Bleeding from the Bunghole

Old subthreads
James Caruthers
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8041

Post by James Caruthers »

Southern wrote:
Aren't those guys the same ones Matt Dillahaunty said that were very "sex positive" people?

Matt, you fat, lying cunt.
Well I'm sure Matt's wife is very sex positive in the sense that she has sex with him as long as he treats her asshole friends nicely and laughs it off every time they shit in his face.

Seriously, I think some feminists think that all "sex positive" means is the woman enjoys having sex. It's about a whole hell of a lot more than that. :lol:

A good litmus test is to ask a woman how she feels about pornography. There's no way for a sex-negative feminist to pass this test. If she lies, her own actions will "out" her.

Brive1987
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8042

Post by Brive1987 »

ROBOKiTTY wrote:
heddle wrote:Holy crap http://freethoughtblogs.com/carrier Carrier is a ditz. He cannot post anything without a healthy component of “Richard Carrier is a super genius.” Here is making his senior thesis available, presumably for those (see his sidebar) avid fans that span the entire world. He thoughtfully tells us that his thesis contains “interesting insights and information” (of course it does!) and that “it’s quite good (so modest!) and “it probably won me my doctoral fellowship” (but I've done so many great things it's hard to credit just one of 'em!).

He also points his readers to Academia.edu, not because it is generally useful but because “it has become my main collection of entries for my more formal work online and in print; although just print publications I keep updated on my cv and publications list, which is the same list but without the rest of the cv.” Again, so thoughtful.

Barf. His writing is the intellectual equivalent of unsuccessful root canal: great pain for no final benefit except a feeling of nausea and the regret of time wasted.
I've looked at Carrier's site. I always thought he was an arrogant bonehead, but wow, is he full of himself. Almost every mention of his name comes with Dr or PhD affixed or some other praise item, and he has this gem on the page where he begs for money:
Richard Carrier wrote:If you want to hire me to research and write something, contact me about terms, but please know I am rarely available and my services are very expensive.
Can anyone work out his h-index? According to his CV, he got his PhD in 2008 and doesn't seem to have done a postdoc, and most of his publications seem to be in the popular press. Just how credible is this guy?
I always got the impression he was more an Internet hero than Ivy League. I guess piling in with the Christ Myth / Bible Geek crowd will limit your legitimacy - EXPELLED! It seems he has always had a predilection for ideological stances over pure rationality.

disumbrationist
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8043

Post by disumbrationist »

ROBOKiTTY wrote: Can anyone work out his h-index? According to his CV, he got his PhD in 2008 and doesn't seem to have done a postdoc, and most of his publications seem to be in the popular press. Just how credible is this guy?
The above also applies roughly to Sam Harris. The difference in credibility is due precisely to the vastly different quality of their publications in the popular press.

Percentage
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8044

Post by Percentage »

BillHamp wrote:
Guest wrote:
BillHamp wrote:To hell with all of them. I would not attend an event where Watson was speaking. I think that goes for a lot of atheists. Dawkins probably understands what a polarizing figure she is and wants no part of it. He's much smarter than she is, which is why most eveyone will dump her in favor of him. Sometimes, there is justice in the world. This was one of those times.
Considering Sam Harris has dubbed PZ himself as a "Shepherd of Internet Trolls", it really is bizarre that they can't understand why Dawkins would want to disassociate with one of theirs.

Yes, a good point. I think, were Hitchens still alive, he would have something equally awesome to say. In the end, PZ and his ilk are an entertaining side show. No one really cares what they have to say. No one who cares about the atheist movement wants to be assoicated with any of them because they send the wrong message. They're entertaining, that is all.
I do sometimes wonder what Hitchens would have made of all this- and were he still alive, he'd probably have commented by now, what with everything leaking over into the real world and the big names getting involved.

You know, I think he'd be more even-handed than we might think- but he did despise identity politics, so he wouldn't be an SJW. I dunno. I'm sure it would make for considerable hilarity.

God damn, I miss Hitch.

katamari Damassi
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8045

Post by katamari Damassi »

Percentage wrote:
BillHamp wrote:To hell with all of them. I would not attend an event where Watson was speaking. I think that goes for a lot of atheists. Dawkins probably understands what a polarizing figure she is and wants no part of it. He's much smarter than she is, which is why most eveyone will dump her in favor of him. Sometimes, there is justice in the world. This was one of those times.

Yes, a good point. I think, were Hitchens still alive, he would have something equally awesome to say. In the end, PZ and his ilk are an entertaining side show. No one really cares what they have to say. No one who cares about the atheist movement wants to be assoicated with any of them because they send the wrong message. They're entertaining, that is all.
I do sometimes wonder what Hitchens would have made of all this- and were he still alive, he'd probably have commented by now, what with everything leaking over into the real world and the big names getting involved.

You know, I think he'd be more even-handed than we might think- but he did despise identity politics, so he wouldn't be an SJW. I dunno. I'm sure it would make for considerable hilarity.

God damn, I miss Hitch.
[/quote]
Hitch would've been writing about Syria and Russia. Insignificunts like Lyers and Twatson wouldn't be a blip on his radar.

decius
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8046

Post by decius »

Mordy,, she's indeed the same LordPasternack from the early days, without any intervening sex reassignment.

