)

[JackSkeptic]

Thunderf00t isn't letting go of this feminism problem, is he? How many other "high" profile individuals would have been chased away or beaten down, or backed down, by now?

He's got guts I'll give him that. I assume he sees it as an affront to reason. I agree. I have no issue with people staying on the fence though. I'm a nobody so it does not matter to me but the last thing some people need is this crap clogging up their mail boxes and getting in the way of what they are trying to do.

[FrankGrimes]

Apologies if this has already been posted:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense ... dures.html

[JackSkeptic]

Apologies if this has already been posted:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense ... dures.html

It is conflating what she did with the results of what she did. No one deserves the disgusting reaction she got from the trolls and the hateful and that is a valid discussion to have. I feel it is a shame she had to be sacked (they had no choice her job was PR) But you need to separate that from the actual event. You can disagree with what she did but be vehemently opposed to some of the effects. Many people seem to mix up the two (as PMZ does)

By the way in the UK she could now be successfully suing several hundred people for their comments and many may have been arrested by now. I love the US Constitution but unfortunately the laws dealing with genuine online harassment are something to be looked at very closely I feel.

[Gefan]

Thunderf00t isn't letting go of this feminism problem, is he? How many other "high" profile individuals would have been chased away or beaten down, or backed down, by now?

He's got guts I'll give him that. I assume he sees it as an affront to reason. I agree. I have no issue with people staying on the fence though. I'm a nobody so it does not matter to me but the last thing some people need is this crap clogging up their mail boxes and getting in the way of what they are trying to do.

Having incited the ire of the Jihadists I can't imagine The Big Bad Bunny finds Peezus' rabble a cause of too many sleepless nights.

[Gefan]

Apologies if this has already been posted:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense ... dures.html

It is conflating what she did with the results of what she did. No one deserves the disgusting reaction she got from the trolls and the hateful and that is a valid discussion to have. I feel it is a shame she had to be sacked (they had no choice her job was PR) But you need to separate that from the actual event. You can disagree with what she did but be vehemently opposed to some of the effects. Many people seem to mix up the two (as PMZ does)

By the way in the UK she could now be successfully suing several hundred people for their comments and many may have been arrested by now. I love the US Constitution but unfortunately the laws dealing with genuine online harassment are something to be looked at very closely I feel.

Agree with the first paragraph not so sure about the second.
Some of the stuff sent to Richards was beneath contempt. It was outright intimidation and unacceptable in civilized society. I think everyone's aware of examples - I'm not going to go over them here. Some of that crap seems to have been worthy of the attention of law enforcement.
Is the UK (and most other nations') situation preferable? I honestly don't know. The first amendment is one of the few remaining "levelers" out there. Take it away, and the rich and powerful will be the first ones through the breach. The best I can offer is to suggest we use our freedom to mock all those who would abuse it.

[ConcentratedH2O, OM]

By the way in the UK she could now be successfully suing several hundred people for their comments and many may have been arrested by now. I love the US Constitution but unfortunately the laws dealing with genuine online harassment are something to be looked at very closely I feel.

Sort of true, but then the UK Is known as a defamation destination. It was going on before, but since the internet happened more and more frivolous cases are being brought in the UK and won, or at least settled for cash.

[JackSkeptic]

Thunderf00t isn't letting go of this feminism problem, is he? How many other "high" profile individuals would have been chased away or beaten down, or backed down, by now?

He's got guts I'll give him that. I assume he sees it as an affront to reason. I agree. I have no issue with people staying on the fence though. I'm a nobody so it does not matter to me but the last thing some people need is this crap clogging up their mail boxes and getting in the way of what they are trying to do.

Having incited the ire of the Jihadists I can't imagine The Big Bad Bunny finds Peezus' rabble a cause of too many sleepless nights.

True, but I doubt he will bump into many jihadists at his local secular meeting. I'll be doing my own blog once I get off my bum and get going, I'll be using my real name then. But it's not something everyone has the privilege of doing without real life consequences.

