The Refuge of the Toads

#24121

Novella's crew think Horgan's a tit:

http://theness.com/neurologicablog/inde ... -skeptics/

#24122

comhcinc wrote:Just to point out while everyone is shitting on Horgan that there are people here who have said basically the same thing.

Which part? He's all over the map.

#24123

jet_lagg wrote:
comhcinc wrote:Just to point out while everyone is shitting on Horgan that there are people here who have said basically the same thing.
Which part? He's all over the map.

The overall point of "people should not be worrying about ghost and bigfoot"

#24124

One fun comment:

I can’t help but think it’s like he’s run into a room full of Astronomers and started yelling at them for using star charts to predict people’s future, mocking them for believing in the influence of planets over births, laughing at them for their nonsense and when informed that he’s thinking of Astrologers… well, I guess we’ll find out what happens next.

#24125

A few pit people (don't recall exactly who) have in the past taken potshots at Bigfoot Skepticism, but it's not a widely-held opinion.

#24126

Sunder wrote:A few pit people (don't recall exactly who) have in the past taken potshots at Bigfoot Skepticism, but it's not a widely-held opinion.

Yup that was all I was saying.

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=444&p=332593&hilit=bigfoot#p332593

#24127

How about...

"Reserve all conclusions until the evidence is in and a relatively strong degree of certainty wrt the conclusions can be established."?

Or would Horgan consider me an irredeemable heretic?

#24128

He's been much more bold than claiming bigfoot skepticism is useless (I might have conceded that).

#24129

When I don't like the conclusions that are or aren't supported by the available evidence, I simply update my priors until I get a more pleasing outcome. For example, with carefully selected priors and reference groups, I have proven to seven decimal places that Bigfoot not only exists, but currently lives in Ohio.

#24130

jet_lagg wrote:He's been much more bold than claiming bigfoot skepticism is useless (I might have conceded that).

Yeah he went full retard which has never happened here...about this subject.

#24131

comhcinc wrote:
jet_lagg wrote:
comhcinc wrote:Just to point out while everyone is shitting on Horgan that there are people here who have said basically the same thing.
Which part? He's all over the map.

The overall point of "people should not be worrying about ghost and bigfoot"

I can understand people who have that opinion (even though I don't agree with them).

I think that Horgan is a gonk not because he's arguing that "bigfoot skepticism" is useless, but because he's a biased ideologue and a pretentious ignorant windbag (just read what he wrote about physics) who claims he's the most skeptic of them all.

I also dislike Novella because he's criticizing Horgan now, though he was invited to NECSS and had been going on about his shtick of being the "skeptic of skepticism" for years. While it took only a retweet of anti-radfem satire for Novella to rail against Dawkins The Great Misogynist and blackball him at the urge of the Twitter crowd.

Horgan is very bad at skepticism and everyone knows it, but he gets invited to a skeptic conference nonetheless, while Dawkins, who has done far more for science and skepticism than Horgan ever did, gets his invitation rescinded because a few perpetual victims called him a bigot.

#24132

comhcinc wrote:
Sunder wrote:A few pit people (don't recall exactly who) have in the past taken potshots at Bigfoot Skepticism, but it's not a widely-held opinion.
Yup that was all I was saying.

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=444&p=332593&hilit=bigfoot#p332593

IIRC the only one that really shit on it was Welch, and he routinely decided to get his panties in a bunch so he could attack somebody out of the blue. It was his thing. Whatta guy.

#24133

Kirbmarc wrote:I can understand people who have that opinion (even though I don't agree with them).

I think that Horgan is a gonk not because he's arguing that "bigfoot skepticism" is useless, but because he's a biased ideologue and a pretentious ignorant windbag (just read what he wrote about physics) who claims he's the most skeptic of them all.

I also dislike Novella because he's criticizing Horgan now, though he was invited to NECSS and had been going on about his shtick of being the "skeptic of skepticism" for years. While it took only a retweet of anti-radfem satire for Novella to rail against Dawkins The Great Misogynist and blackball him at the urge of the Twitter crowd.

Horgan is very bad at skepticism and everyone knows it, but he gets invited to a skeptic conference nonetheless, while Dawkins, who has done far more for science and skepticism than Horgan ever did, gets his invitation rescinded because a few perpetual victims called him a bigot.

I'll pretty much second this.

Even though I can't find anything I disagree with in Novella's article, I gotta say he doesn't get my sympathy for having to deal with this considering the choices he and his associates made when it came to staffing their convention.

#24134

Scented Nectar wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:Sssssh. I'm watching Top Gun. Tom is chasing women into bathrooms.
Totally off topic, but Target's worth is down over $6 billion dollars since the whole trans bathroom thing.

I see it's down 7% or so, although it is maybe moot how much of that is due to their bathroom policy but I expect it has contributed to the drop. Not sure if I've been ninja'd or not, but something on a related issue in The College Fix:

Gender pronoun insanity: New York City promises to FINE people for not using ‘ze’ or ‘hir’

UCLA Law Prof. Eugene Volokh is usually a pretty restrained guy, but the First Amendment expert goes absolutely nuts when talking about a brazen and flagrantly unconstitutional attack on free speech by New York City’s social engineers. ....

