Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

[cunt]

Tf00t's latest:

[youtube]uErxcm3ePBw[/youtube]

What a load of shit. He can't seriously be worried that anyones going to mistake that parody account for the real thing.

[JackSkeptic]

That's one of the things that annoys me so much. They act as if they are the only one's that 'care' and are 'hurting' yet they do sod all other than moan and wallow in self pity. I have a much greater respect for some of my fiends, some who are religious, who actually DO things to try and make the world better and never moan about it.

The sort of people I have respect for is this Autistic boy http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22477958 and this deaf guy who sailed round the world http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/a ... 2013_05_08

Imagine they had listened to the moaning, self pity and hand-wringing of the SJW'S?

Freudian slip there Jack??

Damn, I'd have not been caught as a Demon without you meddling kids.

[JackSkeptic]

Tf00t's latest:

[youtube]uErxcm3ePBw[/youtube]

What a load of shit. He can't seriously be worried that anyones going to mistake that parody account for the real thing.

The guys been at it for years. I tend to think TF is sick of people from FtB et al persistently giving the impression they are the only ones with offensive trolls. So rather than do a wall of hate he did this video. He also said it did not bother him even though he considered it crossed a line. That is not the same as crying over it week after week and trying to earn victim points.

[welch]

Folks here certainly seem a lot happier in general than the miserable cunts over on FfTB. They're always bitching about something - we're always laughing about something (often them...)

I, most certainly, have accumulated far more "pity points" in the health department than have the entire congregation of A+Theism, their families, and whatever poor suffering pets/animals thy may have chosen to torment.
But do I complain about it?
Yes.
But not for long, and only to friends, and even then: to seek a way out of it.
I, like most of the independent adults in this forum, do not seek to use our respective sufferings as currency in some sort of social game of Monopoly, where the winner is the one with the least fake money, and the most time in fake gaol.

I'd rather spend an eternity with the worst of the slymepit, than 10 seconds trapped in a lift with Setar, the Star Kunt.

That's one of the things that annoys me so much. They act as if they are the only one's that 'care' and are 'hurting' yet they do sod all other than moan and wallow in self pity. I have a much greater respect for some of my fiends, some who are religious, who actually DO things to try and make the world better and never moan about it.

The sort of people I have respect for is this Autistic boy http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22477958 and this deaf guy who sailed round the world http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/a ... 2013_05_08

Imagine they had listened to the moaning, self pity and hand-wringing of the SJW'S?

EVERYONE has bad times and shit flung at them, and none of it is "fair". It is what you do while it's happening and that you at least try to make things better that counts, not sitting around demanding you be handed everything so you can wallow in your misery without having to do fuck all on your own.

[cunt]

Tf00t's latest:

What a load of shit. He can't seriously be worried that anyones going to mistake that parody account for the real thing.

The guys been at it for years. I tend to think TF is sick of people from FtB et al persistently giving the impression they are the only ones with offensive trolls. So rather than do a wall of hate he did this video. He also said it did not bother him even though he considered it crossed a line. That is not the same as crying over it week after week and trying to earn victim points.

Don't try putting words in my mouth. I didn't say he was crying about it and trying to earn victim points. I said it was a load of shit, and it is.

[Guest]

No, really, you guys are pulling a prank on me? DeepInsideYourMind, Remusm8, I can see you!

(Sorry, slow friday morning after two consecutive holydays.)

More of a lurker. Though the whole 'deep rifts' stuff is quickly loosing it's entertainment value, really.

It's always been known they will self implode without any help from anyone else. The A+ forums have been an irrelevance for monthsever,

[cunt]

Hahahaha

[youtube]2PIhrUm1QL0[/youtube]

[Michael K Gray]

... The one community that would resist that is one like ours which at least has a loose association with being rational....

"Adult", rather than "rational", I think.

[deLurch]

Ray Comfort sends PeeZus a basket of food, and the pharyngulanhas analyze the meaning:

It's quite simple Ray must of seen PZ's announcement that he no longer considers himself a skeptic. From Ray's perspective the moment has finally arrived. PZ is only a few steps away from realizing the errors of his ways and accepting creationism and Jesus into his heart. /jk

[Michael K Gray]

Not everything has to be A Post About A Very Important Thing.
Fuck, I'd rather read something like that, with actual normal human feelings and excitement than the normal droning that goes on in there.