[FrankGrimes]

Jeez, I'm a bit slow aren't I? Didn't realise that the Dongle thing was all over mainstream news. Duh!

[CommanderTuvok]

Re: Crommunist and elitism.

I totally agree Renee. Quite a few of the Baboon leaders exhibit their middle-class, educated privilege to sneer down their noses at those who might be a bit smelly, working class, and HORROR OF HORRORS, those who might be slightly socially awkward. I have seen these houlier-than-thou hypocrites display this behaviour before, and they are the types of people who will regard social anxiety or shyness as either rudeness or "creepiness".

Anyway, we all know about their rules when it comes to dating! You have a get a contract signed before eye contact can be made. I have a feeling those people on that dating site will be more successful than the Baboons.

[JackSkeptic]

By the way in the UK she could now be successfully suing several hundred people for their comments and many may have been arrested by now. I love the US Constitution but unfortunately the laws dealing with genuine online harassment are something to be looked at very closely I feel.

Sort of true, but then the UK Is known as a defamation destination. It was going on before, but since the internet happened more and more frivolous cases are being brought in the UK and won, or at least settled for cash.

Yes that's because it costs about £250,000 to defend a case and there is one judge who is a complete fool who tends to hear them all. I've a friend who won 'substantial damages' but 95% of that went on fees. Even though he won he was lucky to cover them. So it is more for the chilling effect through costs and perverse judgements than the law itself. In the rest of Europe there is a cap of about £10,000 costs. However the law is still flawed in the UK as it puts the burden of proof on the improvable (you can't prove what is in a collective mind such as an Association) and gives insufficient weight to context and actual harm. It is changing soon but only because of the Simon Singh case. There is also a relaxation of the online laws.

Generally freedom of speech is heavily protected in the UK but some laws are still very much out of date.

[JackSkeptic]

Apologies if this has already been posted:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense ... dures.html

It is conflating what she did with the results of what she did. No one deserves the disgusting reaction she got from the trolls and the hateful and that is a valid discussion to have. I feel it is a shame she had to be sacked (they had no choice her job was PR) But you need to separate that from the actual event. You can disagree with what she did but be vehemently opposed to some of the effects. Many people seem to mix up the two (as PMZ does)

By the way in the UK she could now be successfully suing several hundred people for their comments and many may have been arrested by now. I love the US Constitution but unfortunately the laws dealing with genuine online harassment are something to be looked at very closely I feel.

Agree with the first paragraph not so sure about the second.
Some of the stuff sent to Richards was beneath contempt. It was outright intimidation and unacceptable in civilized society. I think everyone's aware of examples - I'm not going to go over them here. Some of that crap seems to have been worthy of the attention of law enforcement.
Is the UK (and most other nations') situation preferable? I honestly don't know. The first amendment is one of the few remaining "levelers" out there. Take it away, and the rich and powerful will be the first ones through the breach. The best I can offer is to suggest we use our freedom to mock all those who would abuse it.

As I tend towards free speech absolutism I agree with you.

[JackSkeptic]

Jeez, I'm a bit slow aren't I? Didn't realise that the Dongle thing was all over mainstream news. Duh!

Not slow, just you have something called 'a life'. Cherish it:)

[JackSkeptic]

Re: Crommunist and elitism.

I totally agree Renee. Quite a few of the Baboon leaders exhibit their middle-class, educated privilege to sneer down their noses at those who might be a bit smelly, working class, and HORROR OF HORRORS, those who might be slightly socially awkward. I have seen these houlier-than-thou hypocrites display this behaviour before, and they are the types of people who will regard social anxiety or shyness as either rudeness or "creepiness".

Anyway, we all know about their rules when it comes to dating! You have a get a contract signed before eye contact can be made. I have a feeling those people on that dating site will be more successful than the Baboons.

