There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

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ConcentratedH2O, OM
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1681

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM »

MarcusAu wrote: I recently shelled out for a new desktop PC myself...

https://media.rs-online.com/t_large/F8111284-01.jpg
No dickpics please. [/Steersman]

KenD
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1682

Post by KenD »

InfraRedBucket wrote: So Shane McGowan makes his 60th but Mark E Smith doesnt make it to 61
marke.jpg
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-42811968
After his state the last time they toured I can't say it's the most shocking and unexpected of music industry deaths...



...but it's sad to think that we'll only ever have 32 albums (not counting side projects, live recordings, bootlegs, or compilations) of Fall music to listen to.

He was not appreciated.


Brive1987
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1683

Post by Brive1987 »

Brive1987 wrote: LaurenS continues her “nationalist tourism” cucking of Faith’s SA dream.


Right. At 1:32 magic happens.

We go from a frankly unattractive South African “blood sister” describing severed hands, pulled nails and sundry torture to her being defocussed in favour of a rear POV crisp shot of Lauren’s trad-thot braid.

And back again.

It’s like an alt-right money shot.

:cdc:

feathers
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1684

Post by feathers »

VickyCaramel wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:46 pm
A while later I met him again and he apologized... but started off on another rant. During all this time he had never actually mentioned his experience of the war, and by the way he was talking you would imagine he had built the bridge over the river Kwai. It turned out he had spent the war servicing air conditioners hundreds of miles behind the front line and had never even seen a Jap let alone been tortured by one.
[...]
I think what it is down to is that justice wasn't seen to be done. Few of those directly responsible ever faced trial, the Japanese government and Emperor were not punished, never took responsibility and never apologized. As far as they are concerned a crime was committed against their comrades, and then a great injustice was done to them. The Japs got away with it, I guess that can eat away at you for 50-60 years.
I also suspect several of those who where in the theatre, but somehow escaped the torture, later felt some sense of guilt which translated in a more expressive disdain (while many of the real victims would rather not talk about it).

Clarence
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1685

Post by Clarence »

Brive1987 wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: LaurenS continues her “nationalist tourism” cucking of Faith’s SA dream.


Right. At 1:32 magic happens.

We go from a frankly unattractive South African “blood sister” describing severed hands, pulled nails and sundry torture to her being defocussed in favour of a rear POV crisp shot of Lauren’s trad-thot braid.

And back again.

It’s like an alt-right money shot.

:cdc:
I'd climb it.

Clarence
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1686

Post by Clarence »

LaurSouthern,LaurSouthern, let down your hair!

Phil_Giordana_FCD
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1687

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

feathers wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:28 pm


I also suspect several of those who where in the theatre, but somehow escaped the torture, later felt some sense of guilt which translated in a more expressive disdain (while many of the real victims would rather not talk about it).
Didn't we move the Star Wars discussion elsewhere?

feathers
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1688

Post by feathers »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:18 am
feathers wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:28 pm


I also suspect several of those who where in the theatre, but somehow escaped the torture, later felt some sense of guilt which translated in a more expressive disdain (while many of the real victims would rather not talk about it).
Didn't we move the Star Wars discussion elsewhere?
:rimshot:

Shatterface
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1689

Post by Shatterface »

dogen wrote:
Shatterface wrote: I can understand the hatred for the Japanese. A lot of Brits of my generation hate the Argentinians for what they did in the Eighties. Fucking 'Hand of God' my arse.
BPE nomination!
My great great grandfather died in a gas attack in Ypres just after Christmas 1914. In his last letter home he said 'I will forgive the boche for the horrors they inflicted upon us. Goal-hanging twats.'

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1690

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Is it Sunday again?

Keating
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1691

Post by Keating »

I'm still recovering from your birthday party.

deLurch
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1692

Post by deLurch »


VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1693

Post by VickyCaramel »

feathers wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:46 pm
A while later I met him again and he apologized... but started off on another rant. During all this time he had never actually mentioned his experience of the war, and by the way he was talking you would imagine he had built the bridge over the river Kwai. It turned out he had spent the war servicing air conditioners hundreds of miles behind the front line and had never even seen a Jap let alone been tortured by one.
[...]
I think what it is down to is that justice wasn't seen to be done. Few of those directly responsible ever faced trial, the Japanese government and Emperor were not punished, never took responsibility and never apologized. As far as they are concerned a crime was committed against their comrades, and then a great injustice was done to them. The Japs got away with it, I guess that can eat away at you for 50-60 years.
I also suspect several of those who where in the theatre, but somehow escaped the torture, later felt some sense of guilt which translated in a more expressive disdain (while many of the real victims would rather not talk about it).
Yep. Survivor guilt would be a logical explanation.