Crazier than the proverbial shit-house rats. The linked article by Volokh has some amusingly analogous suggestions about demanding to be called "Milord" or "Your Holiness" or "Sun Person". And a gratifying reference to the Slate article on the 56 genders that Facebook uses. Both points that I've been harping on for some time - maybe he's lurking about? ;-)

#24135

Sunder wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:I can understand people who have that opinion (even though I don't agree with them).

I think that Horgan is a gonk not because he's arguing that "bigfoot skepticism" is useless, but because he's a biased ideologue and a pretentious ignorant windbag (just read what he wrote about physics) who claims he's the most skeptic of them all.

I also dislike Novella because he's criticizing Horgan now, though he was invited to NECSS and had been going on about his shtick of being the "skeptic of skepticism" for years. While it took only a retweet of anti-radfem satire for Novella to rail against Dawkins The Great Misogynist and blackball him at the urge of the Twitter crowd.

Horgan is very bad at skepticism and everyone knows it, but he gets invited to a skeptic conference nonetheless, while Dawkins, who has done far more for science and skepticism than Horgan ever did, gets his invitation rescinded because a few perpetual victims called him a bigot.
I'll pretty much second this.

Even though I can't find anything I disagree with in Novella's article, I gotta say he doesn't get my sympathy for having to deal with this considering the choices he and his associates made when it came to staffing their convention.

Hero arsonist puts out own fire! News at 11.

#24136

jimhabegger wrote:This interests me because it discusses some issues that I've been thinking about, like the abandonment of class analysis, and alienation of white men, in liberal politics:
Identity Politics & Class Struggle

Looks like it might be worth a read, not least for this amusing preamble:

... and a forthcoming collection of essays titled "Yo Momma's Disfunktional! And Other Essays on the Culture Wars in Black America (1997)". ....

#24137

And it gets worse. Trudeau is accepting foreign help to fight other current fires, just not for that evil city in Alberta, and nearby regions, with its many evil oil industry employees.

"Trudeau declines international aid for Alberta wildfires: What if it was Fort Mac, QC?"
[youtube]3GcTxN6Ajqg[/youtube]

#24138

Scented Nectar wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:The idea that we need help from Russia to fight those fires is just ridiculous.
Next door to Alberta is BC, that has top quality resources that are called on to fight fires worldwide.
These fires flamed up quickly, nevertheless have been controlled to the degree that there has been minimal damage to the infrastructure and been no fatalities.
Meanwhile, BC has plenty of resources yet to be called to help, because it isn't really needed.
Rebel Media is full of shit.
Why are they full of shit? They are just the messengers. It doesn't matter that BC has resources, since the gov't in Alberta cancelled waterbomber contracts before the fires, even though they knew it was going to be a bad fire season.

" Notley NDP cancelled water bomber tenders AFTER anticipating “very busy fire season” "
[youtube]a_37u6Vr9_E[/youtube]

Jebus Scented, you are getting your news from the equivalent of Alex Jones/ Glenn Beck now?
They said Trudeau "is letting Alberta burn". It is the provincial government's responsibility to fight fires not the feds. The feds gave Notley everything she asked for, so that is just a lie.
Large water bombers like Coulson Air Tankers Mars Water Bomber are useless in that area because the lakes in that area are too shallow and small for large water skimmers.
Fires are mainly fought by removing fuel to create fire breaks ahead of an advancing fire. Aircraft have a limited role which is hitting smaller areas where the fire is not too large. Even the largest of the water bombers, the Mars can only cover 4 acres on a drop and even with that capacity if the fire is too big the drop will evaporate before it can get to the flames.
They had all the aircraft and resources they needed or could handle. They didn't let Fort Mac "burn to the ground", despite how quickly the fire advanced they saved more than 80% of the city and all the major infrastructure.
The forest type in question naturally burns every so often, then rather quickly regenerates so the forest is renewed, the CO2 that was released is recaptured, and the young forest is typically better wildlife habitat than the older forest.
The mistakes made aren't being made by people currently fighting the large fire. Better forest management like strategic harvesting and controlled burns could have prevented this/these fires from growing so large and difficult to fight.
Ezra Levant is a extremist right wing propagandist that could never get enough of kissing Harper's ass while he was in power and can't help himself from telling lies if it helps peddle his fringe politics.

#24139

I have a lingering suspicion that Horgan got a pass for his bad skepticism because he's a leftist, while Dawkins was targeted because he's gotten fed up with the SJWs and committed the capital crime of satirizing feminism.

#24140

Kirbmarc wrote:I have a lingering suspicion that Horgan got a pass for his bad skepticism because he's a leftist, while Dawkins was targeted because he's gotten fed up with the SJWs and committed the capital crime of satirizing feminism.