I mentioned to a friend of mine the other day that I needed 'Enthusiastic consent'. She took that seriously and launched herself from the top of the wardrobe onto my frail body. I wasn't too enthusiastic after that. The bed wasn't too impressed either.

[Skep tickle]

I mentioned to a friend of mine the other day that I needed 'Enthusiastic consent'. She took that seriously and launched herself from the top of the wardrobe onto my frail body. I wasn't too enthusiastic after that. The bed wasn't too impressed either.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

The bed was too impressed - deeply impressed, I bet.

Did you withdraw your consent, or just downgrade it from "enthusiastic" to "grudging"?

[Gefan]

Thunderf00t isn't letting go of this feminism problem, is he? How many other "high" profile individuals would have been chased away or beaten down, or backed down, by now?

He's got guts I'll give him that. I assume he sees it as an affront to reason. I agree. I have no issue with people staying on the fence though. I'm a nobody so it does not matter to me but the last thing some people need is this crap clogging up their mail boxes and getting in the way of what they are trying to do.

Having incited the ire of the Jihadists I can't imagine The Big Bad Bunny finds Peezus' rabble a cause of too many sleepless nights.

True, but I doubt he will bump into many jihadists at his local secular meeting. I'll be doing my own blog once I get off my bum and get going, I'll be using my real name then. But it's not something everyone has the privilege of doing without real life consequences.

I agree, but there are two factors in the equation. Yes, he's more likely to run into some SJW but the consequences of such an encounter are essentially nil. I'm already fortunate enough that there's nothing much that could be done to me for bearing the "Mark of the Pit" but, a face to face encounter with a baboon strikes me as tedious at worst.
True, he's highly unlikely to be tracked down by some wild-eyed would-be martyr but if he does the likelihood it ending with a slit throat is not exactly negligible.
If you decide to start a blog I look forward to reading it, real name or not. Meantime, I have to pass out before facing a fourteen hour day (one of four that I have left).

[Gefan]

And, Renee?
You and your man remain in all of our thoughts.

[JackSkeptic]

[quote="Gefan"]And, Renee?
You and your man remain in all of our thoughts.[/quote

And mine. I do not always reply to your updates Renee but I am sure like many others we are rooting for you both.

[CommanderTuvok]

Some of you may have seen the link to a debate Dawkins had with Stephen Law, recently.

A rowdy burst of laughter and applause followed Dawkins' use of the "it works, bitches" line (around 1h 11 mins).

[youtube]zvkbiElAOqU[/youtube]

[JackSkeptic]

I just came across a post from Brony. I actually agree with everything that he says (I may have missed some nuances) The post is on A+ and I have not yet read the replies but I do like his approach. It seems fair and trying to achieve the truth. If he or others debated or discussed with any here on that basis it would be very constructive I think. Good luck to him.

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic ... ent#p75634

[rayshul]

Fairdinkum, Funny Bugga, Buckley's chance & You're not wrong there...are still widley used and agree it's seens as retro but acceptable in normal conversations.

"Cunt" is rarely used.....even at the footy or worse, the pub after the footy and your team lost. Probably used a little more in the lower social demographic areas (beyond 15km of the CBD of Sydney at least). Even allowing for the variety of meanings it can have, it's still looked at as a word used by Housing Commission people. "cunt" word usage is frowned on and about the only word you are likely to be called on.

It might be different in Adelaide...but that's Adelaide for you. :shifty:

Streuth, ripper, (never heard of "lagging" other than it's usual meaning). yeah... old rural. Not used much anymore.

I've lived in Sydney, Melbourne and that little fuckhole in the dirt that people occasionally mistake for a habitable city (it's not) - I'm preeetty sure there's a lot of cunting going on.

[rayshul]

Crommunist doesn't have a girlfriend, does he.

[jg64]

I seem to be kvetching a lot about Nugent's efforts and I should probably correct that by saying that I think his intentions (after a shakey start) are laudable. There have been some good comments made (although nothing that hasn't been said elsewhere), but a few serial idiots ensure that talk never gets too far before repeating the same old, same old. Move it on Michael, or watch it go around in circles until it goes down the drain.