Perhaps, you simply assumed her to be a man from her nym. I would be surprised if she truly managed to combine her much advertised passion for blowjobs with her insane obsession with Dawkins, although the latter now appears to have substantially degraded qualitatively

She still describes herself as a Divine Knob Twiddler", who " would be willing to have a fair blow-off - on any willing man/men".

http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... &start=735

ROBOKiTTY
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8047

Post by ROBOKiTTY »

disumbrationist wrote:
ROBOKiTTY wrote: Can anyone work out his h-index? According to his CV, he got his PhD in 2008 and doesn't seem to have done a postdoc, and most of his publications seem to be in the popular press. Just how credible is this guy?
The above also applies roughly to Sam Harris. The difference in credibility is due precisely to the vastly different quality of their publications in the popular press.
I'm not familiar with Sam Harris' work yet -- his books are next on my list after I'm finished with Neil deGrasse Tyson. From what little I've read from his blog though, he certainly doesn't seem anywhere near as self-absorbed as Richard "Intellectual Artillery :snooty:" Carrier.

Zenspace
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8048

Post by Zenspace »

..... aaaand... the last word comes from Neil Terry:

Yes, disagreeing with professional shit-stirrers is now "idol worship".......lols, you idiotic assholes are fucking hilarious. I couldn't give a rat's ass about Dawkins, but am I supposed to blame him for having common sense? Who the fuck in their right mind would want to be around Watson? Are people really falling all over themselves for the chance to be around someone who will write an outraged bullshit blog post sliming you as soon as you don't kiss her ass the right way?

The simple truth is that after every manufactured poutrage session and witch hunt, more and more people are just fucking sick to death of the whole bunch of you toxic, dishonest, hypocritical, shit-flinging parasites, and are glad to see you gone from any place you leave.
Zenspace wrote:That, <sniffle>, was just, so, so, soooooo beautiful! :clap:
Guest wrote: i am disappointed in the lack of frothing

also

WHAT THE UTTER FUCK IS LADEN POSSESSED BY?????
froth1.jpg
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Fixed.

free thoughtpolice
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8049

Post by free thoughtpolice »

katamari Damassi wrote:
Percentage wrote:
BillHamp wrote:To hell with all of them. I would not attend an event where Watson was speaking. I think that goes for a lot of atheists. Dawkins probably understands what a polarizing figure she is and wants no part of it. He's much smarter than she is, which is why most eveyone will dump her in favor of him. Sometimes, there is justice in the world. This was one of those times.

Yes, a good point. I think, were Hitchens still alive, he would have something equally awesome to say. In the end, PZ and his ilk are an entertaining side show. No one really cares what they have to say. No one who cares about the atheist movement wants to be assoicated with any of them because they send the wrong message. They're entertaining, that is all.
I do sometimes wonder what Hitchens would have made of all this- and were he still alive, he'd probably have commented by now, what with everything leaking over into the real world and the big names getting involved.

You know, I think he'd be more even-handed than we might think- but he did despise identity politics, so he wouldn't be an SJW. I dunno. I'm sure it would make for considerable hilarity.

He (Hitchens) may have snivelled about how he was objectified when Watson confronted him at close range and offered to bear his children. Or not.
Unlike Dawkins he was only a potential victim, she didn't manage to insert her parasitic probe into him before he died.

God damn, I miss Hitch.
Hitch would've been writing about Syria and Russia. Insignificunts like Lyers and Twatson wouldn't be a blip on his radar.[/quote]

Pitchguest
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8050

Post by Pitchguest »

The Black Zvan still sticks with Dalgleish, while simultaneously being unsure of its veracity.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... ent-625179

I'd like to know who this RDFRS employee (former or otherwise) is. Maybe Dalgleish knows.

free thoughtpolice
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8051

Post by free thoughtpolice »

Those quotes didn't work out . Please ignore.

Lsuoma
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8052

Post by Lsuoma »

Percentage wrote:
I do sometimes wonder what Hitchens would have made of all this- and were he still alive, he'd probably have commented by now, what with everything leaking over into the real world and the big names getting involved.

You know, I think he'd be more even-handed than we might think- but he did despise identity politics, so he wouldn't be an SJW. I dunno. I'm sure it would make for considerable hilarity.

God damn, I miss Hitch.
I would have made him a mod here...

mordacious1
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8053

Post by mordacious1 »

decius wrote:Mordy,, she's indeed the same LordPasternack from the early days, without any intervening sex reassignment.

Perhaps, you simply assumed her to be a man from her nym. I would be surprised if she truly managed to combine her much advertised passion for blowjobs with her insane obsession with Dawkins, although the latter now appears to have substantially degraded qualitatively

She still describes herself as a Divine Knob Twiddler", who " would be willing to have a fair blow-off - on any willing man/men".

http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... &start=735
Thanks decius. Hope everything's well with you. What's confusing me is this:

http://old.richarddawkins.net/profiles/16409

Where it clearly states that lordpasternack is a male, maybe a bit of subterfuge on her part. He/she was never *cough* one of my favorite people over there. I rarely read the forums and only read Rationalia for the first week of its existence (not my cup of tea), so I didn't know him/her that well.

It doesn't really matter except I like to keep up on my soap opera actors so I know who is who.

Cheers!

Verklagekasper
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8054

Post by Verklagekasper »

A couple of days ago on dailydot.com, some crazed feminist called Aja Romano published an article named "How a merch table dispute at Dragon Con netted an alleged rapist $6000". Confronted with evidence proving that the subject alone was bullshit, she renamed the article into "The online atheist community keeps pushing away its feminist supporters".
It tells a lot about the bullshit level of dailydot.com that articles have to be renamed. That, and the fact that the anti-tracking tool Ghostery reports no less than 15 tracking links on that page. Anyway, I noticed a comment from Babara Drescher:
Barbara A. Drescher
Let's clear the air about one thing that really, really bothers me. It's something I see often: <blockquote>Skeptics created #Tablegateand filled it with mockery, made fun of Watson's supporters, accused her oftantrum-throwing, alleged that her only real job is to create "manufactroversies," and criticized her for "whining, entitlement, and vindictiveness." </blockquote>