In a weird way Horgan's "tribalist" accusation has a tiny kernel of truth to it. Because I don't think Horgan got on the NECSS stage on the merit of a strong body of work, good credentials, or being an authoritative expert on anything in particular. He got there because at the time he belonged the correct tribe.

Now Novella's learning that tribe is one that doesn't gel very well with skepticism. Hopefully he does what he can to divorce himself from and stop coddling it in future.

#24141

Billie from Ockham wrote:When I don't like the conclusions that are or aren't supported by the available evidence, I simply update my priors until I get a more pleasing outcome. For example, with carefully selected priors and reference groups, I have proven to seven decimal places that Bigfoot not only exists, but currently lives in Ohio.

I though he was just an average sized foot.

#24142

feathers wrote:Without peeking, can you guess who has a stiff organ for Horgan?

Damion also likes Horgan. The two of them apparently met once, and agreed there was enough hubris to go around for the two of them.

#24143

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Billie from Ockham wrote:When I don't like the conclusions that are or aren't supported by the available evidence, I simply update my priors until I get a more pleasing outcome. For example, with carefully selected priors and reference groups, I have proven to seven decimal places that Bigfoot not only exists, but currently lives in Ohio.
I though he was just an average sized foot.

Average for a (human) Caucasian male, yes. For a Hobbit, however, he's in the 99th percentile.

#24144

Kirbmarc wrote:I have a lingering suspicion that Horgan got a pass for his bad skepticism because he's a leftist, while Dawkins was targeted because he's gotten fed up with the SJWs and committed the capital crime of satirizing feminism.

SJW's science is beholden to their sociopolitical dogma. They're also iconoclasts by nature.

Horgan's ignorance-based trashing of String Theory is not much different than The Skank's infamous snarky, ignorant trashing of EP.

#24145

jet_lagg wrote:
John Horgan wrote: Only on this point do I disagree with Mead. We already have inventions—notably the United Nations—for resolving conflicts peacefully. We just need to use them instead of resorting to the worst invention of all time: war.
I... just...

:bjarte:

Indeed. The UN is, somewhat like the EU, starting to look like a bit of a lost cause. Or at least one badly corrupted by newspeak. A relevant post at UNWatch:

Has the UNHRC turned into Frankenstein’s monster?

Reform or Regression?
Ten Years of the UN Human Rights Council ....

In Saudi Arabia, women are subjugated, Christians are arrested for practicing their religion, democracy blogger Raif Badawi was sentenced to 10 years in prison and a thousand lashes, and beheadings are at an all time high. The Council’s response? Silence. A recent attempt to investigate Saudi Arabia’s carpet bombing of Yemeni civilians was quashed. On the contrary: Saudi Arabia, too, was elected a member. ....

In some related news, a recent post from Jerry Coyne: Senate passes bill allowing U.S. citizens to sue Saudi Arabia for its role in 9/11

.... The measure still has to pass the U.S. House, and I suspect it will, but Obama has said he’ll veto the measure. That, I think, would be an unwise move that puts oil before morality. The Saudis, of course, have protested, saying they’ll pull their assets out of the U.S. if the bill passes, but if Obama vetoes it that may be unnecessary (it takes 2/3 of each house of Congress to overrride such a veto). But a veto sends the wrong message to Saudi Arabia: they can continue subsidizing terrorism without threat of reprisal, and abusing gays, women, apostates, and foreigners, so long as they send us oil and remain our “ally.” It’s time to stop playing pattycake with the Saudis, though. Even the UN coddles them, with a Saudi heading one of the UN’s human rights panels, though the nation is one of the worst human rights abusers in the world. ....

Although maybe even the Saudis are beginning to see the writing on the wall, at least if this is any type of harbinger:
[youtube]ceGqB4raTZo[/youtube]

Something which more or less caused both I and Andrew to fall off our chairs:

#24146

Scented Nectar wrote:And it gets worse. Trudeau is accepting foreign help to fight other current fires, just not for that evil city in Alberta, and nearby regions, with its many evil oil industry employees.

"Trudeau declines international aid for Alberta wildfires: What if it was Fort Mac, QC?"
[youtube]3GcTxN6Ajqg[/youtube]

The bullshit gets even deeper. Trudeau didn't turn down help to Alberta and allow it elsewhere.
The provincial governments call the shots not Trudeau.
My guess is that the provincial gov. hired the US forest service because their assets were near the fires and time and expense made them the most practical choice.
It isn't uncommon for Canadian assets to be used in American fires and vice versa. Foreign assets weren't needed and/or deployment wasn't practical in Alberta.

#24147

feathers wrote:Without peeking, can you guess who has a stiff organ for Horgan?

Well of course! Another asshole throwing stones at the A/S movement, sign old frumpy right up! That is as long as those stones hit the right targets.

#24148

Matt Cavanaugh wrote:Horgan sounds like Damion & Welch's love child.

He's not so bad. Spoken with him once or twice before.