MN has set up a website as neutral ground to host structured discussion (on each of the agenda topics he proposed at his site) between the "sides". There's now a team of 5 people for "our side" (4 'pitters + 1 non-pitter) of which 4 will be responsible for content (arguments, rebuttals, etc) and 1 will serve as a moderation team member from "our side". MN is still setting things up, sounds like "the other side" may still be putting their team together, but then MN will certainly be announcing the venture and the participants.

MN hopes to have statements up this week, one from each side posted simultaneously, on his topic #1, "How we can work together on core issues on which we broadly agree, including promoting reason, critical thinking, science, skepticism, atheism and secularism in the real world." He then would like to have the sides identify where they agree & where they disagree, and hash out the disagreements in a constructive manner until they reach some kind of consensus (which can include agreeing to disagree), then move on to the next topic. Sounds like he may also try to bring in someone active in A/S who hasn't been involved in the rift.

May go nowhere, may go somewhere. We'll see.

Source please?

Here.

http://www.michaelnugent.com/

We hope to start the structured dialogue some time this week, on a new website dedicated to this project: http://atheistskepticdialogue.com

The process will be moderated by a team that includes people from both perceived ‘sides’ to keep the dialogue constructive and on-topic.

For each agenda item, we will start with two opening statements, that will be published simultaneously, one each from a person associated with either of the perceived ‘sides’.

The first opening statements will be compiled by Stephanie Zvan (Almost Diamonds) and Tim Skellett (Gurdur)."

"

[rayshul]

I observe they're pulling the craziest from FtB and the most level headed of the 'pit. I'm not sure that's fair, is it?

[Steersman]

I seem to be kvetching a lot about Nugent's efforts and I should probably correct that by saying that I think his intentions (after a shakey start) are laudable. There have been some good comments made (although nothing that hasn't been said elsewhere), but a few serial idiots ensure that talk never gets too far before repeating the same old, same old. Move it on Michael, or watch it go around in circles until it goes down the drain.

MN has set up a website as neutral ground to host structured discussion (on each of the agenda topics he proposed at his site) between the "sides". There's now a team of 5 people for "our side" (4 'pitters + 1 non-pitter) of which 4 will be responsible for content (arguments, rebuttals, etc) and 1 will serve as a moderation team member from "our side". MN is still setting things up, sounds like "the other side" may still be putting their team together, but then MN will certainly be announcing the venture and the participants.

MN hopes to have statements up this week, one from each side posted simultaneously, on his topic #1, "How we can work together on core issues on which we broadly agree, including promoting reason, critical thinking, science, skepticism, atheism and secularism in the real world." He then would like to have the sides identify where they agree & where they disagree, and hash out the disagreements in a constructive manner until they reach some kind of consensus (which can include agreeing to disagree), then move on to the next topic. Sounds like he may also try to bring in someone active in A/S who hasn't been involved in the rift.

May go nowhere, may go somewhere. We'll see.

Source please?

Here.

http://www.michaelnugent.com/

We hope to start the structured dialogue some time this week, on a new website dedicated to this project: http://atheistskepticdialogue.com

The process will be moderated by a team that includes people from both perceived ‘sides’ to keep the dialogue constructive and on-topic.

For each agenda item, we will start with two opening statements, that will be published simultaneously, one each from a person associated with either of the perceived ‘sides’.

The first opening statements will be compiled by Stephanie Zvan (Almost Diamonds) and Tim Skellett (Gurdur)."

That looks rather interesting. How will that moderation work? I see that people outside those teams will be, apparently, allowed to post, but how will those teams adjudicate and moderate those comments?

[Za-zen]

The lump of coal debates Gurdur, this should be fun.