"Skeptics" didn't do this. A few assholes who may or may not call themselves "skeptics" did this. The same goes for "members of the skeptics community" who "seem to reserve all of theirs for the women in their midst". What evidence do you have that these are accepted "members of the community"? They are certainly not members of MY community. ...
Really? People accusing Watson of tantrum-throwing and critcizing her for whining, entitlement, and vindictivenes are just "a few assholes"? Color me an asshole then, Barbara Drescher. Actually, by your own assessment, you must be an asshole, too. Because not long ago, when Ron Lindsay got flak for his opening speach at Women in Secularism, you prided yourself on your FB page of having told him before to keep the FTB/Skepchick bunch out of CFI. Don't be an opportunist.

decius
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8055

Post by decius »

mordacious1 wrote: Thanks decius. Hope everything's well with you. What's confusing me is this:

http://old.richarddawkins.net/profiles/16409

Where it clearly states that lordpasternack is a male, maybe a bit of subterfuge on her part. He/she was never *cough* one of my favorite people over there. I rarely read the forums and only read Rationalia for the first week of its existence (not my cup of tea), so I didn't know him/her that well.

It doesn't really matter except I like to keep up on my soap opera actors so I know who is who.

Cheers!
Yes dear, all fine, and you?

I didn't remember that profile. However, an unnamed someone met her in person at one of Dawk's event in Oxford.
It's the same gal since at least 2008, guaranteed.

decius
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8056

Post by decius »

Verklagekasper wrote:
Really? People accusing Watson of tantrum-throwing and critcizing her for whining, entitlement, and vindictivenes are just "a few assholes"? Color me an asshole then, Barbara Drescher. Actually, by your own assessment, you must be an asshole, too. Because not long ago, when Ron Lindsay got flak for his opening speach at Women in Secularism, you prided yourself on your FB page of having told him before to keep the FTB/Skepchick bunch out of CFI. Don't be an opportunist.

Nice catch, there.
Send a tweet or two her way, as she appears to be part of your intended audience. Here you won't reach her, in any case.

Sulman
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8057

Post by Sulman »

Verklagekasper wrote:
Really? People accusing Watson of tantrum-throwing and critcizing her for whining, entitlement, and vindictivenes are just "a few assholes"? Color me an asshole then, Barbara Drescher. Actually, by your own assessment, you must be an asshole, too. Because not long ago, when Ron Lindsay got flak for his opening speach at Women in Secularism, you prided yourself on your FB page of having told him before to keep the FTB/Skepchick bunch out of CFI. Don't be an opportunist.
I think Drescher is just sick of the drama. She hinted last week it should be about the work.

decius
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8058

Post by decius »

Sulman wrote: I think Drescher is just sick of the drama. She hinted last week it should be about the work.
That doesn't make her statement acceptable or even coherent.

mordacious1
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8059

Post by mordacious1 »

decius wrote:
mordacious1 wrote: <axed>

Yes dear, all fine, and you?

I didn't remember that profile. However, an unnamed someone met her in person at one of Dawk's event in Oxford.
It's the same gal since at least 2008, guaranteed.
It's been kind of shitty around here lately. I'm living in two places during a move and I showed up yesterday to my old house to pack some stuff and the sinks, toilets and tubs were full of sewage. Welcome home! and yes, I meant "shitty" literally. But after developing plunger's elbow, the brown matter is finally gone (at least everything was contained and not on the floors). Now I just have to determine the cause. Other than that life is peachy.

I hope Richard has a good security system, that dog of his won't offer much protection from stalkers. Probably hard to explain to Lalla about women standing out in the yard yelling about blowjobs.

decius
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8060

Post by decius »

mordacious1 wrote:
It's been kind of shitty around here lately. I'm living in two places during a move and I showed up yesterday to my old house to pack some stuff and the sinks, toilets and tubs were full of sewage. Welcome home! and yes, I meant "shitty" literally. But after developing plunger's elbow, the brown matter is finally gone (at least everything was contained and not on the floors). Now I just have to determine the cause. Other than that life is peachy.

I hope Richard has a good security system, that dog of his won't offer much protection from stalkers. Probably hard to explain to Lalla about women standing out in the yard yelling about blowjobs.
I don't envy you, but on the positive side, it wasn't the new home to get the crappy decorations.

I think this old piece of his partly addresses your concerns.
http://old.richarddawkins.net/articles/ ... ed-monster

Sulman
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8061

Post by Sulman »

decius wrote:
Sulman wrote: I think Drescher is just sick of the drama. She hinted last week it should be about the work.
That doesn't make her statement acceptable or even coherent.
Well, it isn't coherent, but I do think it is acceptable. Drescher is frustrated and irritable about drama carpet-bombing the shit out of the sceptic community; it is a concern. Does anybody ever stop and think what it looks like?

In a sensible world, Watson would simply disappear as nobody would take her seriously, but she has magnificent staying power, even among those that love to hate her. Her sheer ability to make something from nothing is actually laudable. She does no scientific work, has nothing published of any repute, and yet is still getting mentioned in the same breath as Richard fucking Dawkins. As a communications graduate, she's at the top of her game. It's a case study in how to be effective. She owes as much to her detractors as supporters. I don't know how she does it, and I do respect her chutzpah.

Darren
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8062

Post by Darren »

acathode wrote:Didn't Dawkins already appear on the same stage as Watson, in some panel or something? And IIRC, didn't Watson do what she always does, turn it into all about her, misogyny and hatemail (completely ignoring the subject she was there to talk about), and in doing so made Dawkins visibly annoyed? You kinda expect a smart person like Dawkins to learn from his mistake, so it's hardly surprising he want nothing to do with Watson and her skepchicks...
Yeah, the baboon go ape-shit when someone "derails" one of their precious threads by responding to the insults being hurled at them, yet Watson and her ilk consistently derail entire fucking cons with their bullshit antics and noone bats an eyelid.