Snapfingers
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1694

Post by Snapfingers »

Keating wrote: I'm still recovering from your birthday party.
Please point to where the french guy touched you.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1695

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Snapfingers wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:53 am
Keating wrote: I'm still recovering from your birthday party.
Please point to where the french guy touched you.
And add a #MeToo hashtag.

MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1696

Post by MarcusAu »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Snapfingers wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:53 am
Keating wrote: I'm still recovering from your birthday party.
Please point to where the french guy touched you.
And add a #MeToo hashtag.
I'd say 'Moi aussi' might be more relevant - for either Keating or Phil.

Guest_d2e60302

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1697

Post by Guest_d2e60302 »

So this



leads to

http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/25/health/cu ... index.html

Cuckolding can be positive for some couples, study says

and is illustrated by a photo of three people, a man holding hands with a woman separated by some distance, but her arm is wrapped around the waist of another man.

and yes, the first link in the above is to

https://link.springer.com/article/10.10 ... 017-1096-0
The Psychology of Gay Men’s Cuckolding Fantasies

CNN represents that study about gay men, to be representative of what is true for heterosexual couples.
But, according to a recent study by David Ley, Justin Lehmiller and the writer Dan Savage, acting on cuckolding fantasies can be a largely positive experience for many couples, and hardly a sign of weakness.
The way CNN frames it really is terrible, generalizing from a study about gay men to "many couples" where most people would assume that means mostly het couples, since there are far more het couples than gay couples.

It's perhaps not as bad as that as one of the authors of the study, David Ley, has written a book about "Insatiable Wives" addressing cuckolding in het couples, and is writing another book....

Still, jebus CNN, talk about #fakenews

Shatterface
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1698

Post by Shatterface »

Ive never understood the difference between the statements 'My wife is insatiable' and 'I can't satisfy my wife'.

InfraRedBucket
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1699

Post by InfraRedBucket »

Shatterface wrote: Ive never understood the difference between the statements 'My wife is insatiable' and 'I can't satisfy my wife'.
"My wife's gone on holiday to India"
"Goa?"
"Well she does have a strong libido"

-

CommanderTuvok
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1700

Post by CommanderTuvok »

I didn't hear about this during the trial, but you know that feminist hero judge presiding over the trial of that rapey gymnast coach....well, she has upset some for suggesting the coach deserves to be sexually assaulted in prison.

[Warning: link to HuffPo]

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/la ... 25326595eb

gurugeorge
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1701

Post by gurugeorge »

So there's more Youtube drama lama around the "Sceptic" community atm. There's a developing new format of internet blood sports, where people just get right into the mosh pit on live streams and hash out accusations and counter-accusations, while the baying mob gleefully looks on dropping superchat monies on the host. Leading channels using this format so far are Andy Warski (who now regularly co-hosts live-streams with JF Gariepy as the "Alt Right Science Guy" and general wrangler) and a guy called Tonka Saw, who's a bit like Joe Rogan on steroids and meth (ex wrestler apparently). Metokur frequents Tonka Saw's streams quite often, egging on the glorious shitshow.

Hot off the press atm are some rather confusing and somewhat unsubstantiated - but spicy - accusations by Naked Ape against the likes of TJ Kirk, and the "internet Atheists" generally. Rumours are afloat that TJ Kirk shut down Ape's latest (and to say the least) acerbic video about "internet atheists" and "sceptics" -though it's also quite possible the video might just have been taken down because it included Neal de Grasse Tyson in its thumping great broadsides. Possible kid gloves treatment of a Drunken Peasants Discord mod's hebephilia may be at issue too, though that's pretty sketchy.

All good, clean fun!

Billie from Ockham
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1702

Post by Billie from Ockham »

Guest_d2e60302 wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 8:20 pm
Irish chick complaining about English. I wonder if her name is something like (the fiddler player) Mairéad Ni Mhaonaigh, which is (obviously) pronounced: muh-rade nuh wee-nee.

Billie from Ockham
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1703

Post by Billie from Ockham »

Kirbmarc wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:17 pm
Maher is a breath of fresh air. Gillibrand has gone full SJW, and I really hope she won't be nominated in the 2020 election.
I believe that it was Gillibrand who brought Mattress Girl to a State of the Union address.

MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1704

Post by MarcusAu »

gurugeorge wrote: ...

All good, clean fun!
I dunno, I get rather a depressingly nihilistic vibe from all this. As if nothing much matters except for the shits and giggles.

There's also the Alt-Right and 'race-realism' debate feeding into this too.

gurugeorge
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1705

Post by gurugeorge »

MarcusAu wrote:
gurugeorge wrote: ...

All good, clean fun!
I dunno, I get rather a depressingly nihilistic vibe from all this. As if nothing much matters except for the shits and giggles.

There's also the Alt-Right and 'race-realism' debate feeding into this too.
I do think there's a bit of nihilism with those things sometimes, but it's really a mixed bag - sometimes there's good stuff - and that's partly what makes the format fun to watch.

As to the Alt Right feeding into it, I think that's a good thing - the debates between the Alt Right and the classical liberals are some of the most stimulating things on Youtube at the moment IMO. James Allsup recently had a discussion in similar livestream format between Nuance Bro (who's a straightforward civic nationalist) and Mike Enoch, and it was really good - you got a much clearer idea of Enoch's arguments (he's no slouch), where the Alt Right position makes sense and where it doesn't.

Really?
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1706

Post by Really? »

Guest_d2e60302 wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:07 am
So this



leads to

http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/25/health/cu ... index.html

Cuckolding can be positive for some couples, study says

and is illustrated by a photo of three people, a man holding hands with a woman separated by some distance, but her arm is wrapped around the waist of another man.

and yes, the first link in the above is to

https://link.springer.com/article/10.10 ... 017-1096-0
The Psychology of Gay Men’s Cuckolding Fantasies

CNN represents that study about gay men, to be representative of what is true for heterosexual couples.
But, according to a recent study by David Ley, Justin Lehmiller and the writer Dan Savage, acting on cuckolding fantasies can be a largely positive experience for many couples, and hardly a sign of weakness.
The way CNN frames it really is terrible, generalizing from a study about gay men to "many couples" where most people would assume that means mostly het couples, since there are far more het couples than gay couples.

It's perhaps not as bad as that as one of the authors of the study, David Ley, has written a book about "Insatiable Wives" addressing cuckolding in het couples, and is writing another book....

Still, jebus CNN, talk about #fakenews
That's nothing. The opening segment of tonight's Rachel Maddow was devoted to a bukkake tutorial.

Really?
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1707

Post by Really? »

CommanderTuvok wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:50 pm
I didn't hear about this during the trial, but you know that feminist hero judge presiding over the trial of that rapey gymnast coach....well, she has upset some for suggesting the coach deserves to be sexually assaulted in prison.

[Warning: link to HuffPo]

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/la ... 25326595eb
Sexual assault is the worst thing ever and any comedian who tells a rape joke deserves to be run out of town, but lololplol there are more rapes in prisons than outside of prisons and they deserve it because they're men lololololamyschumerlolol

Brive1987
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1708

Post by Brive1987 »

Here’s how a civic nationalist multi cultural society celebrates its awkward “Australia Day”. A day that presupposes an objective common bond and one outrageously hinged on the arrival of the British First Fleet in 1788.

Fucking “invasion day” and demands for the obliteration of our offending history.

http://i.imgur.com/5kDbDqx.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/zXDeO4J.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/zXDeO4J.jpg

Keating
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1709

Post by Keating »

Time to start taking aboriginal kids away from their parents and see they get a proper education.

Matt Cavanaugh
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1710

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Billie from Ockham wrote: I wonder if her name is something like (the fiddler player) Mairéad Ni Mhaonaigh, which is (obviously) pronounced: muh-rade nuh wee-nee.
Or singer, Maighread Ní Dhomhnaill?


Brive1987
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1711

Post by Brive1987 »

Keating wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 9:02 pm
Time to start taking aboriginal kids away from their parents and see they get a proper education.

Sometimes you don’t even have to ask.


Really?
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1712

Post by Really? »

Shatterface wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:45 am
Ive never understood the difference between the statements 'My wife is insatiable' and 'I can't satisfy my wife'.
You can really only understand the difference if you have a PhD in history from Columbia and you think that August Brunsman's sperm on your face and in your mucus membranes will bring you closer to happiness and greater understanding with regard to the nature of humanity. A nature that was static for thousands of years, but has now completely changed in the era of university club speaker stipends.

Guest_d2e60302

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1713

Post by Guest_d2e60302 »

If you have 5+ hours, some rando lawyer examines the Damore lawsuit in a series of videos where he drinks alcohol and takes apart lawsuits.

