There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

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MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2161

Post by MarcusAu »

John D wrote: PZ is actually right about the specifics of the lobster story. Chordata split from Anamalia further back in time than Peterson claims. My little study suggests this was 540 million years ago rather then 350 as Peterson claims. Also, we are not a direct descendant of lobsters. Our lineage broke off prior to true lobsters. This kind of detailed mistake does tend to take the wind out of Peterson's story. But, I forgive him here. I just finished the first chapter of "12 Rules for Life" and his main story is correct.

Peterson's main points are that lobsters and people form hierarchies, these hierarchies are very old, and the hierarchies even share some of the same brain chemistry. This is all generally true.

So, while PZ successfully picks at some details, he really does not disprove the claim. The claim is that you should face the world with your head up and your shoulders back.... like a successful lobster. This is probably something PZ cannot do.
The analogy I've seen previously is that much can be accomplished with a tuned violin, even though (or perhaps because) it is constrained by physical limitations (by definition).

From what I've seen the Alt-Right are prepared to argue for an evolutionary basis for tribalism (or, if you want to be less charitable, racial-separatism, if not outright racism - they probably are no longer bothered about what you want to call it). I'm sure the polyhed(r)onists can also quote a biological imperative for their lifestyle too.

I can see the point to presenting ideas in new way (cf the lobster) to force people to re-examine their beliefs. Any words with a structure contain a narrative (or will do once people start to process them) - but biology and science in general require a bit of fact checking too. I would find it interesting for Peterson to try and argue the case for his world view when faced with that of the race-realists or polymers or even an outright Randian Objectivist - all of whom can rationalise their beliefs from an evolutionary standpoint with the best of them.

CommanderTuvok
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2162

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Not listened to it yet, but Godless Spellchecker has done a podcast with "former SJW" Jamie Kilstein - the guy who PZ Myers and Beckybooze were fawning over before he was "exposed".

I still don't have any sympathy for the fucker.

SM1957
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2163

Post by SM1957 »

F1 have listened to the feminists and so they are making sure there are fewer women in F1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42890261

John D
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2164

Post by John D »

MarcusAu wrote:
John D wrote: PZ is actually right about the specifics of the lobster story. Chordata split from Anamalia further back in time than Peterson claims. My little study suggests this was 540 million years ago rather then 350 as Peterson claims. Also, we are not a direct descendant of lobsters. Our lineage broke off prior to true lobsters. This kind of detailed mistake does tend to take the wind out of Peterson's story. But, I forgive him here. I just finished the first chapter of "12 Rules for Life" and his main story is correct.

Peterson's main points are that lobsters and people form hierarchies, these hierarchies are very old, and the hierarchies even share some of the same brain chemistry. This is all generally true.

So, while PZ successfully picks at some details, he really does not disprove the claim. The claim is that you should face the world with your head up and your shoulders back.... like a successful lobster. This is probably something PZ cannot do.
The analogy I've seen previously is that much can be accomplished with a tuned violin, even though (or perhaps because) it is constrained by physical limitations (by definition).

From what I've seen the Alt-Right are prepared to argue for an evolutionary basis for tribalism (or, if you want to be less charitable, racial-separatism, if not outright racism - they probably are no longer bothered about what you want to call it). I'm sure the polyhed(r)onists can also quote a biological imperative for their lifestyle too.

I can see the point to presenting ideas in new way (cf the lobster) to force people to re-examine their beliefs. Any words with a structure contain a narrative (or will do once people start to process them) - but biology and science in general require a bit of fact checking too. I would find it interesting for Peterson to try and argue the case for his world view when faced with that of the race-realists or polymers or even an outright Randian Objectivist - all of whom can rationalise their beliefs from an evolutionary standpoint with the best of them.
If you are really curious there are plenty of videos where Peterson attacks the ideas of indentitarians (race realists) and objectivists. I would love to see a debate as well.

MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2165

Post by MarcusAu »

CommanderTuvok wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:54 am
Not listened to it yet, but Godless Spellchecker has done a podcast with "former SJW" Jamie Kilstein - the guy who PZ Myers and Beckybooze were fawning over before he was "exposed".

I still don't have any sympathy for the fucker.
Jamie may have truly seen the error of his ways - but he still has the smell of the weasel about him - so he'd have to present a really good case as to why I should pay attention to him at all.

That said, if he has anything to say about his interactions with Twatson - I'd soon change my tune...

DrokkIt
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2166

Post by DrokkIt »

VickyCaramel wrote:
Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:59 am
I just thought I would share, there is some fascinating stuff on this channel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9eXi3RL8q4
I really like this channel, and the two guy's personal channels. As you say, fascinating.

MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2167

Post by MarcusAu »

John D wrote: If you are really curious there are plenty of videos where Peterson attacks the ideas of indentitarians (race realists) and objectivists. I would love to see a debate as well.
It's not so much that I'm curious (though others may well charactarise me that way) - but that Peterson is a very intelligent (or at least verbose) guy, with a lot to say on a wide range of issues (so much so that he can come across as Gish-galloper, in his way).

So I'm not going to take what he says wholesale until his ideas have had a damn good Haidt-style fisking.

VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2168

Post by VickyCaramel »

SM1957 wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:55 am
F1 have listened to the feminists and so they are making sure there are fewer women in F1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42890261
I happen to be with a couple of lesbians right now, both of them are sports fans. I am asking them how they feel about the objectification of women in sport to be eye candy for men:-

Apparently pit-stop dollies are okay but not as hot as women footballers.


I'll paraphrase....
Deprived of the opportunity of standing around looking pretty and with a chance to marry a racing driver, these shallow beauties might only be good for cleaning floors. They are dead in the eyes. The lights are on but nobody's home. But they don't seem to be suffering, they aren't slaves that need to be liberated, so why not let them be?


Muh-soggyknees!

Sulman
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2169

Post by Sulman »

DrokkIt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:59 am
I just thought I would share, there is some fascinating stuff on this channel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9eXi3RL8q4
I really like this channel, and the two guy's personal channels. As you say, fascinating.
Oh man, this is absolutely fantastic. Riders, too.

Sulman
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2170

Post by Sulman »

VickyCaramel wrote:
SM1957 wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:55 am
F1 have listened to the feminists and so they are making sure there are fewer women in F1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42890261
I happen to be with a couple of lesbians right now, both of them are sports fans. I am asking them how they feel about the objectification of women in sport to be eye candy for men:-

Apparently pit-stop dollies are okay but not as hot as women footballers.


I'll paraphrase....
Deprived of the opportunity of standing around looking pretty and with a chance to marry a racing driver, these shallow beauties might only be good for cleaning floors. They are dead in the eyes. The lights are on but nobody's home. But they don't seem to be suffering, they aren't slaves that need to be liberated, so why not let them be?


Muh-soggyknees!
Someone at an F1 forum got very upset with me because I described this as American neo-puritanism. It's exactly what it is.

There is nothing progressive about telling a load of women they're fired because you don't approve of their job anymore.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2171

Post by Tigzy »

SM1957 wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:55 am
F1 have listened to the feminists and so they are making sure there are fewer women in F1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42890261
Allah be praised!

VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2172

Post by VickyCaramel »

Sulman wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
SM1957 wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:55 am
F1 have listened to the feminists and so they are making sure there are fewer women in F1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42890261
I happen to be with a couple of lesbians right now, both of them are sports fans. I am asking them how they feel about the objectification of women in sport to be eye candy for men:-

Apparently pit-stop dollies are okay but not as hot as women footballers.


I'll paraphrase....
Deprived of the opportunity of standing around looking pretty and with a chance to marry a racing driver, these shallow beauties might only be good for cleaning floors. They are dead in the eyes. The lights are on but nobody's home. But they don't seem to be suffering, they aren't slaves that need to be liberated, so why not let them be?