CHAPTER 12
I was excited when I got up this morning.
I felt my normal human, who was droning, for a few blissless minutes, only to realise that it was a dark and stormy evening.

CHAPTER 13
I sent my Unicorn (or Bi-corn) into that black knight to cheque it out.

CHAPTER 15
No Virgins!
(Fin)

(C) 104AD Greater Christina.

[Tigzy]

Mods.

I fucking HATE mods!

(Except Paul Weller, he's cool as fuck!)

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9 ... -VC9fEisxg

http://cache2.allpostersimages.com/p/LR ... irrors.jpg

[d4m10n]

No, really, you guys are pulling a prank on me? DeepInsideYourMind, Remusm8, I can see you!

(Sorry, slow friday morning after two consecutive holydays.)

More of a lurker. Though the whole 'deep rifts' stuff is quickly loosing it's entertainment value, really.

Granted. Lets find something else to mock.

If you're taking nominations, I recommend #radfem2013 and that lot. They are like the Alex Jones version of feminism, whereas the most histrionic of FtB feminists are more akin to Glenn Beck on a slow news day.

[Bhurzum]

Mods.

I fucking HATE mods!

(Except Paul Weller, he's cool as fuck!)

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9 ... -VC9fEisxg

http://cache2.allpostersimages.com/p/LR ... irrors.jpg

I'll counter you with this...

http://www.dlisted.com/files/rottennomore12.jpg

[Ericb]

Mods.

I fucking HATE mods!

(Except Paul Weller, he's cool as fuck!)

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9 ... -VC9fEisxg

http://cache2.allpostersimages.com/p/LR ... irrors.jpg

I'll counter you with this...

http://www.dlisted.com/files/rottennomore12.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.spinner.com/ ... 011309.jpg

[Ericb]

Hmmm, I wonder what this will inspire among the FTB crowd:

http://www.theprovince.com/entertainmen ... story.html

[Altair]

Is the "Dear Muslima..." a new kind of informal fallacy in (usually ethical) reasoning or just a subspecies of a more widely-known fallacy?

I think it is a ballroom dance ...

Please take your partners, for the Dear Muslima!

To me, it sounds like one of those columns where people write for advice.

"Dear Muslima,

blah, blah, blah,

Signed,
Confused in Chicago"

[Aneris]

Btw, what happened to Wonderist?

[ERV]

More Dear Muslimas

https://twitter.com/Crommunist/status/3 ... 9706980354

I find it rather interesting that Sylvia Browne for him and for Jen McCreight are no issue, because there are apparently more important things in the world, which are --puzzled together-- double entendres of someone in an elevator. That beats it. I rather think they should do drop all their stuff immediately and focus on Climate Change, then, or stop being hypocrites for a start.

That whole conversation is a gold mine of stupidity

https://imageshack.us/scaled/large/19/dearsylvia.png

Besides the obvious dear muslima they really should realize they're making, there's the part about people writing cheques for the people countering Sylvia Browne.

1) that's what skeptics do, they fight all kinds of pseudoscience and woo peddlers, not only the ones with the SJW approval, and 2) as far as I know, no one is getting any cheques to fight Browne.
The guy who runs the stop sylvia browne site is/was a member of the JREF forums and as far as I remember, he never got any money to fund it.

And Improbable Joe gets the medal to the stupid comment of the day

Why is there money to combat a single psychic, no money to combat poverty and injustice? ... I'm not gonna say it. NOT

Hmm, Joe, could it be that combating a single psychic would be exponentially cheaper than combating all of poverty and injustice?

(As an aside, they should really read Blag Hag, because Jen saidin 2011:

Thankfully another Pharyngulite said exactly what I was thinking:

Did you just make the argument that, since worse things are happening somewhere else, we have no right to try to fix things closer to home?

Another one for the list of cases where it's bad if someone else does it, but good if they do it.)

No money to combat poverty! ?How would you know that, Joe? I'll take a wild guess and say that people donate to skeptical organisations to stop Sylvia Browne and donate to other organisations, whose job it is to fight poverty, to fight poverty. You know, like you use your toothbrush to brush your teeth and the bogbrush to clean the bog, although you're welcome to switch that around.

Well, we could free up some money for poverty and injustice if ImprobableJoes wife sold off her 8-9 Coach bags (conservatively, ~$4000 right there) plus her 'other brands'. Coach manufactures all over Asia, btw, Im sure *THEY* dont have facilities of 'questionable' worker rights/ethics.

God these people are gross.

