Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

[Aneris]

[...] They'd much rather be scared victims than to actually do anything to take back their own seat space.

I agree with you, but then I've been in similar situations where I did nothing and was annoyed. Any "issue" or "obstacle" including the ones we encounter online become a matter of spending energy. Often enough I think "Fuck it. It pisses me off, but I don't care enough". How often do you swallow a comment because of possible flak (figuratively) you will be dealing with...

[Dick Strawkins]

I can't believe this stupid fucking "MEN SIT WITH THEIR LEGS OPEN AND IT'S OPPRESSION!" shit has actually starting to take off. We were making fun of this years ago.

If they are taking up part of her seat's space, that's easy to fix. I've done it many times. I immediately push their leg back onto their own seat by opening my own legs to fully encompass MY seat's space, pushing his off of my seat, forcibly if needed. They almost never say anything, but if they do, just say in a non-emotional flat voice "you were taking up part of my seat". Easy. Fixed and also the man will probably be a bit more careful about seat hogging after that.

http://www.scentednectar.com/blogpics/0 ... t-hogs.png
Notice the woman in this picture (which I surreptitiously took on Toronto's subway) is not doing anything at all. She is just letting it happen, accommodating it even. Instead of simply being assertive and taking back her seat's full space, she probably went home and cried to her friends or blogged about it. If the man in this picture was sitting next to another man, he'd have stayed on his own seat, so there's no reason why he needs extra space when a woman sits next to him, even if it is a little bit more comfortable.

I wrote about seat hogs last year at http://scentednectar.blogspot.com/2012/ ... -hogs.html

I always wear pants and never dresses or skirts. I suppose it might be difficult to forcefully get your own seat back using your legs if wearing a dress or skirt and you fear not looking lady-like. The front of the dress/skirt if careful, could prevent underwear from showing, but if a woman fears breaking gender role rules (as many of the feminists seem to do ironically), then she'll be too scared to sit open-legged or to demand her full seat's space.

They'd much rather be scared victims than to actually do anything to take back their own seat space.

I bet you used a monopod to take that picture! :D

The classic example of taking this sort of idea too far is the Swedish feminist site machoikollektivtraffiken
http://machoikollektivtrafiken.se/

It's basically a huge collection of crotch shots of guys on the Stockholm underground.

Imagine, for a second, a similar site dedicated to crotch shots of Swedish women - you'd be arrested after a day.
This site, on the other hand, has a huge following - 23,000 hits per day, according to their traffic page.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

The thing about pictures like these is they are taken completely out of context. How do we know that these are two strangers or two lovers, or two friends? People with close relationships aren't as concerned about personal space and sometimes accommodate the other person.

But, yeah. Point taken. I've done this myself on airplanes. If you are sitting in the middle seat, both armrests are yours (or at least shared). Be prepared to have my arm all up in there until you get the point.

I'm very shy in transports. I tend to keep my legs closed (bollocks be fucked). Armrests, now, that's another battle. Don't you dare take those from me, especially if I'm reading a book!

(But seriously, who designed those seats?)

[Tony Parsehole]

@Dick Strawkins.
The British press also get after pass when it comes to dodgy public photo's. The Daily Sport has an up skirt photo on it's front page nearly everynday.
When they are feeling extra classy they take a pavement level up-skirt shot of some random woman getting out of a car and Photoshop a minor celebrities head on accompanying a headline like " Holly Willoughby's SHOCK at leaked Photoshop picture" or some other shite.
Anybody else doing the same would be placed on the sex offenders register and ironically have the tabloids tearing them to shreds.

[cunt]

Commerical Break-----------------
A hell of a rant. And a transparent underhanded attempt to continue to make this the cooler place to hang out. :D

Growing up in a family that can afford braces for your crooked teeth and surgery for the nose that broke when you were hit with a frisbee at age 6 = oppression.

Poetry Slams makes me want to vomit. Every time.

I kind of want to attend one just so I can yell out; "You're not funny!" And then get thrown out.

I'd kind of like to attend to a rodeo just so I just can yell out "you suck at playing the clarinet".

[Apples]

I'm very shy in transports. I tend to keep my legs closed (bollocks be fucked). Armrests, now, that's another battle. Don't you dare take those from me, especially if I'm reading a book!

(But seriously, who designed those seats?)

Ever ride Amtrak when you lived in the States? Aside from being slow and late a lot of the time, some of the east coast trains have seats facing one another so close together that on a full train you end up interlocking your knees with people sitting across from you. Very intimate.

[katamari Damassi]

The only feminist blog I've read that's crazier than Shakesville is Twisty Faster's I Blame the Patriarchy. Even feminists think she's nuts.

It takes some damn hard graft to be crazier than Shakesville so citation needed*. Linky?