Once, JUST ONCE, I would like to see one of these pricks get ejected from a conference for "derailing" when they get up on stage and begin delivering their latest SJW sermon.

decius
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8063

Post by decius »

I agree that it neither looks good from the outside, nor it is pleasurable from the inside.
However, it is pure application of skepticism to expose manufactroversies and tantrums for what they are.
To see one's skeptic badge revoked by Drescher, so to speak, on account of one's lack of acquiescence to Watson's disinformation campaign is hardly an acceptable stance.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8064

Post by Sulman »

decius wrote:I
To see one's skeptic badge revoked by Drescher, so to speak, on account of one's lack of acquiescence to Watson's disinformation campaign is hardly an acceptable stance.
Fair point.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8065

Post by Skep tickle »

RichardDawkins.net and Why Evolution Is True are still listed & linked in the left-hand column at Pharyngula. Both are listed both under "Atheism" and under "Science". Wonder whether Myers has been tempted to remove them.

(Under each of the topics "Atheism", "Science", & also "Culture", there are 14-20 sites listed. Under "Skepticism", there are only 3 sites listed: Consider the Tea Cosy, Skepchick, and Skeptical Humanism.)

Brive1987
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8066

Post by Brive1987 »

PZ says:
"And that’s how I win. Not by demanding homogeneity, but by plugging into a growing environment with broader scope"
.. And if you don't agree I'll ban you.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... /#comments

Actually I think atheism and skepticism is a personal enabler and it's simple message needs repeating to new people and once understood you are free to go and grow. It's atheism as a world view that then demands an enabling ideology and from that dogma.

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8067

Post by Dick Strawkins »

Pitchguest wrote:The Black Zvan still sticks with Dalgleish, while simultaneously being unsure of its veracity.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... ent-625179

I'd like to know who this RDFRS employee (former or otherwise) is. Maybe Dalgleish knows.
Svan says in that threat she thinks Dalgleigh's actions may constitute harassment of Cornwell.

But these particular harassing actions broadly consist of sending out stolen emails that seem to reveal the private life of Cornwell plus others.

Which is exactly what Svan herself did - as well as Ophelia Benson - by linking to the pdf of those emails!

The whole thing is akin to a situation where you write a blog criticizing someone as a harasser for posting naked photos of their ex on the internet - while including the very same photos in your blog post!

Svan, and Ophelia, know that this is a gross breach of privacy that undoubtedly constitutes harassment of Cornwell - one of their speaking colleagues at the recent Women in Skepticism 2 conference, and yet they go ahead and publish it anyway!

:shock:

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8068

Post by Dick Strawkins »

oops, it should read Svan says in that "thread".

Freudian slip.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8069

Post by VAXherd »

Brive1987 wrote:Actually I think atheism and skepticism is a personal enabler and it's simple message needs repeating to new people and once understood you are free to go and grow. It's atheism as a world view that then demands an enabling ideology and from that dogma.
I don't think we disagree, but it's worth mentioning that atheism isn't really a world view, in the same way that it isn't a religion.

A world view, per se, also does not require dogma, but many people seem to need a pre-packaged set of beliefs that they needn't question. That's my understanding of the stated purpose of Atheism Plus; to take the "obviously correct" ethical positions and present them as a bundle to people cut off from conventional religion. Without such a bundle "you've got to work it out for yourselves", which I'm not sure everyone can do.

In principle, I'm not even sure that's a bad thing. But I'm also not sure you can do the "needn't question" part without either being bland Church of England style Humanism, or inviting trouble. Social Justice is a good thing, but Social Justice Warriors are antisocial and unjust.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8070

Post by Trophy »

They have now officially become Dawkins's fleas. Hate on little people, hate on. I'm sure Dawkins is trembling with fear of the wrath of lilliputians.

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8071

Post by Dick Strawkins »

decius wrote:I agree that it neither looks good from the outside, nor it is pleasurable from the inside.
However, it is pure application of skepticism to expose manufactroversies and tantrums for what they are.
To see one's skeptic badge revoked by Drescher, so to speak, on account of one's lack of acquiescence to Watson's disinformation campaign is hardly an acceptable stance.

There seems to be a requirement for those who seek prominence in the US Skeptics movement (in order to receive invites to TAM, CFI events etc) to portray themselves as 'moderates'.
In practical terms this seems to entail choosing two visible outlying positions and publicly distancing oneself from both - acting out the xkcd cartoon "the important thing is that you've found a way to feel superior to both".

This is a standard political maneuver that works on the basis that the general population tend to accept the argument that the correct, or fairest, answer must lie somewhere in the middle point between two opposing views.

So the Pharyngulite/Skepchick position is one point and the other is, what?
If there actually existed the kind of opposition that Myers, Benson, Svan and Watson claim (organizing rape threat campaigns, supporting the right of atheist men to be able to grope women without censure etc) then there would a good reason to seek the middle ground.

The trouble is, of course, that the threatening harassing opponents are to a large extent a fantasy concocted in the minds of Myers and friends. There may be rare loonies who do agree with that behavior but there is no basis to presume that significant numbers of atheists support it.

We know that it is advantageous for Myers and friends to overstate the case in that way.
But it's also advantageous for others, not necessarily on Myers side, to go along with this fiction, for the simple reason that it gives them the opportunity to play the xkcd card.
Drescher certainly does this but she is far from alone in using this tactic.