[Michael K Gray]

I unsubscribed from Australia's "Get Up" activism emails just then, as a vapid question from shock-jock John Laws was prefixed with this bit of SJW bullshit:

Trigger Warning: Sexual abuse, victim blaming, assault, childhood abuse, rape

(When it is nothing of the sort)

And the SJW Rage warriors that I am being asked to support are rightly called "Destroy The Joint!".

They can fuck off if they are going that way. The cunts.
A+Theism & Pope PZ are envenoming the real world.

[Lurkion]

Surely saying : Trigger Warning: Sexual abuse, victim blaming, assault, childhood abuse, rape is as good as no warning and just saying the damn thing that they're intending to say.

[rayshul]

Yeah, I'm always surprised by people thinking Australia hasn't been infected. It's fucking rampant there.

[Lurkion]

Yeah, I'm always surprised by people thinking Australia hasn't been infected. It's fucking rampant there.

It is going mental. I have reasons to go to Facebook and the fuckers are always marching around with their "EVERYBODY LOVES RAPE" crap.

[Steersman]

I just came across a post from Brony. I actually agree with everything that he says (I may have missed some nuances) The post is on A+ and I have not yet read the replies but I do like his approach. It seems fair and trying to achieve the truth. If he or others debated or discussed with any here on that basis it would be very constructive I think. Good luck to him.

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic ... ent#p75634

Interesting – good catch.

He does have some interesting arguments, although he may not have got much traction at Pharyngula since many of the behaviours he’s targetting seem to be rather typical of FTB and company:

The specific Behaviors (feel free to add your own, I meant what I said about this being a group thing).

In the last Thunderdome thread I listed this selection of behaviors that I saw for over a year at a general serious topic discussion board for adult, mostly male fans of the reboot of My Little Pony:

*They avoid answering your questions, no matter how many of theirs you answer;

*They take more complicated issues and run off on incorrect tangents and pretend it is your subject to confuse readers;

*They load their paragraphs with assertions offered as fact and resist all attempts to link them to reality;

*When they do give you a link to reality it is usually more opinion! No actual primary sources!

*When they describe the content of the position of another you discover that what is represented as paraphrase is dishonest hyperbole at best. You are made into an exaggeration.

*They engage in projection over and over and over. What they do, they attempt to place on you while they obfuscate.;

*They strike the abused victim stand themselves and try to scream louder than the real victim while offering no evidence that they have been victimized

But some interesting ideas, notably the “Dual Process Theory”, although some hoky ones too – notably the “Rhetorical Assassins guild”.

[rayshul]

Yeah, I'm always surprised by people thinking Australia hasn't been infected. It's fucking rampant there.

It is going mental. I have reasons to go to Facebook and the fuckers are always marching around with their "EVERYBODY LOVES RAPE" crap.

I've cheerfully culled my friendship list. Interestingly the people into it are invariably those who are always complaining/depressed/etc about wank and overreacting to every little fucking thing, and none of them have real jobs. I'm not terribly surprised.

[Michael K Gray]

Surely saying : Trigger Warning: Sexual abuse, victim blaming, assault, childhood abuse, rape is as good as no warning and just saying the damn thing that they're intending to say.

Which was gross hyperbole anyway, to use strictly muted understatement.
A bollocky fiction, if one wishes to put it politely.
An outrageous lying cunting viciously pity-partying outrage-seeking fraudulent witch-hunt, if one veers closer to the reality.

[Dick Strawkins]

The lump of coal debates Gurdur, this should be fun.

You obviously don't know Gurdur.
I'd rather have oolon as our representitive.

[tina]

Nugents....."The process will be moderated by a team that includes people from both perceived ‘sides’ to keep the dialogue constructive and on-topic."

WTF! Wot team! Where's all this team talk come from? haven't even had the paint balling weekend residential yet ffs.

[Michael K Gray]

Yeah, I'm always surprised by people thinking Australia hasn't been infected. It's fucking rampant there.