*Fucking Nerd has got me saying that all the time now. My lass said we had ran out of teabags and I responded with "citation needed". That tit has got a lot to answer for.

http://pervocracy.blogspot.com/2009/02/ ... nsane.html

http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/

[katamari Damassi]

Hey Dick, thanks for the link to the site of Swedish men's crotch shots. That should keep me busy for a while. I do notice that quite a few of the men are sitting by themselves, so why not spread out a bit?

[Dick Strawkins]

I just need to check with people here.
Which side is Ophelia Benson on again?

Is she really so self-obsessed and oblivious to what people will get from viewing the actual cartoon (I'll give you a clue Ophelia, it's not the eyes), that she thinks the following story is good for her or her side?

http://www.freezepage.com/1364413116BGSRLDXGXP
http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... #more-7362

[cunt]

If you aren't a politician then nobody can make fun of you. *puts pot on head and hits it with a big wooden spoon*.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

I'm very shy in transports. I tend to keep my legs closed (bollocks be fucked). Armrests, now, that's another battle. Don't you dare take those from me, especially if I'm reading a book!

(But seriously, who designed those seats?)

Ever ride Amtrak when you lived in the States? Aside from being slow and late a lot of the time, some of the east coast trains have seats facing one another so close together that on a full train you end up interlocking your knees with people sitting across from you. Very intimate.

I watched "Source Code" too many times to be at ease in a US train. (No, I never used one when in the States. I did take a Greyhound once, from Tampa to Jacksonville. Sucked big time. Sorry Floridians, your countryside is FLAT!)

[Submariner]

I'm very shy in transports. I tend to keep my legs closed (bollocks be fucked). Armrests, now, that's another battle. Don't you dare take those from me, especially if I'm reading a book!

(But seriously, who designed those seats?)

Ever ride Amtrak when you lived in the States? Aside from being slow and late a lot of the time, some of the east coast trains have seats facing one another so close together that on a full train you end up interlocking your knees with people sitting across from you. Very intimate.

I watched "Source Code" too many times to be at ease in a US train. (No, I never used one when in the States. I did take a Greyhound once, from Tampa to Jacksonville. Sucked big time. Sorry Floridians, your countryside is FLAT!)

That's to better hold rainwater for mosquito breeding.

[Apples]

If you aren't a politician then nobody can make fun of you. *puts pot on head and hits it with a big wooden spoon*.

Holy shit that Ophie post is so full of fail it's not even full of fail -- there's no container.

PZ weighs in with the first comment: "Not to mention, the words coming out of our photoshopped faces are nothing we’ve ever said."

It works, bitcheeeeeeez!!!!!! bwaaahahahahaha!!!

[Stretchycheese]

If you aren't a politician then nobody can make fun of you. *puts pot on head and hits it with a big wooden spoon*.

Holy shit that Ophie post is so full of fail it's not even full of fail -- there's no container.

PZ weighs in with the first comment: "Not to mention, the words coming out of our photoshopped faces are nothing we’ve ever said."

It works, bitcheeeeeeez!!!!!! bwaaahahahahaha!!!

This reminds of the time when Stephen Colbert roasted Bush and mainstream media at some sort of convention or gala. The mainstream media were often the butt of the joke, and the humour was either lost on them or they were displeased at being mocked. They tried to poopoo the event by saying Colbert bombed or tried to ignore it, but in reality it was hilarious satire. There's a similar kind of dynamic happening when the FSA+ crowd responds to satire of them.

[katamari Damassi]

If you aren't a politician then nobody can make fun of you. *puts pot on head and hits it with a big wooden spoon*.

Holy shit that Ophie post is so full of fail it's not even full of fail -- there's no container.

PZ weighs in with the first comment: "Not to mention, the words coming out of our photoshopped faces are nothing we’ve ever said."

It works, bitcheeeeeeez!!!!!! bwaaahahahahaha!!!

This reminds of the time when Stephen Colbert roasted Bush and mainstream media at some sort of convention or gala. The mainstream media were often the butt of the joke, and the humour was either lost on them or they were displeased at being mocked. They tried to poopoo the event by saying Colbert bombed or tried to ignore it, but in reality it was hilarious satire. There's a similar kind of dynamic happening when the FSA+ crowd responds to satire of them.

Colbert was brilliant and made everyone there uncomfortable. He really does have a weapons grade wit. He nearly made Chevy Chase cry at his celebrity roast.

[katamari Damassi]

I watched "Source Code" too many times to be at ease in a US train. (No, I never used one when in the States. I did take a Greyhound once, from Tampa to Jacksonville. Sucked big time. Sorry Floridians, your countryside is FLAT!)

I hated that movie.

SPOILER ALERT:


What happened to the teacher whose body got taken over? It wasn't a happy ending for him.