Muh-soggyknees!
Someone at an F1 forum got very upset with me because I described this as American neo-puritanism. It's exactly what it is.

There is nothing progressive about telling a load of women they're fired because you don't approve of their job anymore.
I am not completely sure about this, but I believe that this is actually more of an American tradition which comes from amature racing and drag racing. The dollys were often the wives and girlfriends of the drivers and created the tradition themselves. The celebrity of some of them like Jungle Pam has spread further and outlasted that of the drivers. ...I was aware of her at least.

http://www.motorsportretro.com/wp-conte ... d-Girl.jpg

http://www.protouring.se/files/junglepamopenbra.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWuhLqZQc9k

Sulman
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2173

Post by Sulman »

VickyCaramel wrote: [
I am not completely sure about this, but I believe that this is actually more of an American tradition which comes from amature racing and drag racing. The dollys were often the wives and girlfriends of the drivers and created the tradition themselves. The celebrity of some of them like Jungle Pam has spread further and outlasted that of the drivers. ...I was aware of her at least.

http://www.motorsportretro.com/wp-conte ... d-Girl.jpg

http://www.protouring.se/files/junglepamopenbra.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWuhLqZQc9k
Sure, the reason I mentioned the American thing is the current owner of the F1 show is a US company, and I strongly suspect this is more about 'climate' and optics than anything else.

Grid girls go back years. Even before that driver's wives (most of which were on the glamour end of the spectrum) used to be around the circuit and would perform duties like timekeeping and lap charts. The fact they looked hot was a favourable bonus.

DrokkIt
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2174

Post by DrokkIt »

Sulman wrote:
DrokkIt wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:59 am
I just thought I would share, there is some fascinating stuff on this channel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9eXi3RL8q4
I really like this channel, and the two guy's personal channels. As you say, fascinating.
Oh man, this is absolutely fantastic. Riders, too.
They did an upscale-production called "Conquering Southern China" which (if you can forgive the slightly travel-channel style editing) is a pretty great travelogue of two westerners biking around seeing all manner of crazy stuff.

ThreeFlangedJavis
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2175

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis »

DrokkIt wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:16 am
VickyCaramel wrote:
Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:59 am
I just thought I would share, there is some fascinating stuff on this channel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9eXi3RL8q4
I really like this channel, and the two guy's personal channels. As you say, fascinating.
Google "chabuduo'.

free thoughtpolice
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2176

Post by free thoughtpolice »

Drokkit writes:
I really like this channel, and the two guy's personal channels. As you say, fascinating.
C-Milk's wife is fat and his baby is ugly. :P

TheMudbrooker
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2177

Post by TheMudbrooker »

Just leaving this here.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdmLQ5q_Gug

Really?
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2178

Post by Really? »

CommanderTuvok wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:54 am
Not listened to it yet, but Godless Spellchecker has done a podcast with "former SJW" Jamie Kilstein - the guy who PZ Myers and Beckybooze were fawning over before he was "exposed".

I still don't have any sympathy for the fucker.
Here's a link for the interested. He sucks and is annoying.

https://www.gspellchecker.com/2018/01/e ... -kilstein/

AndrewV69
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2179

Post by AndrewV69 »

In other news from down under:


free thoughtpolice
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2180

Post by free thoughtpolice »

No eating in public during daylight hours of ramadam next? There won't be any backlash to this for sure.