Doing so, he's apparently run afoul of Google's internal sjws.





I'm only 17 minutes in, but here are the videos (so far?)




Kirbmarc
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1714

Post by Kirbmarc »

Brive1987 wrote: Here’s how a civic nationalist multi cultural society celebrates its awkward “Australia Day”. A day that presupposes an objective common bond and one outrageously hinged on the arrival of the British First Fleet in 1788.

Fucking “invasion day” and demands for the obliteration of our offending history.

http://i.imgur.com/5kDbDqx.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/zXDeO4J.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/zXDeO4J.jpg
FYI, this isn't civic nationalism. At all. Civic nationalism would be teaching the civic value of the date as a civic celebration while acknowledging the flaws in Australia's past. This is Po-Mo white guilt, which is all about bitching, with no constructive parts, and helps no one.

Shatterface
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1715

Post by Shatterface »

Really? wrote:
Shatterface wrote:
Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:45 am
Ive never understood the difference between the statements 'My wife is insatiable' and 'I can't satisfy my wife'.
You can really only understand the difference if you have a PhD in history from Columbia and you think that August Brunsman's sperm on your face and in your mucus membranes will bring you closer to happiness and greater understanding with regard to the nature of humanity. A nature that was static for thousands of years, but has now completely changed in the era of university club speaker stipends.
I think being a cuck merits a Darwin Award.

It might not kill you but allowing someone else to have sex with your wife is the definition of a maladaptive sexual strategy.

Brive1987
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1716

Post by Brive1987 »

Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Here’s how a civic nationalist multi cultural society celebrates its awkward “Australia Day”. A day that presupposes an objective common bond and one outrageously hinged on the arrival of the British First Fleet in 1788.

Fucking “invasion day” and demands for the obliteration of our offending history.

[I.MG]http://i.imgur.com/5kDbDqx.jpg[/IMG]

[I.MG]http://i.imgur.com/zXDeO4J.jpg[/IMG]

[I.MG]http://i.imgur.com/zXDeO4J.jpg[/IMG]
FYI, this isn't civic nationalism. At all. Civic nationalism would be teaching the civic value of the date as a civic celebration while acknowledging the flaws in Australia's past. This is Po-Mo white guilt, which is all about bitching, with no constructive parts, and helps no one.
One problem with "civic nationalism" is that the list of required civic virtues is subjective. When you inject wet liberal wankery and celebrate sacred multiculti silos well, you end up a short beige list indeed.

Alas, respect for a date rooted in white colonial imperialism does not, apparently, make the cut. We are quite happy to see the day as an optional extra to core values of ... whatever. Presumably selective rule of law and freedom of speech for all left leaning views.

Brive1987
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1717

Post by Brive1987 »

In all honesty Australia Day is a quaint legacy of ethno nationalism. FFS it celebrates the raising of a British flag announcing European ownership while the wogs looked on. It is hilariously inappropriate for a post national state. We just dont have the balls to call the spade a bloody shovel. more accurately, Australia is a bipolar state; Aussie land and then the shitholes of Melb and Sydney.

DrokkIt
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1718

Post by DrokkIt »

John D wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:07 pm
Does this guy ever sleep???
Peterson has 'gone over' in a big way since the Newman interview.

Last night I went to the cinema with a few mates, guys I went to school with decades ago. Apropos of nothing, one of them brought Peterson up in conversation, saying how he seemed so reasonable and the response is crazy etc.

These guys are not political, nor are they skeptic types or anything like that, just regular dudes with kids and a mortgage. Peterson has a vast audience receptive to his message on the horizon.

VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1719

Post by VickyCaramel »

DrokkIt wrote:
John D wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:07 pm
Does this guy ever sleep???
Peterson has 'gone over' in a big way since the Newman interview.

Last night I went to the cinema with a few mates, guys I went to school with decades ago. Apropos of nothing, one of them brought Peterson up in conversation, saying how he seemed so reasonable and the response is crazy etc.

These guys are not political, nor are they skeptic types or anything like that, just regular dudes with kids and a mortgage. Peterson has a vast audience receptive to his message on the horizon.
I mentioned this already, but 2 years ago, my inlaws who are all teachers, all their friends were largely fully signed up to social justice and especially feminism. I am not entirely sure what happened, maybe it is because they have sons and teach young boys and actually fucking care about them, maybe it is because they are ambitious and own their own homes... maybe Corbyn scares the crap out of them and Brexit gave them hope?
To cut a long story short, they are now watching Peterson, Sam Harris, Douglas Murray and even Pat Condell and the conversations over Xmas was about Jacob Rees-Mogg. I didn't find out about this dramatic conversion until my elderly mother (a life long anti-feminist) quoted Peterson and said she had seen his videos because these lefty teachers had been sharing them on facebook.