Guest

Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8072

Post by Guest »

Dick Strawkins wrote: In practical terms this seems to entail choosing two visible outlying positions and publicly distancing oneself from both - acting out the xkcd cartoon "the important thing is that you've found a way to feel superior to both".
This is a little off-topic, but the xkcd comic kinda bugs me. There really are a few conflicts, particularly online, that are just so stupid and/or pathetic that I really don't want to get involved in any of them. Obviously, I take the side of the Slymepit against the SJWs, Atheists against Christians, etc., but the MRA vs. Feminist conflict, for example, is just a bunch of idiots arguing over whether White Women in First-World Countries or White Men in First-World Countries are more oppressed. Neither of them bothers to focus all that much on the few serious issues they have, like actual rape or men getting screwed over in divorce courts, either. Instead it's all just "OH NO A SKIMPY OUTFIT ON A FEMALE COMIC BOOK CHARACTER" or "OH NO, A MAN IS BEING PORTRAYED AS A DOPEY DAD IN A SITCOM!" or some other trivial shit.

TL;DR, some conflicts are just shit-flinging competitions between monkeys, and ought to be avoided.

VickyCaramel
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8073

Post by VickyCaramel »

VAXherd wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:Actually I think atheism and skepticism is a personal enabler and it's simple message needs repeating to new people and once understood you are free to go and grow. It's atheism as a world view that then demands an enabling ideology and from that dogma.
I don't think we disagree, but it's worth mentioning that atheism isn't really a world view, in the same way that it isn't a religion.

A world view, per se, also does not require dogma, but many people seem to need a pre-packaged set of beliefs that they needn't question. That's my understanding of the stated purpose of Atheism Plus; to take the "obviously correct" ethical positions and present them as a bundle to people cut off from conventional religion. Without such a bundle "you've got to work it out for yourselves", which I'm not sure everyone can do.
I think it would be simple if a rejection of religion lead to a rejection of the religious world view(s) and a complete re-evaluation. But much of the modern world view is actually secular and only claimed by religion.

I have always been an atheist, but there came a point in my life when I realized I really did have to reevaluate everything because religion has influenced the world view I have been indoctrinated with, plus any choices I may have been presented with over many issues.

A group who got together and tried to identify and reevaluate prevailing opinions which are skewed by religion or other woo is no bad idea really. But I suspect it could only be useful in identifying problems and not in finding answers. We can take it as a given that pretty soon feminists, Marxists, anarchists, libertarians, etc. would be trying to present their world view as an alternative (often forcefully), in which case skepticism would and should be applied to those too.

This is not a description of A+ is it?

Michael K Gray
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A drive-by post

#8074

Post by Michael K Gray »

The terminal galahs at Jen's abortion, christened "A✞Theism" have outdone themselves in slackness.
http://billstormont.files.wordpress.com ... =640&h=394
Their only real armchair worrier contribution was to be the all-conquering A-Scribe.
A furious nest of activity, actually doing something, instead of just eternal whinging!

But... the SSL security certificate for the site expired last month, and no-one seems to have noticed!
http://www.michaelgray.com.au/Resources/ascribe_url.png
http://www.michaelgray.com.au/Resources ... e_cert.png
I guess that is what they are all aboot. (For all the cunucks)
Laden must be in charge of IT there. Not IQ.

Gotta go! Prolly won't be able to read responses. Just FYI.

Badger3k
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8075

Post by Badger3k »

I'm sure I have a lot to catch up on since I've been at work, but reading the Laden/Rich Hughes thing...wow. Greggie is still an ass and a loser. Watson has been successful promoting women/feminist goals (loved this bit "Skepchicks addresses women (and men) who have uncritically accepted woo, and helps enlighten them. Plus, Rebecca gives excellent, if pithy, dating advice." - seriously?) - and their actions have been effective while Dawkins' haven't?).

I'd ask what world Greg lives in, but since it's mostly in his head, I'd rather not go there. I'd really hate to see what he has in there (although perhaps the emptiness might be stress reducing).

In a completely unrelated incident, seeing a video reminded me of this wonder - somebody tell Greta!

[youtube]aorjnobv-I0[/youtube]

There's also the unicorn that craps and vomits out weapons in Borderlands 2 (the Tiny Tina adventure DLC), but I'll stick with Mr Toots for now.

Badger3k
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8076

Post by Badger3k »

Al Stefanelli wrote:
Pitchguest wrote:Watson is asserting Al bought fake Twitter followers and links to Faker Score to prove it. The turd chips in and says, "I noticed that too, still never seen faker scores that high. An amazing coincidence I'm sure."



Here's a Faker Score wall listing the top people with "fake" Twitter followers.

http://fakers.statuspeople.com/Fakers/Wall

Never seen higher? Once more, the slimy turd shows himself to be a fucking idiot, and Watson shows himself to be a one-track, shit-stirring moron.

(Faker Score ranks followers in terms of inactivity. It also ranks the "fakeness" of how many tweets those followers make or have made. But it's not a perfect system and it's certainly not the most accurate one. So when it shows Al's Twitter followers to be 79% "fake", that could mean they've been inactive for a very long time or that they haven't made enough tweets for it to count as "real." In any case, it's not significant to anything and it doesn't prove anything. Since I don't have Twitter myself I can't check Watson's status, but I imagine it, too, has its share of "fake" Twitter followers. Does that mean she "paid" for those as well?)
My Twitter account is five years old, ancient in the Twitterverse.

I've had huge influxes of followers around the times my books were published, during when I was giving lectures, when my stuff was published on the RDFRS website, as well as when I made national news - particularly when the whole 'American Atheist State Director Wants to Kill All Christians Thing' was picked up by Glenn Beck and resulted in me being a guest on The Janet Mefford Show, among others.

I've no way of tracking when and if these followers have decided to interact with my feed, but if they've largely remained inactive, then 'whatever.'

Point is, she threw in a Red Herring (and a 7th grade level one at that), which ool0n decided to participate in - mainly because he's a complete tool.
Well, I hate to say it, but I added to your fake list. I am following more people than I have tweets made, and my account is a few years old. I guess I'll show up as a fake follower, then.