Kirbmarc
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2181

Post by Kirbmarc »

AndrewV69 wrote: In other news from down under:

It's a fake, Saad himself pointed it out later:

Steersman
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2182

Post by Steersman »

MarcusAu wrote: <snip>
From what I've seen the Alt-Right are prepared to argue for an evolutionary basis for tribalism (or, if you want to be less charitable, racial-separatism, if not outright racism - they probably are no longer bothered about what you want to call it). I'm sure the polyhed(r)onists can also quote a biological imperative for their lifestyle too. ....
:-) A new angle on an old but solid if rather un-Platonic issue? So to speak ...

katamari Damassi
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2183

Post by katamari Damassi »

AndrewV69 wrote: In other news from down under:

Snopes says it's fake.

https://www.snopes.com/multicultural-be ... melbourne/

Steersman
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2184

Post by Steersman »

VickyCaramel wrote:
Although it doesn't change the fact that Northern European countries have it all and Americans are going without.... I wouldn't trust those figures in the least.
Indeed. As others have noted, the figures & arguments look a bit suspect.
VickyCaramel wrote: We did a back-of-an-envelope comparison a few years ago. When you winkle out all the repeat taxes, stealth taxes, my Swedish friend worked out they were paying about 50% while in the UK we pay a bit more, the Germans seem to have it a bit better. The bills for things like Paid Parental leave are forced upon the employer which can be an intolerable burden on small and medium sized businesses. I think it's worth it, and there is no doubt that Americans pay more for less in terms of healthcare, but it isn't quite as rosy as those figures suggest.
Defending the free world - such as it is - doesn't come cheap. $600 billion for military expenditures for the US which is about a third of the world total. That would put a lot chickens in pots, cars in garages, doctors on call if such resources weren't more or less wasted.

Steersman
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2185

Post by Steersman »

Hunt wrote:
Steersman wrote: But the problems with that "anthropomorphizing" & not "individualizing" is kind of my point, or frequently is in any case. Groups generally don't have any agency or autonomy, only individuals do - more or less; see Adam Smith's "Invisible Hand". And losing sight of that fact is frequently the cause of no end of unnecessary grief and animosity - you might just as well have complained about "The Patriarchy!!11!!" - both kind of cases of reification, of turning, with little justification, an abstraction into a supposed reality.
Fair enough point.
Yesss!! ;-)

But reification is apparently a fairly common if rather convoluted logical fallacy and issue. Not least because while there are notable differences between real things and abstractions, I think it a bit moot whether the difference is entirely of kind or simply of degree. Presumably even abstractions have objective correlates in the brain which make them more or less tangible.
Hunt wrote:
Steersman wrote: Printing money so that supposedly the poor would have access to more goods and services - treating the symptom - does not address the problem that there really isn't enough of those to go around in the first place. Which seems the stickier wicket by far.
Except if the system isn't hegemonically rigged to serve the rich, there IS enough to go around, more than enough. The Scandinavian social democracy model proves it. America is the RICHEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD, or so they tell me.
"Hegemonically rigged"? By the running dogs of capitalism and their lackeys? Spoken like a true member of The Party? ;-)

Daniel Dennett in his book on consciousness - Sweet Dreams: Philosophical Obstacles to a Science of Consciousness; highly recommended - had a couple of observations on money during the course of it:
Dennett wrote: To see this point [about qualia] more clearly, compare the qualia of experience to the value of money. Some naïve Americans cannot get it out of their heads that dollars, unlike francs and marks and yen, have “intrinsic value” (“How much is that in “real” money?”). They are quite content to “reduce” the value of other currencies in dispositional terms to their exchange rate with dollars (or goods and services), but they have a hunch that dollars are different. ....

Some participants in the consciousness debates simply demand, flat out, that their intuitions about phenomenal properties are a non-negotiable starting point for any science of consciousness. Such a conviction must be considered an interesting symptom, deserving a diagnosis, a datum that any science of consciousness must account for, in the same spirit that economists and psychologists might set out to explain why it is that so many people succumb to the potent illusion that money has intrinsic value. ...
Money really seems to be another abstraction, a fiduciary and implicit contract to exchange markers of them for some set of goods and services. Why I've argued that simply printing more of those markers doesn't really put any more chickens in pots, cars in garages, or doctors on call. If everybody is given another $1000 then, all other things being equal - i.e., no changes in society's productive capacities - that only means that the cost of existing goods & services will rise correspondingly.