I doubt people like this see the situation with much nuance. They have exposure to meme/culture war which has made Clinton look bad and Trump look good. Corbyn has communist flags while Rees-Mogg sounds good on QT. The mass migration looks bad, being called a Nazi feels bad, the constant anti-white, anti-male stuff looks insane.

...and you might not be surprised to know that when fully fledged feminists swap sides, they maintain a lot of their evangelical zeal.

John D
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1720

Post by John D »

Horowitz is pretty good in case youall have never watched him.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1721

Post by DrokkIt »

VickyCaramel wrote:
DrokkIt wrote:
John D wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:07 pm
Does this guy ever sleep???
Peterson has 'gone over' in a big way since the Newman interview.

Last night I went to the cinema with a few mates, guys I went to school with decades ago. Apropos of nothing, one of them brought Peterson up in conversation, saying how he seemed so reasonable and the response is crazy etc.

These guys are not political, nor are they skeptic types or anything like that, just regular dudes with kids and a mortgage. Peterson has a vast audience receptive to his message on the horizon.
I mentioned this already, but 2 years ago, my inlaws who are all teachers, all their friends were largely fully signed up to social justice and especially feminism. I am not entirely sure what happened, maybe it is because they have sons and teach young boys and actually fucking care about them, maybe it is because they are ambitious and own their own homes... maybe Corbyn scares the crap out of them and Brexit gave them hope?
To cut a long story short, they are now watching Peterson, Sam Harris, Douglas Murray and even Pat Condell and the conversations over Xmas was about Jacob Rees-Mogg. I didn't find out about this dramatic conversion until my elderly mother (a life long anti-feminist) quoted Peterson and said she had seen his videos because these lefty teachers had been sharing them on facebook.

I doubt people like this see the situation with much nuance. They have exposure to meme/culture war which has made Clinton look bad and Trump look good. Corbyn has communist flags while Rees-Mogg sounds good on QT. The mass migration looks bad, being called a Nazi feels bad, the constant anti-white, anti-male stuff looks insane.

...and you might not be surprised to know that when fully fledged feminists swap sides, they maintain a lot of their evangelical zeal.
I also think a big part of it is feminism as a general social movement v the actual facts of it's ideology. A lot of people are going to have the basic stance of "treat everyone the same" and feminism does a good enough job as representing itself as that. However, as we all know, when you get up close to it things are quite different.

I think a lot of people (myself included) were optimistic about Corbyn at first -seemed to have the form of pro-working class labour- but have soured on him (and especially McDonnell etc) since thanks to a bunch of stuff. Between this and May's anti-internet sotfball brexit mess a lot of people are put off by both sides. Which means the tribal aspect of it probably becomes emphasised.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1722

Post by VickyCaramel »

DrokkIt wrote: I think a lot of people (myself included) were optimistic about Corbyn at first -seemed to have the form of pro-working class labour- but have soured on him (and especially McDonnell etc) since thanks to a bunch of stuff. Between this and May's anti-internet sotfball brexit mess a lot of people are put off by both sides. Which means the tribal aspect of it probably becomes emphasised.
I think it is Sargon who has pointed out a number of times that the kind of socialist spirit which resonates with "THE working classes™" is based on something which is long gone, we just don't have big dirty factories anymore with thousands of men in flat caps marching through the gates at 8:00 am.

As somebody else pointed out, not everybody who is working class is from that culture anyway... I know I'm not, which is probably why most of the home counties vote conservative. Traditionally my family voted liberal then swung conservative... but never labour.
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Do you think that outside London, Birmingham and Cardiff we don't have working class people?

Aside from a lot of people who are Larp'ing their working class roots, a lot of people who are working class want the benefits system to be rational, they don't want to be hammered with a huge tax bill because they worked a few extra hours (yes, they know the system disincentives them), they want an end to zero-hours contracts, they want employers to guarantee the numbers of hours they work each week. They don't want to be in a situation where they are doing warehouse work and competing with 19 year old immigrants of any fucking colour. The struggle is real, but what they are hearing from the left is that there isn't enough diversity in the corporate boardroom and we have to have affirmative action to close the gender pay gap. How does that help the proverbial Tommy Robinson?