[LMU]

Is the "Dear Muslima..." a new kind of informal fallacy in (usually ethical) reasoning or just a subspecies of a more widely-known fallacy?

I think it is a ballroom dance ...

Please take your partners, for the Dear Muslima!

To me, it sounds like one of those columns where people write for advice.

"Dear Muslima,

blah, blah, blah,

Signed,
Confused in Chicago"

That could be a column or comic. Sort of like some of the onion columns maybe.

[Tigzy]

I'll counter you with this...

http://www.dlisted.com/files/rottennomore12.jpg

That would have actually carried some force...if the good Mr Lydon hadn't put all that naughtiness behind him and become big in property development.

[Tony Parsehole]

I'll counter you with this...

http://www.dlisted.com/files/rottennomore12.jpg

That would have actually carried some force...if the good Mr Lydon hadn't put all that naughtiness behind him and become big in property development.

Don't forget doing thso ultra-punk adverts for Countrytlife butter.
http://laughingsquid.com/wp-content/upl ... 154850.jpg

That'll show the establishment.

[Tony Parsehole]

That being said I do think John Lydon is awesome even if the Sex Pistols' music was a tad shit.

[Tigzy]

I do find it kind of ironic that took a mod - Bradley Wiggins - to win the Tour De France without taking any drugs.

[deLurch]

More of a lurker. Though the whole 'deep rifts' stuff is quickly loosing it's entertainment value, really.

Perhaps it is because PZ Myers has officially jumped the zebrafish.

[Southern]

Well, we could free up some money for poverty and injustice if ImprobableJoes wife sold off her 8-9 Coach bags (conservatively, ~$4000 right there) plus her 'other brands'. Coach manufactures all over Asia, btw, Im sure *THEY* dont have facilities of 'questionable' worker rights/ethics.

God these people are gross.

It's like some fat white idiot with a blog on the internet that I know, that presents himself as a Social Justice Paladin (because Warriors don't have shiny, holy powers), while at the same time declares himself as an Apple fan-fatso, and don't give a flying fuck to those drity chinamen that assemble his fucking iPhone for $10 a week in 12-hours workdays with no breaks or weekends.

Or like that BDSM erotica writer that loves her some ugly Fluevogs, not caring about how they are manufactured by Chinese workers probably being paid less that those making iPhones are.

(Fun Fact about the Expensive Foot Abominations: Per FAQ, they are Satan resistant, and famous Fluevogers is a thing that exists. Seriously.)

[Tigzy]

Re: Fluevogs - does anyone know how it's pronounced?

Is it flu-vogs or flu-way-vogs?

[Southern]

Is the "Dear Muslima..." a new kind of informal fallacy in (usually ethical) reasoning or just a subspecies of a more widely-known fallacy?

I think it is a ballroom dance ...

Please take your partners, for the Dear Muslima!

To me, it sounds like one of those columns where people write for advice.

"Dear Muslima,

blah, blah, blah,

Signed,
Confused in Chicago"

That could be a column or comic. Sort of like some of the onion columns maybe.

I guess I have a new Onion favorite news: Woman Sets Google Alert For Kevin Costner

[Cunning Punt]

Well, we could free up some money for poverty and injustice if ImprobableJoes wife sold off her 8-9 Coach bags (conservatively, ~$4000 right there) plus her 'other brands'. Coach manufactures all over Asia, btw, Im sure *THEY* dont have facilities of 'questionable' worker rights/ethics.

God these people are gross.

It's like some fat white idiot with a blog on the internet that I know, that presents himself as a Social Justice Paladin (because Warriors don't have shiny, holy powers), while at the same time declares himself as an Apple fan-fatso, and don't give a flying fuck to those drity chinamen that assemble his fucking iPhone for $10 a week in 12-hours workdays with no breaks or weekends.

Or like that BDSM erotica writer that loves her some ugly Fluevogs, not caring about how they are manufactured by Chinese workers probably being paid less that those making iPhones are.

(Fun Fact about the Expensive Foot Abominations: Per FAQ, they are Satan resistant, and famous Fluevogers is a thing that exists. Seriously.)

I thought ImprobableJoe was almost on the street himself. I read in his blog (6 months? 12 months ago?) that he had to sell his guitar, his pride and joy, to put food on the table. Yet his wife buys 1-2 new Coach bags per year. I see more conflation of the personal and political in this tweet than seems obvious at first glance.

[John Greg]

Tigzy, it is pronounced flu-voggs.