[Dick Strawkins]

http://i.imgur.com/IQPolWw.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/T1zzEIV.jpg

[Apples]

http://i.imgur.com/IQPolWw.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/T1zzEIV.jpg

bullseye

[Submariner]

I haven't seen this at the pit yet, if it's a re-post, please forgive.

Zvan has a blog post on the talks here.

As I proposed much of the structure for this dialog, it shouldn’t be too surprising that I’m taking part in it.

Does this explain the uber top secrecy?

I’ve written about these issues extensively, and I have responded in depth to arguments from “the other side”. The responses from them have generally either been to change the subject or to wander away as the background level of harassment ramps up. The structure of this dialog has been designed to minimize both of those.

Check out the first comment. :doh:

[bovarchist]

I watched "Source Code" too many times to be at ease in a US train. (No, I never used one when in the States. I did take a Greyhound once, from Tampa to Jacksonville. Sucked big time. Sorry Floridians, your countryside is FLAT!)

That's to better hold rainwater for mosquito breeding.

Try Manitoba sometime. The flatness of Florida, the swampiness of Louisiana, and the coldness of fucking Manitoba.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

I watched "Source Code" too many times to be at ease in a US train. (No, I never used one when in the States. I did take a Greyhound once, from Tampa to Jacksonville. Sucked big time. Sorry Floridians, your countryside is FLAT!)

I hated that movie.

SPOILER ALERT:


What happened to the teacher whose body got taken over? It wasn't a happy ending for him.

H'e didn't die in the explosion. Better than nothing, hey?

[Al Stefanelli]

I'm very shy in transports. I tend to keep my legs closed (bollocks be fucked). Armrests, now, that's another battle. Don't you dare take those from me, especially if I'm reading a book!

(But seriously, who designed those seats?)

Ever ride Amtrak when you lived in the States? Aside from being slow and late a lot of the time, some of the east coast trains have seats facing one another so close together that on a full train you end up interlocking your knees with people sitting across from you. Very intimate.

I've always had a hard time traveling on trains and planes.

I'm a fairly tall guy, with a 36" inseam, and fairly stocky at 230lbs. My legs take up a lot of fucking space, and my shoulders are very wide. Airplane seats and particularly train seats force me to be a complete but unintentional douchebag. There is no way I can avoid having parts of my body touching someone else's, which often creeps out those sitting next to or adjacent from me, especially if it is a woman. I've long since stopped giving a fuck.

On planes... That middle seat? I will take at least one of those armrests. Which one depends on who gives me the most shit. If I can get away with it, I'll take both. Smaller planes, this is unavoidable. I am inadvertently going to piss someone off. Again, I've long since stopped giving a fuck.

Sitting in a seat or chair that doesn't have any sides, such as the one depicted in the public train shot, does not allow for most of the men I know to sit any other way than with their legs spread out somewhat, particularly for long periods of time. There are a plethora of hypotheses for this, none of which matters to me, personally. Is it annoying to those non-males sitting next to me? I am sure it is. Again, I've long since stopped giving a fuck.

I am not what you call a pleasant traveler...

[AbsurdWalls]

Interesting:
http://io9.com/packages-sealed-with-ath ... -460984925

Does the United States Postal Service discriminate against atheists? A recent experiment suggests it does. ATHEIST SHOES is a German based-company that, as its name suggests, makes comfy kicks "for people who don't believe in god(s)." The company regularly ships shoes, like the ones pictured above, to America. When it does, it seals its boxes with tape featuring the company logo, which is stylized as "ATHEIST · ATHEIST · ATHEIST" (see below). But these shipments often run into problems.

The company explains on its website that shoes shipped the U.S. often take longer than they should to arrive, or go missing altogether. "When some of our customers asked us not to use ATHEIST-branded packing tape on their shipments, we started to wonder if the delays were caused by the US Postal Service taking offence at our overt godlessness."

"So," the company writes, "we launched an experiment."

Said experiment, which is recounted in detail in an infographic on the company's website, saw 178 packages shipped to 89 people in 49 U.S. States. All packages left Berlin on the same day, and each person was sent two packages. The first was sealed with ATHEIST tape, the second with neutral tape. The result? Boxes sealed with ATHEIST tape were ten-times more likely to go missing, and took an average of three days longer to arrive than neutral-wrapped packages.

"Having run a series of control tests in Germany and Europe, which demonstrate no such bias," the company writes, "the problem appears to be in the USA and is likely explained by the differential handling of packages by the employees of the US Postal Service." An unsettling find – remember, mail-tampering is a federal offense.

While it wasn't the most rigorous experiment, the company's results did demonstrate statistical significance. Consequently, ATHEIST SHOES has stopped using ATHEIST packing tape on American shipments. Apparently, delivery times are already improving.