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1723

Post by Kirbmarc »

John D wrote: Horowitz is pretty good in case youall have never watched him.
He's not entirely wrong in saying that utopians don't have a logical approach to reality and are instead oriented towards a possible, tentative future, but I think that he confuses social-democracy with communism. He talks about "socialized medicine" and "the Soviet Union" as if they were the exact same thing. That's...really not the case.

If we take Horowitz' approach to look at the past we can see that the United States themselves has had periods of public works/public investments (the New Deal) in the past. If we look at the history of Europe we can see that public welfare has worked pretty well in WESTERN Europe.

That's a general problem I have with conservatives. They seem to see anything left of center as if it were Marxism, or (even worse) Stalinism and the Soviet Union. This is actually very similar to what liberals do when they think anyone right of center is a fascist/Nazi/white supremacist.

To be fair one of the issue is that people in the "first world" REALLY don't get how LUCKY they are to live in relatively stable, rich, developed liberal democracies with checks and balances. If you really want to look at privilege, one of the biggest privileges in the world is living in the US or the UK or the Netherlands or Germany or Switzerland or Australia or Canada or New Zealand instead of living in Venezuela or North Korea or Libya or Iran or Cuba or Syria or Iraq or Afganistan.

I'm not saying that liberal democracies are perfect, or that there is nothing to change, but they're places where for all their flaws you can at least DISCUSS change, and enjoy a life relatively safe from political/religious violence. The "third world" countries are FUBAR, and one of the biggest reasons for that is political and military instability.

Plenty of people forget about how FREAKING IMPORTANT it is to live in a country where politics is relatively peaceful. Plenty of people in the left mistook Cuba or Venezuela as sources of inspiration, while on the other hands there were a lot of Libertarians who thought Pinochet did nothing wrong and helicopter rides were totes wonderful.

But one problem with people living in First World Countries is that they have First World Reactions to First World Problems. A big issue in First World politics is that anyone thinks that the other side will turn their country into a Third World country, even though this is extremely unlikely, BECAUSE OF the nature of laws, institutions, economy etc. of the First World.

So you get conservatives who think that Obama or Sanders will turn the US into the Soviet Union (which is laughable) while many in the left think that the US under Trump are the New Nazi Germany (which is also laughable).

You get extreme hot takes and comparisons to dictatorships from everyone. This poisons serious and rational political discourse ON SPECIFIC ISSUE. You can't say "corporate tax loopholes hurt the country" or "healthcare should be structured in a way that benefits the citizens more than pharmaceutical corporations and/or insurance companies" because you're called a communist and compared to the Soviet Union or Mao's China. You can't say "identity politics are counterproductive" or "you know, we should reform the police but also understand what causes criminality in some communities, and tackle that as well" or "immigration needs to be regulated, open borders are a pipe dream" or "islam has serious issues with modern values" because you're called a Nazi/white supremacist.

So you get lots of buffoons in politics who use what I'd call (mirroring Horowitz) DYSTOPIANISM.

Dystopianism is the distortion of the positions of your political rivals into an outlandish caricature, for purposes of scare-mongering. Think about "if the Democrats win we'll have communism" or "Bernie Sanders wants redistribution of wealth exactly like they did in Soviet Russia", or, on the other side of the aisle "Trump is going to set up concentration camps for minorities!" or "Republicans hate women and want to wage a War on Women!"

Dystopianism is very effective, maybe even more than utopianism, especially in a liberal democracy. Getting people to vote for you even though your candidate is crap, because they're convinced that the other candidate is Hitler/Stalin/Cthulhu is a great way to win elections.

The problems come AFTER the election, when your candidate is seen as Satan by the other side and so compromise (the heart and soul of politics in a liberal democracy) is seen as making a deal with the Devil, or when you realize you elected a crap candidate because you were so damn afraid of the opposition that you accepted a lot of flaws.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1724

Post by SM1957 »

VickyCaramel wrote: Aside from a lot of people who are Larp'ing their working class roots, a lot of people who are working class want the benefits system to be rational, they don't want to be hammered with a huge tax bill because they worked a few extra hours (yes, they know the system disincentives them), they want an end to zero-hours contracts, they want employers to guarantee the numbers of hours they work each week. They don't want to be in a situation where they are doing warehouse work and competing with 19 year old immigrants of any fucking colour. The struggle is real, but what they are hearing from the left is that there isn't enough diversity in the corporate boardroom and we have to have affirmative action to close the gender pay gap. How does that help the proverbial Tommy Robinson?
The gender pay gap has been closed!