Those abominations originated up here in Vancouver Canada back in the late 70s when the single store was called Fox and Fluevog. In my opinion most of their designs have always crossed over from interesting and quirky to downright stupid. But that's just me.

[Jan Steen]

That ‘Dear Muslima’ represents some kind of fallacy is merely FTB/Skepchick* propaganda. They want to make you believe that ‘Dear Muslima’ is like saying that bad thing X is not worth considering because Y is worse. But that is not what it is. ‘Dear Muslima’ says that creating a flame war over a triviality is egotistical bullshit and that there are real problems to complain about in this world. There is no fallacy involved.

What pseudo-intellectuals like Improbable Joe, Crommunist, Jen Mcreight, etc. are doing is not pulling a ‘Dear Muslima’. They are actually saying that bad thing X can be ignored because there is this worse thing Y. That is blatantly fallacious reasoning.

* The name Skepchick is now dubbelplus ungood, isn’t it? When will they retire it?

[Tigzy]

Tigzy, it is pronounced flu-voggs.

Those abominations originated up here in Vancouver Canada back in the late 70s when the single store was called Fox and Fluevog. In my opinion most of their designs have always crossed over from interesting and quirky to downright stupid. But that's just me.

Flu-Voggs.

Why does that bring images of tiny aliens that wish to colonise the private parts of Earth women?

[Jan Steen]

Tigzy, it is pronounced flu-voggs.

Those abominations originated up here in Vancouver Canada back in the late 70s when the single store was called Fox and Fluevog. In my opinion most of their designs have always crossed over from interesting and quirky to downright stupid. But that's just me.

Flu-Voggs.

Why does that bring images of tiny aliens that wish to colonise the private parts of Earth women?

Maybe because subconsciously you read it as 'Vulvoggs'.

[Tigzy]

Maybe because subconsciously you read it as 'Vulvoggs'.

Probably more because I've heard women refer to their privates as the 'flue'.

Weirdly enough, it's not in Urban Dictionary.

[TedDahlberg]

Flu-Voggs.

Why does that bring images of tiny aliens that wish to colonise the private parts of Earth women?

Which in turn reminds me of captain Kirk, who quite coincidentally is one of the main characters in a certain Star Trek Into Darkness, which I just got back from watching. (Hmm, that went so smoothly I'm sure no one noticed my clever topic-changing ruse.)
Damn it was good. I liked the first one (despite the "red matter") but this one is approximately 17.4 times better. Some elements of the plot were slightly obvious but still well handled and connected nicely to the original series/movies. And also provided some (I thought) interesting character development. I'm impressed at how well it all worked. And it had some good jokes sprinkled throughout.

Also, it has Sherlock Holmes and Robocop.

[AbsurdWalls]

Btw, what happened to Wonderist?

He's still reading that post I wrote.

[Tony Parsehole]

Wow.
Fluevogs.
People actually rip off cancer donations for this shit?
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/imag ... hdsryXulT6

[Southern]

Wow.
Fluevogs.
People actually rip off cancer donations for this shit?
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/imag ... hdsryXulT6

I love this:

http://www.fluevog.com/code/?pp=1&view= ... ourID=3798

THIRTY BUCKS FOR A FUCKING LOGO BUCKLE!

Oh, and this, for US$ 299 plus taxes:

http://i.imgur.com/uvJzRKu.jpg

Probably suited for wearing with a Doppler Effect costume:

[Tony Parsehole]

I don't always combat poverty but when I do I wear FLUEVOGS

[Tony Parsehole]

I know Fluevogs are generally fucking awful but this pair is just lovely:

http://www.foodsubs.com/Photos/citaliansausage.jpg
They look really comfortable too.

[Al Stefanelli]

Hey, don't these guys wear 'Vogs?

[youtube]zKD7g56DNN0[/youtube]

[Tony Parsehole]

http://weknowmemes.com/generator/upload ... 962175.jpg

[Barael]

I do find it kind of ironic that took a mod - Bradley Wiggins - to win the Tour De France without taking any drugs.

Is that like the Special Olympics version of Tour de France?

[Southern]

I do find it kind of ironic that took a mod - Bradley Wiggins - to win the Tour De France without taking any drugs.

Is that like the Special Olympics version of Tour de France?

Is the deliberate Tour de France?

[AbsurdWalls]

I do find it kind of ironic that took a mod - Bradley Wiggins - to win the Tour De France without taking any drugs.