[welch]

I haven't seen this at the pit yet, if it's a re-post, please forgive.

Zvan has a blog post on the talks here.

As I proposed much of the structure for this dialog, it shouldn’t be too surprising that I’m taking part in it.

Does this explain the uber top secrecy?

I’ve written about these issues extensively, and I have responded in depth to arguments from “the other side”. The responses from them have generally either been to change the subject or to wander away as the background level of harassment ramps up. The structure of this dialog has been designed to minimize both of those.

Check out the first comment. :doh:

Since when is "leaving a snotty paragraph then running away back to where you're in control" 'responding in depth'?

oh, and I did ping nugent about being involved. For many, many reasons....:-D

[AndrewV69]

I watched "Source Code" too many times to be at ease in a US train. (No, I never used one when in the States. I did take a Greyhound once, from Tampa to Jacksonville. Sucked big time. Sorry Floridians, your countryside is FLAT!)

That's to better hold rainwater for mosquito breeding.

Try Manitoba sometime. The flatness of Florida, the swampiness of Louisiana, and the coldness of fucking Manitoba.

Mosquitoes the size of small helicopters. I stopped at a rest area once to take a pee and those things forced me back into the car before I got half way there. I wound up peeing into a bottle in the car.

http://www.mysteriesofcanada.com/images/komarnolg.jpg

[didymos]

The only feminist blog I've read that's crazier than Shakesville is Twisty Faster's I Blame the Patriarchy. Even feminists think she's nuts.

Pshaw. Give this one a shot:

http://factcheckme.wordpress.com/2010/0 ... a-bonding/

Or this one:

http://cherryblossomlife.com/2013/02/01 ... condition/

In the land of feminist crazy, Twisty's like Kramer, the wacky neighbor, whereas those two are Michael Richards mid-racist-meltdown.

[mordacious1]

Thought you guys might like my latest blog post! It's about Ophelia Benson and harassment. :) http://richardreed84.wordpress.com/2013 ... ia-benson/

Obviously, RichardReed84 doesn't know how claims of harassment work. In the two examples he gives, it's not about the content, but the subtle implications made by the pictures. When you look at the front part of Obama's picture you see black, the back part is white. This is obviously harassing Obama for being of of mixed race. See how this works? In Ophie's picture, the front part shows "old", the back shows "goat", hence "old goat". Ageism-harassment, plain and simple.

Anything that you say, print or show a photo of, can be harassment...remember that.

[Lsuoma]

The thing about pictures like these is they are taken completely out of context. How do we know that these are two strangers or two lovers, or two friends? People with close relationships aren't as concerned about personal space and sometimes accommodate the other person.

If he's getting his fingers and tops, they're probably acquainted. Or it's rape.

[welch]

I watched "Source Code" too many times to be at ease in a US train. (No, I never used one when in the States. I did take a Greyhound once, from Tampa to Jacksonville. Sucked big time. Sorry Floridians, your countryside is FLAT!)

That's to better hold rainwater for mosquito breeding.

Try Manitoba sometime. The flatness of Florida, the swampiness of Louisiana, and the coldness of fucking Manitoba.

Mosquitoes the size of small helicopters. I stopped at a rest area once to take a pee and those things forced me back into the car before I got half way there. I wound up peeing into a bottle in the car.

http://www.mysteriesofcanada.com/images/komarnolg.jpg

our mosquitos tend to be small compared to the beasts that drone about in places like Minn./N.D.

we just have more of them.

[Apples]

Holy shitballs but Aratina Cage has been a fucking idiot at Nugent's today. If I didn't have regretavirus I might shred his smarmy ass right now. I may do so later.

http://www.michaelnugent.com/2013/03/26 ... ent-207432

[mordacious1]

Users browsing this forum: mordacious1, Phil_Giordana_FCD and 11 guests

Hi Phil!

[acathode]

Holy shitballs but Aratina Cage has been a fucking idiot at Nugent's today. If I didn't have regretavirus I might shred his smarmy ass right now. I may do so later.

http://www.michaelnugent.com/2013/03/26 ... ent-207432

No kidding.

I do not identify as a skeptic

If we only could get the rest of FTB to become this self-aware, the rest of the A/S-community might ditch them completely.

[JAB]

So PZ had the woman's "consent" to ask her for sex, repeatedly, after dragging her on stage?

Bullshit. Absolute bullshit. That would mean he had discussed with her beforehand exactly what he was going to do and say and she agreed. Oh, and she must have been stone-cold sober when she agreed too else the consent becomes invalid.
Strange that even Lord PZ doesn't even say that's how it happened. As Nerd would say "citation needed *FLOOSH* "
The retards on pharyngula would say black was white if PZ said so.