#24149

comhcinc wrote:
Sunder wrote:A few pit people (don't recall exactly who) have in the past taken potshots at Bigfoot Skepticism, but it's not a widely-held opinion.
Yup that was all I was saying.

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=444&p=332593&hilit=bigfoot#p332593

I for one was amazed that Radford ran a chupacabra workshop at conferences.( more along the lines that anyone who would be at a conference wouldn't need a workshop to see that that is all bullshit.) it was explained that the workshop went over de-bunking using the chupacabra as an example. So my reply/attitude was " fair enough, I stand corrected.

Just a mea culpa as one who could be accused.

#24150

d4m10n wrote:
Matt Cavanaugh wrote:Horgan sounds like Damion & Welch's love child.
He's not so bad. Spoken with him once or twice before.

So you are admitting you are pretty bad.

#24151

The American Humanist Association finally acknowledges that humanism isn't a philosophy that concerns us all.

http://americanhumanist.org/news/detail ... cial-justi

Washington, DC, May 18, 2016)—To strengthen the humanist presence in social justice movements, today the American Humanist Association launched the Black Humanist Alliance, an adjunct organization that will promote racial justice and solidarity between the Black and humanist communities. In conjunction with the launch, the American Humanist Association is also relaunching its women’s rights adjunct, the Feminist Humanist Alliance, and its LGBTQ adjunct, the LGBTQ Humanist Alliance.

“The humanist community will always be committed to defending the separation of church and state and the civil liberties of nontheists,” said Roy Speckhardt, executive director of the American Humanist Association. “But to truly live out our humanist values of equality and justice, we must also stand in solidarity with people of color, women and LGBTQ individuals, whose rights, dignity and full humanity are sadly still disregarded in our society.”

The goal of the American Humanist Association’s adjuncts is to organize humanist volunteers who will actively engage with issues of racial justice, gender equality and LGBTQ rights in their communities and across the country. Already, these adjunct organizations have mobilized dozens of volunteer leaders, who all demonstrate that nontheists are activists within social justice movements. The American Humanist Association’s social justice leaders will also work within the secular movement to raise awareness about the need for outreach, inclusivity and awareness about social justice issues.

http://aha-files.s3.amazonaws.com/2/f3/ ... nches6.png

#24152

Steersman wrote:
Scented Nectar wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:Sssssh. I'm watching Top Gun. Tom is chasing women into bathrooms.
Totally off topic, but Target's worth is down over $6 billion dollars since the whole trans bathroom thing.
I see it's down 7% or so, although it is maybe moot how much of that is due to their bathroom policy but I expect it has contributed to the drop. Not sure if I've been ninja'd or not, but something on a related issue in The College Fix:
Gender pronoun insanity: New York City promises to FINE people for not using ‘ze’ or ‘hir’

UCLA Law Prof. Eugene Volokh is usually a pretty restrained guy, but the First Amendment expert goes absolutely nuts when talking about a brazen and flagrantly unconstitutional attack on free speech by New York City’s social engineers. ....
Crazier than the proverbial shit-house rats. The linked article by Volokh has some amusingly analogous suggestions about demanding to be called "Milord" or "Your Holiness" or "Sun Person". And a gratifying reference to the Slate article on the 56 genders that Facebook uses. Both points that I've been harping on for some time - maybe he's lurking about? ;-)

That's a good idea. My new pronoun is that they have to use my full name instead. So, if someone is saying that I went to the store and brought back a pop, it's "Scented Nectar went down the street, and then Scented Nectar went into the store. Scented Nectar had a hard time finding the brand of pop that Scented Nectar likes, but then Scented Nectar found it. Scented Nectar bought it and came back here, and now, Scented Nectar has it in front of Scented Nectar." Except with my real, full name. Every time. No she's or hers. No ze's or zirs. You see, that's who I identify as - myself! And then, I will tell them that they got the grammar wrong. They used a Scented Nectar when they should have used a Scented Nectar.

Trudeau wants to add gender identity to the protected groups in the hate crimes section of the criminal code. Currently, they can only be considered discriminated against if they claim it was due to disability, which only true body dysmorphics would probably be willing to do, not the autogynephilic majority. Some other nasty word-crime clause was removed from the hate crime part of the criminal code a year or so before Trudeau was elected, but he'll probably put that one back in there too. I can't remember what the clause was, but I read about it somewhere recently.

We will be the People's Republic Of Chianada soon, and all dissidents will be rounded up for thought and word crimes.

#24153

Scented, y'all come down to Trump's America next year. The last thing anybody will be worrying about is pronouns.

#24154

I mean my take on the skeptics who specialize in supernatural/cryptozoological woo is that they're genuinely fascinated by it, almost to the same degree as believers, but know it just doesn't comport with reality. Not because of intellectual laziness, as it Horgan's accusation. It's just their particular area of interest and they're a lot more enthusiastic about it than other topics.

Novella and crew also correctly point out that telling skeptics what they should and shouldn't focus their attention on is the first resort of the woo-head who wants people to look less deeply into his brand of woo and that often what they want you to be "skeptical" of instead is something that's the personal bugbear of the woo-head, like climate science. For Horgan, it's theoretical physics and astronomy.