Is that like the Special Olympics version of Tour de France?

Is the deliberate Tour de France?

Trifle everywhere.

[windy]

No, really, you guys are pulling a prank on me? DeepInsideYourMind, Remusm8, I can see you!

(Sorry, slow friday morning after two consecutive holydays.)

More of a lurker. Though the whole 'deep rifts' stuff is quickly loosing it's entertainment value, really.

Other signs of the End Times: The question of the brown-ness of Muslims has spurred a bit of robust discussion on A+ and not even a pointed throat-clearing by ceepolk has shut things down yet. Beginnings of Glasnost?

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4672

Of course, Setar doesn't disappoint, trying to counter a point about ancient Greek mathematics by pointing to Omar Khayyam's mathematical work. wtf, you do realize there was more than a thousand years between them? And that Muslim scholars of the period were heavily influenced by ancient Greek texts?

But, now that they mention it, some of Khayyam's work does seem relevant to A+...

These fools, by dint of ignorance most crass,
Think they in wisdom all mankind surpass;
And glibly do they damn as infidel
Whoever is not, like themselves, an ass.

[Pitchguest]

Yemisi of YEMMYnisting has a very short fuse it seems, accusing me being patronizing for assuming she knew nothing about A+ when she sheepishly asked this question in the opening paragraph:

"I do not know what the hullaballoo is about Atheism+, why all the hate and tantrums?"

and offered her some friendly advice of acquiring more information, giving her the benefit of the doubt. (She also objected to my giving her the benefit of the doubt.) Now as it turns out she did know about A+, the history around it, and she's even been a member on the forum since its inception. So one has to wonder why she even asked that question in the first place, but that didn't stop her from having a go at me.

It was all very ridiculous, but at least she said this at the end of her rant, which I will hold her to and gave me a bit of hope she's not just another Taslima or Ophelia:

"I hate gossips, it is not an endearing trait."

Looking forward to your not gossip, Yemisi.

[BarnOwl]

Well, we could free up some money for poverty and injustice if ImprobableJoes wife sold off her 8-9 Coach bags (conservatively, ~$4000 right there) plus her 'other brands'. Coach manufactures all over Asia, btw, Im sure *THEY* dont have facilities of 'questionable' worker rights/ethics.

God these people are gross.

It's like some fat white idiot with a blog on the internet that I know, that presents himself as a Social Justice Paladin (because Warriors don't have shiny, holy powers), while at the same time declares himself as an Apple fan-fatso, and don't give a flying fuck to those drity chinamen that assemble his fucking iPhone for $10 a week in 12-hours workdays with no breaks or weekends.

Or like that BDSM erotica writer that loves her some ugly Fluevogs, not caring about how they are manufactured by Chinese workers probably being paid less that those making iPhones are.

(Fun Fact about the Expensive Foot Abominations: Per FAQ, they are Satan resistant, and famous Fluevogers is a thing that exists. Seriously.)

I would say that their lack of interest in or engagement with real social justice issues is puzzling, but that would be dishonest, because it really isn't puzzling at all. Any change that might inconvenience them slightly, or require even a small change in personal style and pleasure, and it's rejected out of hand.

With the Rana Plaza building collapse that killed over 1000 garment workers in Bangladesh, and fires in other factories that killed dozens more, the ethical implications of buying clothing and accessories from retailers who are supplied by unscrupulous and abusive company owners should be of major concern to anyone interested in social justice.

Identifying environmentally responsible and socially just sources of food and personal care products is a leisurely walk in the park, compared to finding ethically-sourced clothing. Sew you own clothes? OK, but where did the fabric come from? Knit/crochet your own clothes? Yeah, working on it, but production is slow, and hampered by having a 50+ hours per week job. I've been struggling with this over the last few years, and it would be great to read about how other people deal with the issue, even if those "other people" are FtBers or A+ers. I thought for sure Greta would be all over the ethically-sourced clothing issue, like a hungry vegan on chia pudding. But it seems they're about as concerned as the shopper quoted in this story:

http://www.theatlantic.com/internationa ... ts/275765/

[welch]

Yemisi of YEMMYnisting has a very short fuse it seems, accusing me being patronizing for assuming she knew nothing about A+ when she sheepishly asked this question in the opening paragraph:

"I do not know what the hullaballoo is about Atheism+, why all the hate and tantrums?"

and offered her some friendly advice of acquiring more information, giving her the benefit of the doubt. (She also objected to my giving her the benefit of the doubt.) Now as it turns out she did know about A+, the history around it, and she's even been a member on the forum since its inception. So one has to wonder why she even asked that question in the first place, but that didn't stop her from having a go at me.