Also, as we know from donglegate, you also need the consent of anyone who might overhear, and since PZ had a mic, he needed the consent of all the audience and anyone out in the hall. And since it was on youtube there is an ongoing requirement for consent. Think of the poor questioning theist thinking of atheism who stumbles on that video and can't handle the thought of being propositioned in front of a crowd like that so runs back to her church because at least the preacher has the class to do it in private.

[katamari Damassi]

I'm a fairly tall guy, with a 36" inseam, and fairly stocky at 230lbs. My legs take up a lot of fucking space, and my shoulders are very wide. Airplane seats and particularly train seats force me to be a complete but unintentional douchebag. There is no way I can avoid having parts of my body touching someone else's, which often creeps out those sitting next to or adjacent from me, especially if it is a woman.

That wouldn't creep me out at all Al. Far from it. Bears are kind of my thing.

[Michael K Gray]

Oh yeah, I forgot about 'drongo'. That's another new (old) word I learned. :D
I have no idea though, what "Fair suck of the sav" or "Z'at slab in the esky" mean.

"Fair suck of the sav"
->"Please allow me to eat an equitable portion of red spiced boiled sausage, rather than keeping the main portion for yourself"
(A generalised plea for equity. usually in potentially unfair social interactions)
Often redacted to the imerative "Fair Suck!"

"Z'at slab in the esky"
"It is that package of 24 cans or bottles of beer in the portable icebox."

[mordacious1]

I'm tired today, I spent last night running around Al's lawn. Good exercise though, especially after the gunfire erupted.

[Steersman]

Thought you guys might like my latest blog post! It's about Ophelia Benson and harassment. :) http://richardreed84.wordpress.com/2013 ... ia-benson/

Obviously, RichardReed84 doesn't know how claims of harassment work. In the two examples he gives, it's not about the content, but the subtle implications made by the pictures. When you look at the front part of Obama's picture you see black, the back part is white. This is obviously harassing Obama for being of of mixed race. See how this works? In Ophie's picture, the front part shows "old", the back shows "goat", hence "old goat". Ageism-harassment, plain and simple.

Anything that you say, print or show a photo of, can be harassment...remember that.

Say, I can see a rosy future for you in the Ministry of Truth [aka, various Human Rights Commissions] ….

[JAB]

I don't know how familiar any of you are with the youtube meme of puting different subtitles on a scene from the german movie Downfall, but the current situation suggests a perfect version, depending on how the next few days go re Nugent's initiative.

Open scene in Hitler's (PZ's) warroom (backchannel) discussing strategy around a map. PZ is explaining how all they have to do to keep going in the short term is avoid any uncontrolled engagement until they get through the Irish conference. One of the minions nervously interupts to tell PZ that Zvan has agreed to Nugent's debating initiative. Hitler kicks out all but the inner circle (oddly all male) and then goes on a rant how everyone has been told to not engage ... yada yada on the way to a breakdown when he realizes all is lost and he might as well join Shakesville, or something. There's even a cut away to RW consoling a crying Amy in the hall.

I have no video tools or experience in doing this, but it may almost be worth learning. Anyone else is welcome to the idea if they want to run with it.

I love a good godWinning with a cup of coffee in the evening.

[Steersman]

http://i.imgur.com/IQPolWw.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/T1zzEIV.jpg

bullseye

Did she really say that? Linky?

I thought the more damning case was Myers' "It works, bitches" which was, if I'm not mistaken, the title of one of his ScienceBlog posts ....

[Steersman]

<snip>
Although I wonder, mostly out of curiousity, how you edited the GIF down to several seconds, put it on repeat and got it to display since when I quote your response to respond I don't see any "code" segments or any indications how you got that to work ....

Try opening the gif in a freeware image program like Irfanview or GIMP, which can extract frames, then recompile the GIF with the desired frames and speed

Thanks; I had been wondering about how to do that type of thing in another context so those methods and programs might come in handy ....

[Al Stefanelli]

I'm a fairly tall guy, with a 36" inseam, and fairly stocky at 230lbs. My legs take up a lot of fucking space, and my shoulders are very wide. Airplane seats and particularly train seats force me to be a complete but unintentional douchebag. There is no way I can avoid having parts of my body touching someone else's, which often creeps out those sitting next to or adjacent from me, especially if it is a woman.

That wouldn't creep me out at all Al. Far from it. Bears are kind of my thing.

Ha ha ha! Well, if we ever meet on a train, we'll have a drink and laugh at our fellow passengers - and creep a few out. Maybe we can hang out outside the little bathroom and offer people cups of coffee?

[Submariner]

http://i.imgur.com/IQPolWw.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/T1zzEIV.jpg

bullseye

Did she really say that? Linky?

I thought the more damning case was Myers' "It works, bitches" which was, if I'm not mistaken, the title of one of his ScienceBlog posts ....