#24155

Why did Horgan even mention Pinker, Coyne and Dawkins as "Skeptics"? Have they ever described themselves as such? They disinvited Dawkins, so they should be consistent and don't attempt to claim him when needed. Their people are Rebecca Watson, Amy Roth and the likes.

#24156

Really? wrote:The American Humanist Association finally acknowledges that humanism isn't a philosophy that concerns us all.

http://americanhumanist.org/news/detail ... cial-justi

Washington, DC, May 18, 2016)—To strengthen the humanist presence in social justice movements, today the American Humanist Association launched the Black Humanist Alliance, an adjunct organization that will promote racial justice and solidarity between the Black and humanist communities. In conjunction with the launch, the American Humanist Association is also relaunching its women’s rights adjunct, the Feminist Humanist Alliance, and its LGBTQ adjunct, the LGBTQ Humanist Alliance.

“The humanist community will always be committed to defending the separation of church and state and the civil liberties of nontheists,” said Roy Speckhardt, executive director of the American Humanist Association. “But to truly live out our humanist values of equality and justice, we must also stand in solidarity with people of color, women and LGBTQ individuals, whose rights, dignity and full humanity are sadly still disregarded in our society.”

The goal of the American Humanist Association’s adjuncts is to organize humanist volunteers who will actively engage with issues of racial justice, gender equality and LGBTQ rights in their communities and across the country. Already, these adjunct organizations have mobilized dozens of volunteer leaders, who all demonstrate that nontheists are activists within social justice movements. The American Humanist Association’s social justice leaders will also work within the secular movement to raise awareness about the need for outreach, inclusivity and awareness about social justice issues.
http://aha-files.s3.amazonaws.com/2/f3/ ... nches6.png

Humanists have just replaced one set of Revealed Truths with another, and attempt to enforce submission to the dogma like any other priestly class.

#24157

feathers wrote:Without peeking, can you guess who has a stiff organ for Horgan?

At this point Myers would probably support Deepak Chopra if he attacked Dawkins by claiming he's a racist.

After all he saw nothing wrong with siding with bad_dominicana when she said that science sucks and needs to be changed because because it's the product of white men.

Myers, as we all know, is a tireless fighter for the rights of the minorities oppressed by the White Males Supremacy. Unless they're conservatives or work with the conservatives, of course (like Jamila Bey). Or if they're libertarians. Or they sympathize with GamerGate. Or they're not supporting the end of capitalism. Or they think that Muslims are a bigger threat than Christians these days (like Ayaan Hirsi Ali).

Because, see, TRUE skepticism and reason is supporting quotas, censorship of "harassment" and of rape jokes (when the wrong persons say them), blackballing, witch hunts, the idea that video games and movies are perpetuating racism and misogyny and the rejection of the principles of freedom of speech and innocent proven guilty. TRUE skepticism means that professors must be paid exactly like surgeons, that Muslims are innocent scapegoats, and the the true enemy of the world are the US and open markets.

TRUE skepticism means that trans women are 100% women, naturally born women, always and forever women. And that being fat isn't bad for you. And that being deaf or blind or "neuro-atypical" is just a cultural difference. And let's not forget that reality is a social construct and that hurt feelings trump everything if they're felt by the right person (but they're just Male Tears or the Whining of Sister Punishers and Uncle Toms and Aunt Marys if the wrong person feels them).

This is TRUE skepticism. Everything else is only hero-worship and tribalism.

#24158

Scented Nectar wrote: Trudeau wants to add gender identity to the protected groups in the hate crimes section of the criminal code. Currently, they can only be considered discriminated against if they claim it was due to disability, which only true body dysmorphics would probably be willing to do, not the autogynephilic majority. Some other nasty word-crime clause was removed from the hate crime part of the criminal code a year or so before Trudeau was elected, but he'll probably put that one back in there too. I can't remember what the clause was, but I read about it somewhere recently.

We will be the People's Republic Of Chianada soon, and all dissidents will be rounded up for thought and word crimes.

Your PM's a girly-man. Just sayin'. I bet he wears thongs.

#24159

Aneris wrote:Why did Horgan even mention Pinker, Coyne and Dawkins as "Skeptics"? Have they ever described themselves as such? They disinvited Dawkins, so they should be consistent and don't attempt to claim him when needed. Their people are Rebecca Watson, Amy Roth and the likes.

It is just political speech he is using. And... pretty much anyone who goes after Pinker in generalities is my intellectual enemy. Not saying Pinker is always right, but broad brush attacks on him are a sure sign of a true-believer SJW club member. Fuck Horgan to the moon. At this point, there is nothing he can say that I will trust.

#24160

Aneris wrote:Why did Horgan even mention Pinker, Coyne and Dawkins as "Skeptics"? Have they ever described themselves as such? They disinvited Dawkins, so they should be consistent and don't attempt to claim him when needed. Their people are Rebecca Watson, Amy Roth and the likes.