It was all very ridiculous, but at least she said this at the end of her rant, which I will hold her to and gave me a bit of hope she's not just another Taslima or Ophelia:

"I hate gossips, it is not an endearing trait."

Looking forward to your not gossip, Yemisi.

Well, given her assumption she knows why everyone is against A+, she would in fact be a subject matter expert on patronization.

[Pitchguest]

Oops, forgot to link to the post:

http://freethoughtblogs.com/yemmynistin ... omment-222

Interestingly the full quote is thus:

And my friendly advice to you is, remember, great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small mind discuss people. It seems you are more interested in discussing people and events more than the ideas, I hate gossips, it is not an endearing trait.

Which oolon doesn't seem to pay any mind to, at all, when he discusses johngreg. It also strikes me as rather patronizing, but I'll give her that. I don't want to burn our bridges just yet.

[AspiringAxeMurderer]

Hahahaha

[youtube]2PIhrUm1QL0[/youtube]

Ah fuck, the only thing I could here from Brett Keane is him gargling his own shit. I find it funny that TF00t is throwing a temper tantrum because Coughlan or his friends are fucking with him, I would've thought by now that ThunderF00t would have gotten used to this kind of stuff, but I guess good ol' Coughlan must get under his skin.

And it's a shame that Coughlan got flagged over this shit.

[welch]

Well, we could free up some money for poverty and injustice if ImprobableJoes wife sold off her 8-9 Coach bags (conservatively, ~$4000 right there) plus her 'other brands'. Coach manufactures all over Asia, btw, Im sure *THEY* dont have facilities of 'questionable' worker rights/ethics.

God these people are gross.

It's like some fat white idiot with a blog on the internet that I know, that presents himself as a Social Justice Paladin (because Warriors don't have shiny, holy powers), while at the same time declares himself as an Apple fan-fatso, and don't give a flying fuck to those drity chinamen that assemble his fucking iPhone for $10 a week in 12-hours workdays with no breaks or weekends.

Or like that BDSM erotica writer that loves her some ugly Fluevogs, not caring about how they are manufactured by Chinese workers probably being paid less that those making iPhones are.

(Fun Fact about the Expensive Foot Abominations: Per FAQ, they are Satan resistant, and famous Fluevogers is a thing that exists. Seriously.)

I would say that their lack of interest in or engagement with real social justice issues is puzzling, but that would be dishonest, because it really isn't puzzling at all. Any change that might inconvenience them slightly, or require even a small change in personal style and pleasure, and it's rejected out of hand.

With the Rana Plaza building collapse that killed over 1000 garment workers in Bangladesh, and fires in other factories that killed dozens more, the ethical implications of buying clothing and accessories from retailers who are supplied by unscrupulous and abusive company owners should be of major concern to anyone interested in social justice.

Identifying environmentally responsible and socially just sources of food and personal care products is a leisurely walk in the park, compared to finding ethically-sourced clothing. Sew you own clothes? OK, but where did the fabric come from? Knit/crochet your own clothes? Yeah, working on it, but production is slow, and hampered by having a 50+ hours per week job. I've been struggling with this over the last few years, and it would be great to read about how other people deal with the issue, even if those "other people" are FtBers or A+ers. I thought for sure Greta would be all over the ethically-sourced clothing issue, like a hungry vegan on chia pudding. But it seems they're about as concerned as the shopper quoted in this story:

http://www.theatlantic.com/internationa ... ts/275765/

I had one tit tell me it was impossible to make a shirt that only costs five pounds in Britain, because the minimum wage is around seven pounds.

My first thought, once I recovered from the stupid was "I'm sorry, the industrial revolution, you may have heard of it?"

[welch]

Oops, forgot to link to the post:

http://freethoughtblogs.com/yemmynistin ... omment-222

Interestingly the full quote is thus:

And my friendly advice to you is, remember, great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small mind discuss people. It seems you are more interested in discussing people and events more than the ideas, I hate gossips, it is not an endearing trait.

Which oolon doesn't seem to pay any mind to, at all, when he discusses johngreg. It also strikes me as rather patronizing, but I'll give her that. I don't want to burn our bridges just yet.