No doubt America is a rather rich country, and in more than a few ways - and not all them tangible, but as my previous comment on military expenditures suggests, it seems rather clear that it is "wasting" many of its talents and resources on goods and services that might be better utilized elsewhere. Every society has a limited supply of those talents and resources, and if they're spent or mispent on some things then it will frequently be the case that there isn't "enough left to go around" to provide everyone with other goods and services that might well be deemed necessities, particularly by those "deprived" of them.

VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2186

Post by VickyCaramel »

Steersman wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
Although it doesn't change the fact that Northern European countries have it all and Americans are going without.... I wouldn't trust those figures in the least.
Indeed. As others have noted, the figures & arguments look a bit suspect.
VickyCaramel wrote: We did a back-of-an-envelope comparison a few years ago. When you winkle out all the repeat taxes, stealth taxes, my Swedish friend worked out they were paying about 50% while in the UK we pay a bit more, the Germans seem to have it a bit better. The bills for things like Paid Parental leave are forced upon the employer which can be an intolerable burden on small and medium sized businesses. I think it's worth it, and there is no doubt that Americans pay more for less in terms of healthcare, but it isn't quite as rosy as those figures suggest.
Defending the free world - such as it is - doesn't come cheap. $600 billion for military expenditures for the US which is about a third of the world total. That would put a lot chickens in pots, cars in garages, doctors on call if such resources weren't more or less wasted.
I am in two minds about this. It is essentially a welfare system which keeps hundreds of thousands of people employed directly or indirectly... but a lot of the money goes to shareholders, and for 70 years the US has been building strategy around weapons rather than building weapons around strategy.

CommanderTuvok
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2187

Post by CommanderTuvok »

TheMudbrooker wrote: Just leaving this here.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdmLQ5q_Gug
Phwoar. I've bookmarked this video! :)

ConcentratedH2O, OM
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2188

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM »

CommanderTuvok wrote:
TheMudbrooker wrote: Just leaving this here.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdmLQ5q_Gug
Phwoar. I've bookmarked this video! :)
Posh bints with too much time on their hands.

Barbie's Boyfriend
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2189

Post by Barbie's Boyfriend »

TheMudbrooker wrote: Just leaving this here.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdmLQ5q_Gug
That chic on the left looks like the kid The Amazing Atheist shit out after that banana got him pregnant

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2190

Post by Steersman »

TheMudbrooker wrote: Just leaving this here.[BBvideo=560,315]https: //www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdmLQ5q_Gug[/BBvideo]
Needs more mud, fewer clothes ...

Matt Cavanaugh
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2191

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Barbie's Boyfriend wrote: That chic on the left looks like the kid The Amazing Atheist shit out after that banana got him pregnant
You, sir, are a poet.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2192

Post by Steersman »

VickyCaramel wrote:
Steersman wrote: <snip>
Defending the free world - such as it is - doesn't come cheap. $600 billion for military expenditures for the US which is about a third of the world total. That would put a lot chickens in pots, cars in garages, doctors on call if such resources weren't more or less wasted.
I am in two minds about this. It is essentially a welfare system which keeps hundreds of thousands of people employed directly or indirectly... but a lot of the money goes to shareholders ...
At least "two minds" are possible - full employment, one way or the other, a la 1984, for example. Though, given that the profit margin for most companies isn't stratospheric, I'd expect that the dividends are a small percentage of the total invested.

But my point is that we should be able to find more productive and beneficial uses for all those resources - $600 billion a year would build a lot of hospitals and schools, train a lot of kids and doctors, cure many diseases, find the answer to life, the universe and everything - not to mention finally finding out how Cadbury got the caramel into their candies ... :)
VickyCaramel wrote: ... and for 70 years the US has been building strategy around weapons rather than building weapons around strategy.
Yea - universal tendency to be building weapons for a repeat of the last war which frequently comes a cropper. Some justification for thinking the next one will be fought, in part, on the Internet. And, the one after that will, as Einstein supposedly put it, be fought once again with rocks.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2193

Post by KenD »

SM1957 wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:55 am
F1 have listened to the feminists and so they are making sure there are fewer women in F1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42890261
I suppose after a serious and high profile sport like darts did it, obscure events like that daft racing thing were bound to jump on the bandwagon.