Except Becky Peez,Amy et.al. Aren't skeptics, their feelings on religion seemed to coincide with the movement. So they jumped on the bandwagon, but when it came time to examine their own sacred cows they wanted no part of it. Skeptics don't do that. We investigate, we discuss the pros and cons, we allow empirical evidence to guide us. Sure we may initially go from the gut, but if this impulse is proven wrong we admit it and move on.
They have shown they are incapable of that. Hence they are not skeptics, only parasitical hangers on .

#24161

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Scented Nectar wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:The idea that we need help from Russia to fight those fires is just ridiculous.
Next door to Alberta is BC, that has top quality resources that are called on to fight fires worldwide.
These fires flamed up quickly, nevertheless have been controlled to the degree that there has been minimal damage to the infrastructure and been no fatalities.
Meanwhile, BC has plenty of resources yet to be called to help, because it isn't really needed.
Rebel Media is full of shit.
Why are they full of shit? They are just the messengers. It doesn't matter that BC has resources, since the gov't in Alberta cancelled waterbomber contracts before the fires, even though they knew it was going to be a bad fire season.

" Notley NDP cancelled water bomber tenders AFTER anticipating “very busy fire season” "
[youtube]a_37u6Vr9_E[/youtube]

Jebus Scented, you are getting your news from the equivalent of Alex Jones/ Glenn Beck now?
They said Trudeau "is letting Alberta burn". It is the provincial government's responsibility to fight fires not the feds. The feds gave Notley everything she asked for, so that is just a lie.
Large water bombers like Coulson Air Tankers Mars Water Bomber are useless in that area because the lakes in that area are too shallow and small for large water skimmers.
Fires are mainly fought by removing fuel to create fire breaks ahead of an advancing fire. Aircraft have a limited role which is hitting smaller areas where the fire is not too large. Even the largest of the water bombers, the Mars can only cover 4 acres on a drop and even with that capacity if the fire is too big the drop will evaporate before it can get to the flames.
They had all the aircraft and resources they needed or could handle. They didn't let Fort Mac "burn to the ground", despite how quickly the fire advanced they saved more than 80% of the city and all the major infrastructure.
The forest type in question naturally burns every so often, then rather quickly regenerates so the forest is renewed, the CO2 that was released is recaptured, and the young forest is typically better wildlife habitat than the older forest.
The mistakes made aren't being made by people currently fighting the large fire. Better forest management like strategic harvesting and controlled burns could have prevented this/these fires from growing so large and difficult to fight.
Ezra Levant is a extremist right wing propagandist that could never get enough of kissing Harper's ass while he was in power and can't help himself from telling lies if it helps peddle his fringe politics.

I'll keep the shallow lake thing in mind, but I'm not too happy about that NDPer who tweeted that it's karma that an oil town has burned down. They are all claiming it's climate change rather than accept that it's just a bad fire season. It reminds me of some show I watched on Netflix a while back where some silly lefty country (Norway?) turns green, bans oil without thinking it through, and chaos ensues.

I hated Harper back when he was in, but now I think that was at least partly unfounded. I'm a fuck of a lot more right wing myself than I used to be in many ways. I've mostly always considered myself left to central, but I'm agreeing way more with the right these days.

And say what you will about Ezra, but he's got balls, and he stands up for free speech. I don't know what lies you're referring to though, so I can't form an opinion on that one.

#24162

Aneris wrote:Why did Horgan even mention Pinker, Coyne and Dawkins as "Skeptics"? Have they ever described themselves as such? They disinvited Dawkins, so they should be consistent and don't attempt to claim him when needed. Their people are Rebecca Watson, Amy Roth and the likes.

I checked to see if Coyne has responded to this and if he has I missed it.

I would expect it to be brought to his attention though.

Spike13 wrote:Except Becky Peez,Amy et.al. Aren't skeptics, their feelings on religion seemed to coincide with the movement. So they jumped on the bandwagon, but when it came time to examine their own sacred cows they wanted no part of it. Skeptics don't do that. We investigate, we discuss the pros and cons, we allow empirical evidence to guide us. Sure we may initially go from the gut, but if this impulse is proven wrong we admit it and move on.
They have shown they are incapable of that. Hence they are not skeptics, only parasitical hangers on .

They identify as skeptics, even if they're not, but Aneris's point is that when it comes time for the public paddling, they trot out people who don't actually identify as skeptics (even if they do a better job than most self-described skeptics of practicing its tenets). One group gets the perks of association with no effort and another gets the downsides.

#24163

I mean if Coyne doesn't say anything on his own behalf I can't imagine him letting a swipe at Carroll go unremarked considering how often he praises the guy.