So when she talks shit about everyone not in love with A+, that makes her a rather small minded person?

[Pitchguest]

Yemisi of YEMMYnisting has a very short fuse it seems, accusing me being patronizing for assuming she knew nothing about A+ when she sheepishly asked this question in the opening paragraph:

"I do not know what the hullaballoo is about Atheism+, why all the hate and tantrums?"

and offered her some friendly advice of acquiring more information, giving her the benefit of the doubt. (She also objected to my giving her the benefit of the doubt.) Now as it turns out she did know about A+, the history around it, and she's even been a member on the forum since its inception. So one has to wonder why she even asked that question in the first place, but that didn't stop her from having a go at me.

It was all very ridiculous, but at least she said this at the end of her rant, which I will hold her to and gave me a bit of hope she's not just another Taslima or Ophelia:

"I hate gossips, it is not an endearing trait."

Looking forward to your not gossip, Yemisi.

Well, given her assumption she knows why everyone is against A+, she would in fact be a subject matter expert on patronization.

I thought about mentioning that, but I didn't want to come off as the agitator. Better they realise themselves they've shot themselves in the foot, rather than me constantly pointing it out.

[welch]

Yemisi of YEMMYnisting has a very short fuse it seems, accusing me being patronizing for assuming she knew nothing about A+ when she sheepishly asked this question in the opening paragraph:

"I do not know what the hullaballoo is about Atheism+, why all the hate and tantrums?"

and offered her some friendly advice of acquiring more information, giving her the benefit of the doubt. (She also objected to my giving her the benefit of the doubt.) Now as it turns out she did know about A+, the history around it, and she's even been a member on the forum since its inception. So one has to wonder why she even asked that question in the first place, but that didn't stop her from having a go at me.

It was all very ridiculous, but at least she said this at the end of her rant, which I will hold her to and gave me a bit of hope she's not just another Taslima or Ophelia:

"I hate gossips, it is not an endearing trait."

Looking forward to your not gossip, Yemisi.

Well, given her assumption she knows why everyone is against A+, she would in fact be a subject matter expert on patronization.

I thought about mentioning that, but I didn't want to come off as the agitator. Better they realise themselves they've shot themselves in the foot, rather than me constantly pointing it out.

you...expect...them to...realize...something?

I hate to point out the obvious, but they do well to realize they need to drop their drawers before pooping. You're expecting a level of awareness out of them they've never shown any ability to meet.

[Pitchguest]

I know. I'm pretty sure that will be my bane some day.

[Dave]

And Improbable Joe gets the medal to the stupid comment of the day

Why is there money to combat a single psychic, no money to combat poverty and injustice? ... I'm not gonna say it. NOT

"WHY AREN'T YOU GUYS GIVING ALL YOUR MONEY TO THE CAUSES I FIND MOST IMPORTANT!!!!????"

It's like seeing a animal rights activist join the Red Cross and then start loudly whining about how the Red Cross and it's donors and volunteers are selfish and even a bit evil because they primarily work with taking care of humans and don't care enough about all the poor, suffering animals... How much will it really take before people just go "You know what, why don't you go join PETA over there? Here's their address, now please fuck off and don't come back, kthxbai?"

I am very involved with a local charity. Since only a few of us are full-time charity professionals, one of the things we do it bring in a consultant/trainer every couple of years to give us advice on how to run the charity and how to make it more effective, how to better raise money, etc. One of the key points every consultant gives is to be wary of mission creep: Know your mission and focus on your mission. Donors want to know that their money is going towards the sort of things they are concerned about, so they seek out charities who are known for doing what the donors are concerned about.

I am also connected to parts of the venture capital world. One piece of advice that VC's often give startups is pick a strategy and focus on it, it may change, it probably will, but focus on your strategy and dont try to do to many things at once. Some even go so far as to say that one of the worst things that can happen to a startup is it gets too much money: they lose focus and start to work on every idea they ever had, and never get any of them off the ground.

What do A+ers and FTBers do? They jump from one issue to the next -- Its Atheism, it Feminism, its Rape, its Poverty, its Cancer, its Injustice! Its Fluevogs! These twits have the attention-span of a tse-tse fly with ADD.

[Tigzy]

I know. I'm pretty sure that will be my bane some day.

She's got more A+ apologia up - some tl;dr thing I couldn't be arsed to read fully. A link, for the benefit of the pit's masochist community: http://freethoughtblogs.com/yemmynistin ... confusing/

Only on FTB can we go from that tired old Christian expenditure 'Can you be a good person without God?' to 'Can you be a good atheist without Atheism Plus?'