4 men at the BBC are having their salaries reduced.

Hurrah for the feminists!

just give me a few minutes to work out how this helps women or anybody in a low paid, zero hour job....

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1725

Post by Kirbmarc »

VickyCaramel wrote: The struggle is real, but what they are hearing from the left is that there isn't enough diversity in the corporate boardroom and we have to have affirmative action to close the gender pay gap. How does that help the proverbial Tommy Robinson?
It doesn't. The SocJus can actually be VERY corporate-friendly, if corporations know how to use it. In the BBC male journalists are accepting a pay CUT to reduce the pay gap. I can already see some corporations (especially those which hand out large wages to specialized workers) embracing the SocJus to slash the wages of white men to lower the gender gaps. I can see Google deciding to pay white male programmers less and then churn out articles on how this is done to help reduce the pay gap in society at large.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1726

Post by Kirbmarc »

"We're firing more white males and paying the ones we have on payroll less to fight sexism!" "We're reducing worker benefits to white men to fight for the Patriarchy!"

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1727

Post by Kirbmarc »

"We're firing more white males and paying the ones we have on payroll less to fight sexism!" "We're reducing worker benefits to white men to fight for the Patriarchy!"

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1728

Post by DrokkIt »

VickyCaramel wrote:
DrokkIt wrote: I think a lot of people (myself included) were optimistic about Corbyn at first -seemed to have the form of pro-working class labour- but have soured on him (and especially McDonnell etc) since thanks to a bunch of stuff. Between this and May's anti-internet sotfball brexit mess a lot of people are put off by both sides. Which means the tribal aspect of it probably becomes emphasised.
I think it is Sargon who has pointed out a number of times that the kind of socialist spirit which resonates with "THE working classes™" is based on something which is long gone, we just don't have big dirty factories anymore with thousands of men in flat caps marching through the gates at 8:00 am.

As somebody else pointed out, not everybody who is working class is from that culture anyway... I know I'm not, which is probably why most of the home counties vote conservative. Traditionally my family voted liberal then swung conservative... but never labour.
pmap.png
Do you think that outside London, Birmingham and Cardiff we don't have working class people?

Aside from a lot of people who are Larp'ing their working class roots, a lot of people who are working class want the benefits system to be rational, they don't want to be hammered with a huge tax bill because they worked a few extra hours (yes, they know the system disincentives them), they want an end to zero-hours contracts, they want employers to guarantee the numbers of hours they work each week. They don't want to be in a situation where they are doing warehouse work and competing with 19 year old immigrants of any fucking colour. The struggle is real, but what they are hearing from the left is that there isn't enough diversity in the corporate boardroom and we have to have affirmative action to close the gender pay gap. How does that help the proverbial Tommy Robinson?
My observation is simply that a huge amount of working class people tribally hate the tories and strongly dislike voting for them.
My family is like this. I'm from arse-end of nowhere westcountry and I've worked in factories, packing centers and warehouses i.e. lots of places where a entire workforce of men in blue overalls had to queue up and punch in and punch out in pretty much the way you describe.

The tribalism I describe is there, and people at-first thought Corbyn would represent this. But he didn't, and loads quickly went off him for the pro-diversity reasons you describe. My area went tory for the first time in my entire life at the last election (I'm 37) before that it was usually liberals. These generational voting habits seem to persist.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1729

Post by Lsuoma »

SM1957 wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote: Aside from a lot of people who are Larp'ing their working class roots, a lot of people who are working class want the benefits system to be rational, they don't want to be hammered with a huge tax bill because they worked a few extra hours (yes, they know the system disincentives them), they want an end to zero-hours contracts, they want employers to guarantee the numbers of hours they work each week. They don't want to be in a situation where they are doing warehouse work and competing with 19 year old immigrants of any fucking colour. The struggle is real, but what they are hearing from the left is that there isn't enough diversity in the corporate boardroom and we have to have affirmative action to close the gender pay gap. How does that help the proverbial Tommy Robinson?
The gender pay gap has been closed!

4 men at the BBC are having their salaries reduced.