#24164

Really? wrote:The American Humanist Association finally acknowledges that humanism isn't a philosophy that concerns us all.

http://americanhumanist.org/news/detail ... cial-justi

Washington, DC, May 18, 2016)—To strengthen the humanist presence in social justice movements, today the American Humanist Association launched the Black Humanist Alliance, an adjunct organization that will promote racial justice and solidarity between the Black and humanist communities. In conjunction with the launch, the American Humanist Association is also relaunching its women’s rights adjunct, the Feminist Humanist Alliance, and its LGBTQ adjunct, the LGBTQ Humanist Alliance.

In a whiffy, these 'adjuncts' will be rolling over the floor fighting about the proper use of pronouns and whether the doors of the recently introduced Asian Genderqueer toilet should be left- or right-swinging.

#24165

Scented Nectar wrote:That's a good idea. My new pronoun is that they have to use my full name instead. So, if someone is saying that I went to the store and brought back a pop, it's "Scented Nectar went down the street, and then Scented Nectar went into the store. Scented Nectar had a hard time finding the brand of pop that Scented Nectar likes, but then Scented Nectar found it. Scented Nectar bought it and came back here, and now, Scented Nectar has it in front of Scented Nectar." Except with my real, full name. Every time. No she's or hers. No ze's or zirs. You see, that's who I identify as - myself! And then, I will tell them that they got the grammar wrong. They used a Scented Nectar when they should have used a Scented Nectar.

You could also add: Scented Nectar (Praise Be Upon Scented Nectar)...

#24166

Scented Nectar wrote:
Steersman wrote: <snip>
Crazier than the proverbial shit-house rats. The linked article by Volokh has some amusingly analogous suggestions about demanding to be called "Milord" or "Your Holiness" or "Sun Person". And a gratifying reference to the Slate article on the 56 genders that Facebook uses. Both points that I've been harping on for some time - maybe he's lurking about? ;-)
That's a good idea. My new pronoun is that they have to use my full name instead. .... Except with my real, full name. Every time. No she's or hers. No ze's or zirs. You see, that's who I identify as - myself! And then, I will tell them that they got the grammar wrong. They used a Scented Nectar when they should have used a Scented Nectar.

:-) Exactly. And not just pronouns but likewise with gender. If Slate has 56 of the latter then why not 56 trillion? Why not just our names as our genders so we can all be special snowflakes. Crazier than shit-house rats, the lot of them.

Scented Nectar wrote:Trudeau wants to add gender identity to the protected groups in the hate crimes section of the criminal code. ....

We will be the People's Republic Of Chianada soon, and all dissidents will be rounded up for thought and word crimes.

:-) Indeed. Speaking of which:

BTW, that "SenJaffer" is a Liberal Senator and while, apparently, a Muslim (of one of the more rational sects, I think), she was also quite critical of Harper's anti-prostitution Bill C36.

#24167

feathers wrote:
Really? wrote:The American Humanist Association finally acknowledges that humanism isn't a philosophy that concerns us all.

http://americanhumanist.org/news/detail ... cial-justi

Washington, DC, May 18, 2016)—To strengthen the humanist presence in social justice movements, today the American Humanist Association launched the Black Humanist Alliance, an adjunct organization that will promote racial justice and solidarity between the Black and humanist communities. In conjunction with the launch, the American Humanist Association is also relaunching its women’s rights adjunct, the Feminist Humanist Alliance, and its LGBTQ adjunct, the LGBTQ Humanist Alliance.
In a whiffy, these 'adjuncts' will be rolling over the floor fighting about the proper use of pronouns and whether the doors of the recently introduced Asian Genderqueer toilet should be left- or right-swinging.

The Facebook comments are beautiful and are a total reminder of the aftermath of Atheism Plus. Looks like AHA forgot that whole bit about if you don't learn about history, you are something something.

https://media.giphy.com/media/11OOAQSnUaZT2M/giphy.gif

#24168

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:Scented, y'all come down to Trump's America next year. The last thing anybody will be worrying about is pronouns.

Trump, Trump, Trump!

Hey, are you married? I need a way in. It won't be open borders once he's in office. :)

#24169

Really? wrote:The Facebook comments are beautiful and are a total reminder of the aftermath of Atheism Plus. Looks like AHA forgot that whole bit about if you don't learn about history, you are something something.

Shouldn't even need the example of A+ to see that fracturing your own movement is always a dumb move.

You can either have a big tent or a bunch of little tents. Humanism wants to be a big tent movement, so they should act like one.

#24170

Sunder wrote:
Really? wrote:The Facebook comments are beautiful and are a total reminder of the aftermath of Atheism Plus. Looks like AHA forgot that whole bit about if you don't learn about history, you are something something.
Shouldn't even need the example of A+ to see that fracturing your own movement is always a dumb move.

You can either have a big tent or a bunch of little tents. Humanism wants to be a big tent movement, so they should act like one.

Indeed, suicide by virtue signaling.

#24171

Matt Cavanaugh wrote:
Scented Nectar wrote: Trudeau wants to add gender identity to the protected groups in the hate crimes section of the criminal code. Currently, they can only be considered discriminated against if they claim it was due to disability, which only true body dysmorphics would probably be willing to do, not the autogynephilic majority. Some other nasty word-crime clause was removed from the hate crime part of the criminal code a year or so before Trudeau was elected, but he'll probably put that one back in there too. I can't remember what the clause was, but I read about it somewhere recently.