VAXherd
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8077

Post by VAXherd »

VickyCaramel wrote:A group who got together and tried to identify and reevaluate prevailing opinions which are skewed by religion or other woo is no bad idea really. But I suspect it could only be useful in identifying problems and not in finding answers. We can take it as a given that pretty soon feminists, Marxists, anarchists, libertarians, etc. would be trying to present their world view as an alternative (often forcefully), in which case skepticism would and should be applied to those too.

This is not a description of A+ is it?
My impression is that the A+ people are claiming that they have, in fact, done a secular skeptical evaluation of all available social, political, economic, etc. views, and come to a reliable conclusion. They've worked it out, so you don't have to.

My own perception is that the truly unambiguous conclusions that all atheists can share aren't enough to live one's life. At a certain point you're going to have to make value judgments or other choices that are not beyond dispute.

Most public atheists describe recognizing that it's just us doing the choosing as a very positive experience. But some seem to genuinely suffer from the uncertainty.

Badger3k
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8078

Post by Badger3k »

I like this comment the best:
holy crap. does this woman get PAID to churn this stuff out?

Badger3k
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8079

Post by Badger3k »

Ok - quick add on to that Marcotte monstrosity - I made the mistake of reading more of the comments, and you have people not only agreeing with her, but adding to it. Holy fuck, does the internet bring out the bugfuck insane people.

Plop

Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8080

Post by Plop »

Skep tickle wrote:
Al Stefanelli wrote:Sorry, here's the correct link to my Storify on some of the fallout
:shock:
The stupidity of the first tweet is completely mind blowing.

VickyCaramel
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8081

Post by VickyCaramel »

Guest wrote:
TL;DR, some conflicts are just shit-flinging competitions between monkeys, and ought to be avoided.
If only it were that simple. Unfortunately shit flinging recently got Watson on the BBC's Newsnight.

Brive1987
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8082

Post by Brive1987 »

VAXherd wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:Actually I think atheism and skepticism is a personal enabler and it's simple message needs repeating to new people and once understood you are free to go and grow. It's atheism as a world view that then demands an enabling ideology and from that dogma.
I don't think we disagree, but it's worth mentioning that atheism isn't really a world view, in the same way that it isn't a religion.

A world view, per se, also does not require dogma, but many people seem to need a pre-packaged set of beliefs that they needn't question. That's my understanding of the stated purpose of Atheism Plus; to take the "obviously correct" ethical positions and present them as a bundle to people cut off from conventional religion. Without such a bundle "you've got to work it out for yourselves", which I'm not sure everyone can do.

In principle, I'm not even sure that's a bad thing. But I'm also not sure you can do the "needn't question" part without either being bland Church of England style Humanism, or inviting trouble. Social Justice is a good thing, but Social Justice Warriors are antisocial and unjust.
I think most (all?) people have a world view - a model that makes sense of what's going on and the best way to operate in our environment + what's right and what's wrong. Most of us, I'm guessing have a 'world view' informed by atheism ie value and values must be defined outside of divine command theory.

Myers problem is that he feels there are scientifically objective moral values, his brand of feminism comes from these and there is no virtuous debate possible that is not based on ignorance or poor character.

That's why he is increasingly marginalise in sane society, and why his claim that he doesn't want "homogeneity" is so disingenuous. He no more wants diversity of thought on key issues, than an Islamist "wants" plurality.

Ape+lust
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8083

Post by Ape+lust »

Yo, Amanda. Look to the right of your article. A Bigfoot story!

http://i.imgur.com/r82OsxU.png

Badger3k
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8084

Post by Badger3k »

To whoever posted that "Flossie and the Unicorns" - I actually have to thank you...I think. A few years ago, on our way to a renfaire about 4 hours from here, driving early morning, we heard this bizarre radio play (that's what it seemed like) about music and animals, and when they got to this part about looking for a witch ("here witchy witchy) to, IIRC, kill her) we died laughing. It was like an acid trip or something. We could not turn it off. I listened to that video, and think I may have found it - for years we have all wondered what the hell we were listening to, and I think I might have found it thanks to you.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8085

Post by VAXherd »

Brive1987 wrote:I think most (all?) people have a world view - a model that makes sense of what's going on and the best way to operate in our environment + what's right and what's wrong. Most of us, I'm guessing have a 'world view' informed by atheism ie value and values must be defined outside of divine command theory.

Myers problem is that he feels there are scientifically objective moral values, his brand of feminism comes from these and there is no virtuous debate possible that is not based on ignorance or poor character.

That's why he is increasingly marginalise in sane society, and why his claim that he doesn't want "homogeneity" is so disingenuous. He no more wants diversity of thought on key issues, than an Islamist "wants" plurality.
Yes. The odd thing, though, (that I've really only seen from FTB) is the notion that since accepting divine command theory leads to a complete world view, rejecting it must do the same. Then they end up with a super intolerant position that, as you note, allows for no legitimate diversity of thought.

Some days I think that Secular Activism is making headway marginalizing that kind of "one true path" attitude. Some days I have my doubts.

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8086

Post by Dick Strawkins »

VAXherd wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:I think most (all?) people have a world view - a model that makes sense of what's going on and the best way to operate in our environment + what's right and what's wrong. Most of us, I'm guessing have a 'world view' informed by atheism ie value and values must be defined outside of divine command theory.

Myers problem is that he feels there are scientifically objective moral values, his brand of feminism comes from these and there is no virtuous debate possible that is not based on ignorance or poor character.

That's why he is increasingly marginalise in sane society, and why his claim that he doesn't want "homogeneity" is so disingenuous. He no more wants diversity of thought on key issues, than an Islamist "wants" plurality.
Yes. The odd thing, though, (that I've really only seen from FTB) is the notion that since accepting divine command theory leads to a complete world view, rejecting it must do the same. Then they end up with a super intolerant position that, as you note, allows for no legitimate diversity of thought.