The feminist gloating about this has been pretty obnoxious - getting some models fired from an easy job is spun as striking a blow against the pay gap and abuse of women.

It'll be interesting to see if boxing bows to the pressure and gets rid of ring girls. It's something that the Women's Sports Trust (who receive tax payer funding to push this stuff) have been campaigning for for quite a while.

I've seen some feminists propose that ending cheerleading should be the next step - anyone think that might generate more of a backlash from women themselves?

The people linking this to #metoo/#timesup are just one example of that campaign's current mission creep. They've gone from activism against sexual harassment to wanting to completely end jobs they disapprove of. I've also seen a number of feminist articles in the mainstream press linking harassment/assault to the 'sexualisation of society', and using #metoo momentum to call for a crackdown on sexual imagery.

I'd accuse them of acting like prudish Victorians, but even 19th century paintings can't escape the current year feminist pearl clutching.


It is a painting that shows pubescent, naked nymphs tempting a handsome young man to his doom, but is it an erotic Victorian fantasy too far, and one which, in the current climate, is unsuitable and offensive to modern audiences?

Manchester Art Gallery has asked the question after removing John William Waterhouse’s Hylas and the Nymphs, one of the most recognisable of the pre-Raphaelite paintings, from its walls. Postcards of the painting will be removed from sale in the shop.

AndrewV69
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2194

Post by AndrewV69 »

Kirbmarc wrote:
AndrewV69 wrote: In other news from down under:

It's a fake, Saad himself pointed it out later:
Certainly got me. Good that he posted and update though.

VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2195

Post by VickyCaramel »

KenD wrote:
It is a painting that shows pubescent, naked nymphs tempting a handsome young man to his doom, but is it an erotic Victorian fantasy too far, and one which, in the current climate, is unsuitable and offensive to modern audiences?

Manchester Art Gallery has asked the question after removing John William Waterhouse’s Hylas and the Nymphs, one of the most recognisable of the pre-Raphaelite paintings, from its walls. Postcards of the painting will be removed from sale in the shop.
To be fair, these fucking philistines are just as likely to remove a Waterhouse because it doesn't involve menstrual blood or dead animals and so isn't considered real art. Think I am exaggerating? I have heard pre-raphaelite art described as "chocolate box art".

So it's official, the feminists are more Victorian than the Victorians.

I wish I could say this is the stupidest thing I have heard today, except...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10VArKUpx34

AndrewV69
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2196

Post by AndrewV69 »

katamari Damassi wrote:
AndrewV69 wrote: In other news from down under:

Snopes says it's fake.

https://www.snopes.com/multicultural-be ... melbourne/
Since Snopes went partisan political I never go there any more. Mind, I did not think to check if this was a fake either. It sounded pretty plausible to me.

Skeptism. How does it work?

Really?
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2197

Post by Really? »

MarcusAu wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:05 am
CommanderTuvok wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:54 am
Not listened to it yet, but Godless Spellchecker has done a podcast with "former SJW" Jamie Kilstein - the guy who PZ Myers and Beckybooze were fawning over before he was "exposed".

I still don't have any sympathy for the fucker.
Jamie may have truly seen the error of his ways - but he still has the smell of the weasel about him - so he'd have to present a really good case as to why I should pay attention to him at all.

That said, if he has anything to say about his interactions with Twatson - I'd soon change my tune...
Wow, like. That would, like, be like...great? He could, like...shed, like a lot of like light on the way the movement like works or something?

Really?
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2198

Post by Really? »

AndrewV69 wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 6:32 pm
katamari Damassi wrote:
AndrewV69 wrote: In other news from down under:

Snopes says it's fake.

https://www.snopes.com/multicultural-be ... melbourne/
Since Snopes went partisan political I never go there any more. Mind, I did not think to check if this was a fake either. It sounded pretty plausible to me.