We will be the People's Republic Of Chianada soon, and all dissidents will be rounded up for thought and word crimes.
Your PM's a girly-man. Just sayin'. I bet he wears thongs.

He looks way so much like Wesley Crusher too, which just makes the wimpiness worse. :)

#24172

So I will ask again (and keep on asking dammit!)

Want to do another pit hangout?

Tell me when and how!

#24173

Matt Cavanaugh wrote:NECSS lost Dawkins, but got this crank dipshit instead:

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cro ... -war-more/

Arrgh, that's really annoying, I've occasionally enjoyed his articles in the past, shame to see him Saying the Right Words.

#24174

Scented Nectar wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:Scented, y'all come down to Trump's America next year. The last thing anybody will be worrying about is pronouns.
Trump, Trump, Trump!

Hey, are you married? I need a way in. It won't be open borders once he's in office. :)

Happily married. But my brother-in-law...

#24175

jimhabegger wrote:This interests me because it discusses some issues that I've been thinking about, like the abandonment of class analysis, and alienation of white men, in liberal politics:
Identity Politics & Class Struggle

Divide and conquer? One strategy of keeping your subject population who vastly outnumber you from rising up and overthrowing you, is to keep them at each other's throats.

*shrug*

YMMV

#24176

comhcinc wrote:So I will ask again (and keep on asking dammit!)

Want to do another pit hangout?

Tell me when and how!

When-whenever. How, I guess I gotta fire up the boiler on my Windows machine. Last weekend I had four teenage girls infesting the house, this weekend looks to be the same. Gonna pull up an easy chair in the garage and bravely hide from the cacaphony.

#24177

feathers wrote:
Really? wrote:The American Humanist Association finally acknowledges that humanism isn't a philosophy that concerns us all.

http://americanhumanist.org/news/detail ... cial-justi

Washington, DC, May 18, 2016)—To strengthen the humanist presence in social justice movements, today the American Humanist Association launched the Black Humanist Alliance, an adjunct organization that will promote racial justice and solidarity between the Black and humanist communities. In conjunction with the launch, the American Humanist Association is also relaunching its women’s rights adjunct, the Feminist Humanist Alliance, and its LGBTQ adjunct, the LGBTQ Humanist Alliance.
In a whiffy, these 'adjuncts' will be rolling over the floor fighting about the proper use of pronouns and whether the doors of the recently introduced Asian Genderqueer toilet should be left- or right-swinging.

Whichever one helps left handed people to be accommodated. That's an actual movement. I would have embedded a video here talking about a current complaint someone made about his left-handedness being discriminated against, but I can't find it now. I saw it just the other day.

#24178

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
comhcinc wrote:So I will ask again (and keep on asking dammit!)

Want to do another pit hangout?

Tell me when and how!
When-whenever. How, I guess I gotta fire up the boiler on my Windows machine. Last weekend I had four teenage girls infesting the house, this weekend looks to be the same. Gonna pull up an easy chair in the garage and bravely hide from the cacophony.

We need to make sure your skype is ready to go. I think we have had troubles with that in the past.

#24179

Scented Nectar wrote:

I don't know what lies you're referring to though, so I can't form an opinion on that one.

For example, his and his reporter's statements that Trudeau was making a decision on who or what resources were used on the fires. These decisions are made by provincial authorities. The only federal decision was to provide military assistance when asked which he did without hesitation.
I have had friends that flew for one of the world's most highly regarded wildfire fighters, and have personally worked in forestry and fought on the front lines of a rather nasty fire. Those videos had outright falsehoods in them as well produced by someone that apparently didn't know shit about what they were talking about.
I would highly recommend you think twice about believing what Rebel Media says without double checking.

#24180

Sunder wrote:
Really? wrote:The Facebook comments are beautiful and are a total reminder of the aftermath of Atheism Plus. Looks like AHA forgot that whole bit about if you don't learn about history, you are something something.
Shouldn't even need the example of A+ to see that fracturing your own movement is always a dumb move.

You can either have a big tent or a bunch of little tents. Humanism wants to be a big tent movement, so they should act like one.

AHA should be a growing organization, but they are not. My theory is that so many people are non-religious now that Humanist organizations don't really have a purpose. So, they have to latch onto a very specific philosophy to recruit and get support. I hung out at some of our local Humanist meetings but I quickly discovered there was very little for us to do. The group had only about 20 people (and this is the only Humanist group in the entire Detroit area). Humanism preaches a kind of morality model. This is based on a simplistic "golden rule" ethic. They don't really fight for much except being nice to everyone. Life should just be nice. Haha. They tiptoe through meetings trying to say something without causing any controversy. They speak in platitudes and round-about statements.

Anyway.... I think the only chance they have to survive is to go full SJW. This is their thing.