Well to be pedantic, he didn'y SAY that either.... :whistle:

[Apples]

Did she really say that? Linky?

I thought the more damning case was Myers' "It works, bitches" which was, if I'm not mistaken, the title of one of his ScienceBlog posts ....

:suimouth:

[Apples]

Okay - I realize I may now need to renounce the Slymepit ... Thank you, Stephanie for steering me right ... I didn't realize before, but now it's clear things have gone Beyond The Pale .... Ophie has provided proof - Skepsheik doctored the photo of Ophie used in the Peezus and O cartoons. I am shaking and crying....

http://i.imgur.com/KsCSkhQ.jpg

Not only is the shirt a different color ... The eyes have been doctored. MENGELE!!!!! *faints*

[ConcentratedH2O, OM]

Okay - I realize I may now need to renounce the Slymepit ... Thank you, Stephanie for steering me right ... I didn't realize before, but now it's clear things have gone Beyond The Pale .... Ophie has provided proof - Skepsheik doctored the photo of Ophie used in the Peezus and O cartoons. I am shaking and crying....

http://i.imgur.com/KsCSkhQ.jpg

Not only is the shirt a different color ... The eyes have been doctored. MENGELE!!!!! *faints*

((((gentlehugs))))) if you need/want them.

[ConcentratedH2O, OM]

Oh yeah, I forgot about 'drongo'. That's another new (old) word I learned. :D
I have no idea though, what "Fair suck of the sav" or "Z'at slab in the esky" mean.

"Z'at slab in the esky"
"It is that package of 24 cans or bottles of beer in the portable icebox."

I think the second may also translate as "Giz ('give us', meaning 'give me') that package of 24...etc...".

[Aneris]

Chris Clarke put up a new post where he, in the context of Google Glasses, complains about people taking pictures of strangers without their consent. He must have foreseen the issue there, and preemptively put up a disclaimer that he doesn't like connections drawn to Adria Richards case and flat out lies that the issue could have been discussed in the donglegate posts. We know that this isn't true, as the social warriors tear everyone apart who have an issue with Richards, failing to acknowledge that there are multiple cases where one can hold different opinions on each one...

• #Issue 0: Sexism in the tech industry
• #Issue 1: making double entendres at conferences (seems not related to 0, their double entendre wasn't sexist).
• #Issue 2: taking pictures of strangers without their consent and putting them online, intending to damage their reputation. This is causally connected to 1 (its meta to 1), yet there is nothing to win to keep the connection. Edge cases aside, it remains wrong due to article 12 of the Human Rights (irony interlude: social justice warriors who shit on human rights and think that everything was "exactly right" without a single consideration).
• #Issue 3: Reporting harassment or issues properly
• #Issue 4: Reaction of the Internet, Threats against Richards etc.

Most of them are neatly located on different meta-layers, and one issue does not magically bleed over to another. For example, a sexist reaction of certain parts of the internet, that threaten Richards has nothing to do with the two guys who made the double entendre.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.

Chris Clarke removed owlglass posts, but left Ichthyic comment

Owlglass, that comment of yours is so full of fail I don’t even know where to start.
let me just some it up with two words: Tu quoque run along and play now.

However, Ichthyic is --unsurprisingly-- wrong. Tu quoque would only apply if Clarke himself took pictures of strangers and then complained about the practice, and was then criticized for it. But in this case it was merely stated that there is a lack of consistency in their claims. The same issue can't be "exactly right" in one case, even burning allies for it, and then it magically becomes wrong, just because Clarke personally doesn't want people to take pictures from him.

[Apples]

Okay - I realize I may now need to renounce the Slymepit ... Thank you, Stephanie for steering me right ... I didn't realize before, but now it's clear things have gone Beyond The Pale .... Ophie has provided proof - Skepsheik doctored the photo of Ophie used in the Peezus and O cartoons. I am shaking and crying....

http://i.imgur.com/KsCSkhQ.jpg

Not only is the shirt a different color ... The eyes have been doctored. MENGELE!!!!! *faints*

((((gentlehugs))))) if you need/want them.

Heh. That actually feels pretty good. *squeeze* ... *pinch* ... *a little tongue in the ear* .... ah, much better. I'm okay now. Thanks, racisthatfleshypenis, I think I can go on now. :D

[Michael K Gray]

Oh yeah, I forgot about 'drongo'. That's another new (old) word I learned. :D
I have no idea though, what "Fair suck of the sav" or "Z'at slab in the esky" mean.

"Z'at slab in the esky"
"It is that package of 24 cans or bottles of beer in the portable icebox."

I think the second may also translate as "Giz ('give us', meaning 'give me') that package of 24...etc...".

I'm too Mozart to give a monkey's.
I just oiled my neck with a slab of Coopers.
You're my best mate ever.
Gis a hug ya old cunt!
And $20.