I don't get out much.
It is still 1969, isn't it?
Flour Power, free clinic luv, Jimi Lennon, Drain Eddy, The Sleekers, Mary Jane Juanah, Lysergic caustic Di ethylamide, Op-fart, Carpet Beatles, damn. Where was I man? I think I swallowed my stash. Heeaaavy man.

[TheMan]

I unsubscribed from Australia's "Get Up" activism emails just then, as a vapid question from shock-jock John Laws was prefixed with this bit of SJW bullshit:

Trigger Warning: Sexual abuse, victim blaming, assault, childhood abuse, rape

(When it is nothing of the sort)

And the SJW Rage warriors that I am being asked to support are rightly called "Destroy The Joint!".

They can fuck off if they are going that way. The cunts.
A+Theism & Pope PZ are envenoming the real world.

"Destroy the joint" was an Alan Jones comment about Women in Parliament. It's taken from that...it has a facebook campaign but I didn't know it was run or started by Get-up.

[rayshul]

The lump of coal debates Gurdur, this should be fun.

You obviously don't know Gurdur.
I'd rather have oolon as our representitive.

I quite like Gurdur. Don't agree with him on a lot of things - I think I'm on the far, far end of 'pitters in terms of politics - but he's a reasonable guy on a lot of issues. Not a 'pitter though.

[Dick Strawkins]

Nugents....."The process will be moderated by a team that includes people from both perceived ‘sides’ to keep the dialogue constructive and on-topic."

WTF! Wot team! Where's all this team talk come from? haven't even had the paint balling weekend residential yet ffs.

It looks like Nugent is back to his dirty tricks again.
Tim Skellett?
Some of you may like Skellett (Gurdur) but many of us who knew of him from the 'Your Not Helping' Tom Johnson times have a very different impression of him. He has always been completely opposed to the outspoken atheist approach of the likes of Dawkins. He was firmly on Mooney's side of the fence on that debate.
He might have a few views in common with the prevailing views here but he is far from representitive of this side of the debate.
I can only think that Nugent is doing his best to poison the debate from the outset.

[Michael K Gray]

The lump of coal debates Gurdur, this should be fun.

You obviously don't know Gurdur.
I'd rather have oolon as our representitive.

Quite.
Gurder is much more accomodationist, waffling, Ãœber-Steersman-like and censorious than Nugent!
Bad werdz = DOUBLEBAD!!
I parallel Gurdur's approach to robust debate to that of Neville Chamberlain vs Hitler.
"Peace in our time!"
[youtube]pmwmuPTa0To[/youtube]

[Dick Strawkins]

The lump of coal debates Gurdur, this should be fun.

You obviously don't know Gurdur.
I'd rather have oolon as our representitive.

I quite like Gurdur. Don't agree with him on a lot of things - I think I'm on the far, far end of 'pitters in terms of politics - but he's a reasonable guy on a lot of issues. Not a 'pitter though.

I'm sure he's a 'nice' guy. That isn't the problem. The problem is that one of the central disagreements between 'our' side and the FTB crowd is over the question of using 'nice' language that is pre-approved by the gender feminist SJW brigade. Gurdur has a long history of opposing outspoken new atheist approaches and part of this was built upon the idea that we must not use language that offends potential allies.
Now, I don't particularly use the specific proscribed swear words myself (except, occasionally, when referring to oolon - I can't help it!) but I do stand up for the principle that others should be allowed to use it without it then forming proof that they are misogynists.
His views are valid - they are just very unrepresentitive of the reasons behind the major disagreements between us and the FTB.

[Scented Nectar]

Yeah, I'm always surprised by people thinking Australia hasn't been infected. It's fucking rampant there.

I don't get out much.
It is still 1969, isn't it?
Flour Power, free clinic luv, Jimi Lennon, Drain Eddy, The Sleekers, Mary Jane Juanah, Lysergic caustic Di ethylamide, Op-fart, Carpet Beatles, damn. Where was I man? I think I swallowed my stash. Heeaaavy man.