Hurrah for the feminists!

just give me a few minutes to work out how this helps women or anybody in a low paid, zero hour job....
Six.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1730

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

John D wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 6:02 am
Horowitz is pretty good in case youall have never watched him.
David Horowitz is like a horse. He produces a steady and astonishing large pile of shit.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1731

Post by Shatterface »

We'll probably see men at the BBC signal their virtue by publicly celebrating their pay cuts while their agents plot their escape to Amazon, Netflix or Sky.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1732

Post by free thoughtpolice »

Sources claim Dutch intelligence discovered hackers that were interfering in American election, even tracking them to Russia and catching them on camera.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-neth ... SKBN1FE34W

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1733

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:35 am
Sources claim Dutch intelligence discovered hackers that were interfering in American election, even tracking them to Russia and catching them on camera.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-neth ... SKBN1FE34W
Fucking hell!

viewtopic.php?f=29&t=514

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1734

Post by VickyCaramel »

free thoughtpolice wrote: Sources claim Dutch intelligence discovered hackers that were interfering in American election, even tracking them to Russia and catching them on camera.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-neth ... SKBN1FE34W
"interfering in American election" is a funny way of saying they hacked into Hillary's illegal server and exposed all the shady shit she had been up to. If we want to know what "interfering in an election" really looks like we have numerous examples where the US has done it that we can learn from.
The U.S. has a long history of attempting to influence presidential elections in other countries – it's done so as many as 81 times between 1946 and 2000, according to a database amassed by political scientist Dov Levin of Carnegie Mellon University.

That number doesn't include military coups and regime change efforts following the election of candidates the U.S. didn't like, notably those in Iran, Guatemala and Chile. Nor does it include general assistance with the electoral process, such as election monitoring.

Levin defines intervention as "a costly act which is designed to determine the election results [in favor of] one of the two sides." These acts, carried out in secret two-thirds of the time, include funding the election campaigns of specific parties, disseminating misinformation or propaganda, training locals of only one side in various campaigning or get-out-the-vote techniques, helping one side design their campaign materials, making public pronouncements or threats in favor of or against a candidate, and providing or withdrawing foreign aid.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-us- ... story.html
Here is one of my favorite examples...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CJbDz0ffjY

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1735

Post by VickyCaramel »

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1736

Post by Suet Cardigan »


Clarence
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1737

Post by Clarence »

VickyCaramel wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote: Sources claim Dutch intelligence discovered hackers that were interfering in American election, even tracking them to Russia and catching them on camera.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-neth ... SKBN1FE34W
"interfering in American election" is a funny way of saying they hacked into Hillary's illegal server and exposed all the shady shit she had been up to. If we want to know what "interfering in an election" really looks like we have numerous examples where the US has done it that we can learn from.
The U.S. has a long history of attempting to influence presidential elections in other countries – it's done so as many as 81 times between 1946 and 2000, according to a database amassed by political scientist Dov Levin of Carnegie Mellon University.

That number doesn't include military coups and regime change efforts following the election of candidates the U.S. didn't like, notably those in Iran, Guatemala and Chile. Nor does it include general assistance with the electoral process, such as election monitoring.

Levin defines intervention as "a costly act which is designed to determine the election results [in favor of] one of the two sides." These acts, carried out in secret two-thirds of the time, include funding the election campaigns of specific parties, disseminating misinformation or propaganda, training locals of only one side in various campaigning or get-out-the-vote techniques, helping one side design their campaign materials, making public pronouncements or threats in favor of or against a candidate, and providing or withdrawing foreign aid.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-us- ... story.html
Here is one of my favorite examples...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CJbDz0ffjY
Thank you, Vicky. Couldn't agree more. I'll put my response article in the Trump Dump where it belongs. :)

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1738

Post by Clarence »

Kirbmarc wrote: "We're firing more white males and paying the ones we have on payroll less to fight sexism!" "We're reducing worker benefits to white men to fight for the Patriarchy!"
And yet you seem to believe that under Hillary this stuff wouldn't have been done or been so blatant. Trump has somehow made it worse. Me? I shudder to think how much worse it would have been, esp given that its now known that most 'mainstream' press organs either run interference for this shit (Like I said, It's always the Fight For the 19th Amendment when it comes to Women's Issues and the Baltimore Sun), or ignore things like 99.9 percent of the insane going ons on compuses. They also tend to quote each other in a game of telephone , always give lefty sources more weight than righty sources, and almost always take Activist stats as gospel.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1739

Post by Kirbmarc »

Suet Cardigan wrote:
Associating viewpoint diversity and open exchange of ideas with the alt-right is the stupidest thing I've ever read.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one of them

#1740

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Linsday got it wrong -- the joke is that Alt-Righters make those claims about the left.

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