[ConcentratedH2O, OM]

Meyers's twin has posted about Google glasses, and his unique take on the matter: that at the moment, some people find the idea of being filmed and that film uploaded while talking to someone a little creepy. (*ahem. Donglegate. Ahem*)

Anyway, as you'd expect, Meyers's crew of commenters a re a tech savvy bunch, who look forward to scientific innovation, rather than being all Amish-like and wanting to live in the past.

Nerd of Redhead:

Not all of us expect to be hooked into your imaginary “cloud”.

Peezus Christ.

[Lurkion]

I just need to check with people here.
Which side is Ophelia Benson on again?

Is she really so self-obsessed and oblivious to what people will get from viewing the actual cartoon (I'll give you a clue Ophelia, it's not the eyes), that she thinks the following story is good for her or her side?

http://www.freezepage.com/1364413116BGSRLDXGXP
http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... #more-7362

hahahahah

I also liked hjornbeck's comment:

Ooo, I find myself in a rare moment of disagreement with Benson.

Satire, when done correctly, can be pretty awesome. Wikipedia has an excellent entry on it:

Satire is a genre of literature, and sometimes graphic and performing arts, in which vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement. Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.

There is no minimal entry there; so long as you have power and are hypocritical, you can be a target of satire. Bloggers certainly fall within that range. So by wielding your power over the Atheism+ movement, Benson, you… are….

… and that’s where things go off the rails. In order to be a proper target of satire, you have to have some power over the creator. What power do you have over the average Slyme Pit member, Benson? Obviously very little, as they have no problems continuing to trash talk you on several blogs. And while you’re hypocritical about some things (as we all are), you have never marked yourself as a gatekeeper for A+. Straw people can’t be hypocrites.

These comics do not satirize you, they ridicule someone that has never existed outside of a person’s head. They satirize a delusion. THAT is why they fail as satire, as the criticism can only succeed if the person holding the delusion changes their mind.

Hmm. I suppose that technically makes these comics self-mockery….

Bolded bit is the best.

According to hj, it's only satire if:

1. you have some power over the creator (so that's why we can't ridicule Mahmoud Ahmadinejad!); and
2. the satire has to be strictly true.

Accordingly, domestic political reporting = satire and satire = domestic political reporting.

By this definition, Colbert is not a satirist because Republicans can say "I DIDN'T SAY EXACTLY THAT".

So not only are they changing the meaning of words like "misogynist" and "racist", they are changing the meaning of "satire".

For the real meaning of satire:

Satire is a genre of literature, and sometimes graphic and performing arts, in which vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.
A common feature of satire is strong irony or sarcasm—"in satire, irony is militant"[2]—but parody, burlesque, exaggeration,[3] juxtaposition, comparison, analogy, and double entendre are all frequently used in satirical speech and writing. This "militant" irony or sarcasm often professes to approve of (or at least accept as natural) the very things the satirist wishes to attack.

[KiwiInOz]

Oh yeah, I forgot about 'drongo'. That's another new (old) word I learned. :D
I have no idea though, what "Fair suck of the sav" or "Z'at slab in the esky" mean.

"Z'at slab in the esky"
"It is that package of 24 cans or bottles of beer in the portable icebox."

I think the second may also translate as "Giz ('give us', meaning 'give me') that package of 24...etc...".

I'm too Mozart to give a monkey's.
I just oiled my neck with a slab of Coopers.
You're my best mate ever.
Gis a hug ya old cunt!
And $20.

No wuckers mate.

[Steersman]

Did she really say that? Linky?

I thought the more damning case was Myers' "It works, bitches" which was, if I'm not mistaken, the title of one of his ScienceBlog posts ....

:suimouth:

:-) Nothing so extreme as that, old chap. Three “Hail Mary”s or, if you prefer, three “Hail Abbie”s, genuflecting to our honourary host if not patron "saint", will probably be sufficient. I only expect “them” to do that …. ;-)

[KiwiInOz]

All half proficient photoshoppers - North Korea needs you (again)

[Aneris]

[...] According to hj, it's only satire if:
1. you have some power over the creator (so that's why we can't ridicule Mahmoud Ahmadinejad!); and
2. the satire has to be strictly true. [...]

That's of course humbug. Though, it's certainly also about power and feeling powerless (e.g. your name is drawn through the misogynist grinder when the allegation still had some meaning). Their whining has, imo, a lot to do with lack of control. They also seem not to see that what happens to them, they allowed to happen to great many others, who now are more than happy to pay back twice. I don't know how often I was caricatured by their commentariat, misconstrued, claimed I did say something, quote-mined etc.

"It's Okay When We Do it" -- Unofficial FTB Slogan

[Steersman]

http://i.imgur.com/IQPolWw.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/T1zzEIV.jpg

bullseye

Did she really say that? Linky?