Don't worry. It is 1969, but there'll be lots more drugs at Woodstock which is some time this year. I'm planning on doing some of that bad acid that's going around.

[Scented Nectar]

Non capito un cazzo.

Well, "tough shit" as we say in Aussieland.

I've been watching the old Australian soap opera, Prisoner: Cell Block H (aka Caged Women), and I think I've been learning some Australianese. "Fair dinkum", "ripper", "funny buggers", "struth", "buckley's chance", "screws" (prison guards), "lagging", "you're not wrong there", etc. I don't know how realistic the show is or how out of date, but I'm totally hooked.

Many of those have fallen out of favour, as they reek of the 1950's & 1960's.
You'll only ever hear "fair dinkum" (used seriously) by buggers over the age of 80!
If you spoke like that now, folks would assume that you were teasing them, or an ignorant tourist trying to fit in.
"Cunt" has replaced most of those terms(!)

You jest Mike...

Fairdinkum, Funny Bugga, Buckley's chance & You're not wrong there...are still widley used and agree it's seens as retro but acceptable in normal conversations.

"Cunt" is rarely used.....even at the footy or worse, the pub after the footy and your team lost. Probably used a little more in the lower social demographic areas (beyond 15km of the CBD of Sydney at least). Even allowing for the variety of meanings it can have, it's still looked at as a word used by Housing Commission people. "cunt" word usage is frowned on and about the only word you are likely to be called on.

It might be different in Adelaide...but that's Adelaide for you. :shifty:

Streuth, ripper, (never heard of "lagging" other than it's usual meaning). yeah... old rural. Not used much anymore.

If you liked cell Block H (aka Prisoner) you'll love No96

-k8EupTg3bQ

I've never heard of No96. I'll look for it on youtube. In Prisoner Cell Block H, 'lagging' is telling on someone or tattletaling, a high crime in Wentworth Prison. Also 'dobbing someone in' is the same thing, ratting on someone and getting them into trouble.

[Submariner]

I just came across a post from Brony. I actually agree with everything that he says (I may have missed some nuances) The post is on A+ and I have not yet read the replies but I do like his approach. It seems fair and trying to achieve the truth. If he or others debated or discussed with any here on that basis it would be very constructive I think. Good luck to him.

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic ... ent#p75634

Someone else has already noted the Rhetorical Assassin Training Squad=R.A.T.S.

Brony's Organized Rhetorical Assassin Training = B.O.R.A.T.
will launch their:

Rhetorical Assassins Preemptive Engagements
using

Brony's Rhetorical Assassin Skills
to force their opponents to

Back Away, and Reassess Support

for the pit.

YMMV

[rayshul]

So far my facebook tally is:

1x "writer" wannabe with shit job (American)
1x self-conscious beta male, unemployed (Australian)
1x working class mum in shit relationship (Australian)
1x radical queer advocate student (American)

I'm observing a certain type of person this stuff appeals to. Amusingly it's the same group of people who got really into Lady Gaga a little while back.

[LMU]

I observe they're pulling the craziest from FtB and the most level headed of the 'pit. I'm not sure that's fair, is it?

Do we know who the representatives are? Gurder, and Zvan obviously, but who are the rest? Skep Tickle, JV, and Renee maybe?

[rayshul]

There will never be anyone who will represent the pit the way you want them to. That's just a fact.

Gurdur hasn't told me off for my language (which utilises the word cunt liberally) so I assume he's fine with people using bad werdz in his vicinity without having the need to pull an Adria. I'm fine with that.

[AnonymousCowherd]

The lump of coal debates Gurdur, this should be fun.

You obviously don't know Gurdur.
I'd rather have oolon as our representitive.

Hasn't Gurdur denied being a 'pitter? Even if he hasn't, he doesn't "represent" me.