[Southern]

Well, we could free up some money for poverty and injustice if ImprobableJoes wife sold off her 8-9 Coach bags (conservatively, ~$4000 right there) plus her 'other brands'. Coach manufactures all over Asia, btw, Im sure *THEY* dont have facilities of 'questionable' worker rights/ethics.

God these people are gross.

It's like some fat white idiot with a blog on the internet that I know, that presents himself as a Social Justice Paladin (because Warriors don't have shiny, holy powers), while at the same time declares himself as an Apple fan-fatso, and don't give a flying fuck to those drity chinamen that assemble his fucking iPhone for $10 a week in 12-hours workdays with no breaks or weekends.

Or like that BDSM erotica writer that loves her some ugly Fluevogs, not caring about how they are manufactured by Chinese workers probably being paid less that those making iPhones are.

(Fun Fact about the Expensive Foot Abominations: Per FAQ, they are Satan resistant, and famous Fluevogers is a thing that exists. Seriously.)

I would say that their lack of interest in or engagement with real social justice issues is puzzling, but that would be dishonest, because it really isn't puzzling at all. Any change that might inconvenience them slightly, or require even a small change in personal style and pleasure, and it's rejected out of hand.

With the Rana Plaza building collapse that killed over 1000 garment workers in Bangladesh, and fires in other factories that killed dozens more, the ethical implications of buying clothing and accessories from retailers who are supplied by unscrupulous and abusive company owners should be of major concern to anyone interested in social justice.

Identifying environmentally responsible and socially just sources of food and personal care products is a leisurely walk in the park, compared to finding ethically-sourced clothing. Sew you own clothes? OK, but where did the fabric come from? Knit/crochet your own clothes? Yeah, working on it, but production is slow, and hampered by having a 50+ hours per week job. I've been struggling with this over the last few years, and it would be great to read about how other people deal with the issue, even if those "other people" are FtBers or A+ers. I thought for sure Greta would be all over the ethically-sourced clothing issue, like a hungry vegan on chia pudding. But it seems they're about as concerned as the shopper quoted in this story:

http://www.theatlantic.com/internationa ... ts/275765/

Well, if that happens, Macklemore already gave us the solution to the problem:

[youtube]QK8mJJJvaes[/youtube]

[Badger3k]

I know. I'm pretty sure that will be my bane some day.

She's got more A+ apologia up - some tl;dr thing I couldn't be arsed to read fully. A link, for the benefit of the pit's masochist community: http://freethoughtblogs.com/yemmynistin ... confusing/

Only on FTB can we go from that tired old Christian expenditure 'Can you be a good person without God?' to 'Can you be a good atheist without Atheism Plus?'

I think they get a bit confused on the whole atheism issue, or at least see it vastly different than (I believe) more or most other people. Maybe it's a remnant of the whole Christian identity thing (not the political/social movement) - I often hear people say they are Christians first. Their religion comes first in their identity. These people seem to be so lacking in other things, that the mere fact they don't believe in gods is their central defining characteristic, and they have to place that first. I'm an atheist, sure, but I'm a lot of other things, and my atheism is not that central to me - I'd go with skeptic or humanist before atheist, since atheism only covers one facet, while the other labels cover more things. It just seems a bit sad or pathetic that "I don't believe in deities" is the big highlight of who you are.

I saw PZs bit on (IIRC) atheists who knit, who want to form a splinter group on atheist knitters - I just don't see a point. I'm here in the middle of Texas, and while the whole religion thing is big, more people don't seem to care - my students generally don't. They're curious, and I can't go into much detail, but they know the basics (even if I have to correct a few misconceptions). If I wanted to knit, or work leather (which I just started learning a few years ago before falling out of it), I don't need a group of atheists around me to do it. Why? Unless we start the activities with a prayer, or praise god every few minutes, the whole religion thing is a non-issue. Maybe I'm just not that social, but I just don't see the point. Is there something I'm missing?

[Badger3k]

I think Sara Mayhew makes a good point with this post, especially the money shot:

What’s really going on when you want ideas from your social or political views added (+) to skepticism is that you want those ideas protected from skepticism. But the point and greatest strength of skepticism is that it is critical of all -isms. All of them. When you start wanting your ideas protected from criticism, that’s when you stop being a skeptic.