I thought the more damning case was Myers' "It works, bitches" which was, if I'm not mistaken, the title of one of his ScienceBlog posts ....

Well to be pedantic, he didn'y SAY that either.... :whistle:

You mean, actually verbalize it? True. But since it was the title of a blog post of his, I think that can be construed as a proverbial "reasonable facsimile" of "saying" it, particularly since, to be pedantic [ ;-) ], one dictionary definition of "say" is "to express in words", e.g., "what does the Bible say?":

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2006 ... s-bitches/

Ergo, PZ Myers, misogynist extraordinaire - at least, presumably, in the eyes of RadFem Central …. 

[welch]

Okay - I realize I may now need to renounce the Slymepit ... Thank you, Stephanie for steering me right ... I didn't realize before, but now it's clear things have gone Beyond The Pale .... Ophie has provided proof - Skepsheik doctored the photo of Ophie used in the Peezus and O cartoons. I am shaking and crying....

http://i.imgur.com/KsCSkhQ.jpg

Not only is the shirt a different color ... The eyes have been doctored. MENGELE!!!!! *faints*

HAAAHAAHAHAHAHAAH LET THE DICK SLAPPING BEGIN!

[welch]

I just need to check with people here.
Which side is Ophelia Benson on again?

Is she really so self-obsessed and oblivious to what people will get from viewing the actual cartoon (I'll give you a clue Ophelia, it's not the eyes), that she thinks the following story is good for her or her side?

http://www.freezepage.com/1364413116BGSRLDXGXP
http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... #more-7362

hahahahah

I also liked hjornbeck's comment:

Ooo, I find myself in a rare moment of disagreement with Benson.

Satire, when done correctly, can be pretty awesome. Wikipedia has an excellent entry on it:

Satire is a genre of literature, and sometimes graphic and performing arts, in which vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement. Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.

There is no minimal entry there; so long as you have power and are hypocritical, you can be a target of satire. Bloggers certainly fall within that range. So by wielding your power over the Atheism+ movement, Benson, you… are….

… and that’s where things go off the rails. In order to be a proper target of satire, you have to have some power over the creator. What power do you have over the average Slyme Pit member, Benson? Obviously very little, as they have no problems continuing to trash talk you on several blogs. And while you’re hypocritical about some things (as we all are), you have never marked yourself as a gatekeeper for A+. Straw people can’t be hypocrites.

These comics do not satirize you, they ridicule someone that has never existed outside of a person’s head. They satirize a delusion. THAT is why they fail as satire, as the criticism can only succeed if the person holding the delusion changes their mind.

Hmm. I suppose that technically makes these comics self-mockery….

Bolded bit is the best.

According to hj, it's only satire if:

1. you have some power over the creator (so that's why we can't ridicule Mahmoud Ahmadinejad!); and
2. the satire has to be strictly true.

Accordingly, domestic political reporting = satire and satire = domestic political reporting.

By this definition, Colbert is not a satirist because Republicans can say "I DIDN'T SAY EXACTLY THAT".

So not only are they changing the meaning of words like "misogynist" and "racist", they are changing the meaning of "satire".

For the real meaning of satire:

Satire is a genre of literature, and sometimes graphic and performing arts, in which vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.
A common feature of satire is strong irony or sarcasm—"in satire, irony is militant"[2]—but parody, burlesque, exaggeration,[3] juxtaposition, comparison, analogy, and double entendre are all frequently used in satirical speech and writing. This "militant" irony or sarcasm often professes to approve of (or at least accept as natural) the very things the satirist wishes to attack.

Right, because in Hornbeck's world, Fake Steve Jobs was a dismal failure.

[16bitheretic]

I just need to check with people here.
Which side is Ophelia Benson on again?

Is she really so self-obsessed and oblivious to what people will get from viewing the actual cartoon (I'll give you a clue Ophelia, it's not the eyes), that she thinks the following story is good for her or her side?

http://www.freezepage.com/1364413116BGSRLDXGXP
http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... #more-7362

True story: I never even heard of this series of cartoon strips until Ophelia posted a whole bunch of them on her blog. She advertised that to the world far better than even the creator did! :lol:

[welch]

I just need to check with people here.
Which side is Ophelia Benson on again?

Is she really so self-obsessed and oblivious to what people will get from viewing the actual cartoon (I'll give you a clue Ophelia, it's not the eyes), that she thinks the following story is good for her or her side?

http://www.freezepage.com/1364413116BGSRLDXGXP
http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... #more-7362

True story: I never even heard of this series of cartoon strips until Ophelia posted a whole bunch of them on her blog. She advertised that to the world far better than even the creator did! :lol:

Streisand Effect uber alles