Some days I think that Secular Activism is making headway marginalizing that kind of "one true path" attitude. Some days I have my doubts.
Having a type of grand unified theory of life, be it a religious ideology or secular one such as marxism, is incredibly enticing for a lot of people. It can provide a simple explanation for all types of behaviors and occurrences in the world that would otherwise require far more contemplation in order to have a genuine understanding.
It is so much easier to have terms like 'sin' or 'privilege' to explain almost everything rather than being forced to look at each individual case and work out the various competing factors and nuances.

Generally speaking the skeptical and atheist communities tend to be better than average at getting around this bias of human nature - but that is only because we have historically been able to pose the question "do you have any evidence for that?" - the foundational question of scientific skepticism.
So long as we can pose that question we have a safeguard against demagoguery - which is why the ability to ask that particular question was the first casualty of the entire schism and why it has now become a virtual bannable offence on pharyngula.

The effect of this war on skepticism has been a purging of scientific skeptics from the FTB side and an influx of SJW who have no interest whatsoever in the atheist movement.

Phil_Giordana_FCD
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8087

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Jan Steen wrote:Apparently there is a TV series called Bates Motel. The photo is from that series, not from the Hitchcock movie Psycho. Has anyone watched the series?
Piece of crap teen show set in present days, IMO. We watched the first episode and just forgot about it.

Brive1987
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8088

Post by Brive1987 »

Dick Strawkins wrote:
VAXherd wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:I think most (all?) people have a world view - a model that makes sense of what's going on and the best way to operate in our environment + what's right and what's wrong. Most of us, I'm guessing have a 'world view' informed by atheism ie value and values must be defined outside of divine command theory.

Myers problem is that he feels there are scientifically objective moral values, his brand of feminism comes from these and there is no virtuous debate possible that is not based on ignorance or poor character.

That's why he is increasingly marginalise in sane society, and why his claim that he doesn't want "homogeneity" is so disingenuous. He no more wants diversity of thought on key issues, than an Islamist "wants" plurality.
Yes. The odd thing, though, (that I've really only seen from FTB) is the notion that since accepting divine command theory leads to a complete world view, rejecting it must do the same. Then they end up with a super intolerant position that, as you note, allows for no legitimate diversity of thought.

Some days I think that Secular Activism is making headway marginalizing that kind of "one true path" attitude. Some days I have my doubts.
Having a type of grand unified theory of life, be it a religious ideology or secular one such as marxism, is incredibly enticing for a lot of people. It can provide a simple explanation for all types of behaviors and occurrences in the world that would otherwise require far more contemplation in order to have a genuine understanding.
It is so much easier to have terms like 'sin' or 'privilege' to explain almost everything rather than being forced to look at each individual case and work out the various competing factors and nuances.

Generally speaking the skeptical and atheist communities tend to be better than average at getting around this bias of human nature - but that is only because we have historically been able to pose the question "do you have any evidence for that?" - the foundational question of scientific skepticism.
So long as we can pose that question we have a safeguard against demagoguery - which is why the ability to ask that particular question was the first casualty of the entire schism and why it has now become a virtual bannable offence on pharyngula.

The effect of this war on skepticism has been a purging of scientific skeptics from the FTB side and an influx of SJW who have no interest whatsoever in the atheist movement.
Correct. Ideology has made skeptical and nuanced (now there's a dirty word) thought anathema for certain key SJ premises. At least PZ recognised his divorce from skepticism. Now he just has to figure out why atheist groups are also going cold on him for aggressively conflating unbelief with his specific world view.

That's why I found his "no homogeneity" claim so ridiculous. Is he kidding us or himself? Personally I think he is calculatingly trying to regain credibility lost over recent months and years.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8089

Post by VAXherd »

Dick Strawkins wrote:Generally speaking the skeptical and atheist communities tend to be better than average at getting around this bias of human nature - but that is only because we have historically been able to pose the question "do you have any evidence for that?" - the foundational question of scientific skepticism.
So long as we can pose that question we have a safeguard against demagoguery - which is why the ability to ask that particular question was the first casualty of the entire schism and why it has now become a virtual bannable offence on pharyngula.
Indeed. As troublesome as the FC(n) have been, it's actually remarkable that the Skeptic and Atheist communities have held out against gender feminism and identity politics as well as they have.

Guest

Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8090

Post by Guest »

Darren wrote:
acathode wrote:Didn't Dawkins already appear on the same stage as Watson, in some panel or something? And IIRC, didn't Watson do what she always does, turn it into all about her, misogyny and hatemail (completely ignoring the subject she was there to talk about), and in doing so made Dawkins visibly annoyed? You kinda expect a smart person like Dawkins to learn from his mistake, so it's hardly surprising he want nothing to do with Watson and her skepchicks...
Yeah, the baboon go ape-shit when someone "derails" one of their precious threads by responding to the insults being hurled at them, yet Watson and her ilk consistently derail entire fucking cons with their bullshit antics and noone bats an eyelid.

Once, JUST ONCE, I would like to see one of these pricks get ejected from a conference for "derailing" when they get up on stage and begin delivering their latest SJW sermon.
Except that is what they want. They're like christians in many respects, always looking for a new cross to bear and another chance to be a martyr for the cause. Anything they can claim is oppression is at least 20 more brownie points in the spank bank.

mary (abbie's ilk)
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8091

Post by mary (abbie's ilk) »

Badger3k wrote:
I like this comment the best:
holy crap. does this woman get PAID to churn this stuff out?

Someone, quick...tell the story of how Snow White was an abused woman..