The assumption in all this is a) that if one side says 2+2+4 and the other says 2+2=5 that 2+2=4.5 is a reasonable outcome and b) that anything to do with facts is secondary, as long as feelings are taken care of.

All of the facts are on the table, if anyone cares to do the digging. What's left is rhetoric, on the pretext of trying to convince what seems to be an illusory crowd of onlookers who are so interested they have even noticed all this, but are somehow unwilling or unable to make up their minds about it unless it is spelled out for them in excruciating and repetitive detail.

[acathode]

I don't mind Gurdur having a discussion with Zvan, even though I hardly know who this Gurdur guy is. It could be very interesting, or it could be a complete failure, I still wont mind much. Just as long as he isn't passed off as some sort of representative for anyone but himself.

[LMU]

There will never be anyone who will represent the pit the way you want them to. That's just a fact.

Gurdur hasn't told me off for my language (which utilises the word cunt liberally) so I assume he's fine with people using bad werdz in his vicinity without having the need to pull an Adria. I'm fine with that.

I agree. I didn't volunteer myself or suggest any other representatives, so I don't get to complain too much, and others can probably still contribute or join the discussion in some way if they have something to add.

[rayshul]

I think we also need to recognise here that there are two sides to this debate, very clearly - those who agree to the radical feminism, identity politics and cults of personality of FtB and Skepchicks (although not all the members of FtB, obviously), and those who reject these as unskeptical and jussst a wee bit sexist, racist, genderist and pretty much fucking every other -ist there is.

This second side isn't just the pit - it's a far, far larger community than just us. Just because FtB likes to pretend that everyone against them is a 'pitter, it's not true, and WE KNOW IT ISN'T.

If Nugent is going to look at the debate, rather than the individuals (which is the right way to do it) it makes sense not to take everyone who is technically on the pit's side from the pit. What I assume he's hoping is that these people will represent the wide range of disgusted responses to the radfemmery that come from all areas of the skeptic community.

[rayshul]

We've been complaining for a long fucking time that we are not the only source of dissent and/or disgust toward FtB, and that this characterisation fucks us and fucks other dissenters. Now that this has been acknowledged by someone ostensibly on the FtB side, why the fuck whine about it?

[rayshul]

Fuck they should bring in fucking Julian, that'd be a motherfucking riot.

[AnonymousCowherd]

I've never heard of No96. I'll look for it on youtube. In Prisoner Cell Block H, 'lagging' is telling on someone or tattletaling, a high crime in Wentworth Prison. Also 'dobbing someone in' is the same thing, ratting on someone and getting them into trouble.

Fair suck of the sav, you shielas'd watch a drongo rot if the telly was cactus. Yez'r all cucking funts. Z'at slab in the esky?

Ah the 70s. Hell on earth, really.

[Dilurk]

I think we also need to recognise here that there are two sides to this debate, very clearly - those who agree to the radical feminism, identity politics and cults of personality of FtB and Skepchicks (although not all the members of FtB, obviously), and those who reject these as unskeptical and jussst a wee bit sexist, racist, genderist and pretty much fucking every other -ist there is.

This second side isn't just the pit - it's a far, far larger community than just us. Just because FtB likes to pretend that everyone against them is a 'pitter, it's not true, and WE KNOW IT ISN'T.

(Repeated once again for the newcomers) http://sparkcharts.sparknotes.com/women ... ction4.php
Read the note " Often at odds with radical feminism."

It has been said before but it does bear repeating. FtB have taken to some weird mutant child of feminism which is a version of feminism at odds with the original simple concept. There is no surprise at all to see this fighting. There is a big difference between the sex positive and the porn is bad camp. Watching Tfoots video I see Adria as a theist is clearly in the "porn is bad" camp.

If Nugent is going to look at the debate, rather than the individuals (which is the right way to do it) it makes sense not to take everyone who is technically on the pit's side from the pit. What I assume he's hoping is that these people will represent the wide range of disgusted responses to the radfemmery that come from all areas of the skeptic community.