Jan Steen
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8092

Post by Jan Steen »


DownThunder
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8093

Post by DownThunder »

Ape+lust wrote:Yo, Amanda. Look to the right of your article. A Bigfoot story!

http://i.imgur.com/r82OsxU.png
Well, holy fucking shitballs. I just died a little inside reading that comment section. If anybody needs a primer on what rape culture or rape apology is and looks like, just send them to that comment section.

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Re: A drive-by post

#8094

Post by ccdimage »

Michael K Gray wrote:The terminal galahs at Jen's abortion, christened "A✞Theism" have outdone themselves in slackness.
http://billstormont.files.wordpress.com ... =640&h=394
Their only real armchair worrier contribution was to be the all-conquering A-Scribe.
A furious nest of activity, actually doing something, instead of just eternal whinging!

But... the SSL security certificate for the site expired last month, and no-one seems to have noticed!
http://www.michaelgray.com.au/Resources/ascribe_url.png
http://www.michaelgray.com.au/Resources ... e_cert.png
I guess that is what they are all aboot. (For all the cunucks)
Laden must be in charge of IT there. Not IQ.

Gotta go! Prolly won't be able to read responses. Just FYI.
Unsurprising.
The keyboard crusaders united and made something to point the likes of Matt Dillahunty to and say "look we are not totally useless". Critics of their slacktivist movement could be silenced with a link. It has served its purpose as a publicity stunt and so it can be left to die.
There may have been an intent from the vindictive priests to make something that even the laziest keyboard crusader could do to build something worthwhile. I think they forgot to account for the depths of uselessness they were dealing with. I am also doubtful that it was ever used as a resource.
To be fair though it was always a bit like wikipedia in that it requires hours of unpaid labour which as most people with a wiki account can attest gets stale after a few hours. This is why I think the "storming wikipedia" college course won't actually amount to anything more than unemployable victims of a money grubbing education system. Even if you feel passion for the cause, a few hours of unpaid work starts to feel like work and does nothing to develop your victim status.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8095

Post by Jan Steen »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Jan Steen wrote:Apparently there is a TV series called Bates Motel. The photo is from that series, not from the Hitchcock movie Psycho. Has anyone watched the series?
Piece of crap teen show set in present days, IMO. We watched the first episode and just forgot about it.
Then I won't bother. Thanks.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8096

Post by Tribble »

ccdimage wrote:Pat Condell giving "progressive" feminists a piece of his mind.
[youtube]GbmeQtGMkUU[/youtube]

I like his point about racism. Islam isn't a race and the people who practice it aren't even ethnically homogenous and to suggest that it is such a thing, out of your ignorance, is laughable. I know most of these upper-middle-class cunts don't know it, but it's more than Arabs. Sure, you've got your Arabs and some of these cunts may even know about the Persians and Armenians, but most of them have no clue about the non-Arab Semites, Hispanics, Chinese, Pakistanis, Indians, south-east Asians/Pacific Islanders (who break into a large number of ethnic groups),west, east and south African blacks and even your token number of Caucasians.

It's a global ethnic rainbow. Just like Christianity, which has all of those ethnic groups, but only in different proportions.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8097

Post by Karmakin »

Badger3k wrote:To whoever posted that "Flossie and the Unicorns" - I actually have to thank you...I think. A few years ago, on our way to a renfaire about 4 hours from here, driving early morning, we heard this bizarre radio play (that's what it seemed like) about music and animals, and when they got to this part about looking for a witch ("here witchy witchy) to, IIRC, kill her) we died laughing. It was like an acid trip or something. We could not turn it off. I listened to that video, and think I may have found it - for years we have all wondered what the hell we were listening to, and I think I might have found it thanks to you.
....glad I could help? I guess?

The way my wife found it is pretty interesting. Way back when on the P2P program SoulSeek, she was looking through collections when she found a nested directory about 20-30 folders deep with a fuckton of warnings. Of course, having seeing that you can't just ignore it.

Tribble
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8098

Post by Tribble »

Azathoth wrote: OK, no doxxing even though if anyone deserves it it is a self confessed serial child rapist. I will collate and pass to the relevant authorities
That's the right thing. Not vigilante justice. And I'll be blunt, I honestly don't believe his story. The repressed memory syndrome is complete bunk. He's almost certainly telling tales for attention.

Tribble
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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8099

Post by Tribble »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:Some reliable sources say there's some good lulz on this Laden FB thread, but since he probably blocked me, I can't see it. i'll just drop the URL here, in case someone else can illuminate me as to what it's about:


Laden is so arrogant he can't even see when he's lost an argument. He lost hard and early in the argument when the central point of his argument was demolished by factual, third-party evidence offered in rebuttal.

At that point a grown up would have done a mea culpa and conceded defeat. But not Greg, he just kept going on as if he'd won for the rest of the argument. He's like Ray Comfort, but with a lousy personality.

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Re: Bleeding from the Bunghole

#8100

Post by Hunt »

Tribble wrote:
ccdimage wrote:Pat Condell giving "progressive" feminists a piece of his mind.
[youtube]GbmeQtGMkUU[/youtube]

I like his point about racism. Islam isn't a race and the people who practice it aren't even ethnically homogenous and to suggest that it is such a thing, out of your ignorance, is laughable. I know most of these upper-middle-class cunts don't know it, but it's more than Arabs. Sure, you've got your Arabs and some of these cunts may even know about the Persians and Armenians, but most of them have no clue about the non-Arab Semites, Hispanics, Chinese, Pakistanis, Indians, south-east Asians/Pacific Islanders (who break into a large number of ethnic groups),west, east and south African blacks and even your token number of Caucasians.

It's a global ethnic rainbow. Just like Christianity, which has all of those ethnic groups, but only in different proportions.
Condell and Taslima really should be husband and wife. I think they were made for each other, provided Condell has a large penis.

Locked