Skeptism. How does it work?
Snopes was about urban legends and research. It is now about polyamory and hating Trump.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2199

Post by TheMudbrooker »

It is a painting that shows pubescent, naked nymphs tempting a handsome young man to his doom, but is it an erotic Victorian fantasy too far, and one which, in the current climate, is unsuitable and offensive to modern audiences?

Manchester Art Gallery has asked the question after removing John William Waterhouse’s Hylas and the Nymphs, one of the most recognisable of the pre-Raphaelite paintings, from its walls. Postcards of the painting will be removed from sale in the shop.
Hmmmmm.....sounds vaguely familiar. https://i2.wp.com/www.paraphiliamagazin ... ete015.jpg

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2200

Post by deLurch »

KenD wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2018 6:01 pm
It is a painting that shows pubescent, naked nymphs tempting a handsome young man to his doom, but is it an erotic Victorian fantasy too far, and one which, in the current climate, is unsuitable and offensive to modern audiences?

Manchester Art Gallery has asked the question after removing John William Waterhouse’s Hylas and the Nymphs, one of the most recognisable of the pre-Raphaelite paintings, from its walls. Postcards of the painting will be removed from sale in the shop.
They are mythical creatures that don't even have nipples. How do they know they are pubescent? Looks like C cups to me.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2201

Post by MarcusAu »

VickyCaramel wrote:
KenD wrote:
It is a painting that shows pubescent, naked nymphs tempting a handsome young man to his doom, but is it an erotic Victorian fantasy too far, and one which, in the current climate, is unsuitable and offensive to modern audiences?

Manchester Art Gallery has asked the question after removing John William Waterhouse’s Hylas and the Nymphs, one of the most recognisable of the pre-Raphaelite paintings, from its walls. Postcards of the painting will be removed from sale in the shop.
To be fair, these fucking philistines are just as likely to remove a Waterhouse because it doesn't involve menstrual blood or dead animals and so isn't considered real art. Think I am exaggerating? I have heard pre-raphaelite art described as "chocolate box art".

So it's official, the feminists are more Victorian than the Victorians.

...
It certainly raises the question: When did you last see your father?

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/200 ... ather4.jpg

Sorry to say - but this sort of thing pretty much does all look like 'chocolate box art' to me...I'd prefer Constable, Monet or something by one of the Expressionists (Abstract or otherwise).

Maybe the UK government could ban any work of art deemed likely to offend. Then we could get back to acts of petty vandalism in order to prick the sensibilities of the puritanical...

https://flashbak.com/wp-content/uploads ... book-c.jpg

nb I would have expected you to have a more nuanced view of the Victorians too.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2202

Post by free thoughtpolice »

[/quoSnopes was about urban legends and research. It is now about polyamory and hating Trump.te]
You are right . I believe the story now.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2203

Post by Guest_d2e60302 »


VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2204

Post by VickyCaramel »

MarcusAu wrote: nb I would have expected you to have a more nuanced view of the Victorians too.
I have a more nuanced view of the Victorians, but if I had showed off my knowledge of the contradictions of in social attitudes the mid Victorian Era and put in a caveat about the Naughty Nineties... the pun about the Victorians being prudish might not have worked. But luckily I wasn't trying to be a poseur.
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2205

Post by MarcusAu »

Oh you don't need to try...it comes naturally to you.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2206

Post by VickyCaramel »

MarcusAu wrote: poseur
You know that makes absolutely no fucking sense don't you?
poseur
pəʊˈzəː/Submit
noun
noun: poseur; plural noun: poseurs
a person who behaves affectedly in order to impress others
affected
[uh-fek-tid]
Spell Syllables
Word Origin
adjective
1.
assumed artificially; unnatural; feigned:
affected sophistication; an affected British accent.
2.
assuming or pretending to possess that which is not natural:

MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2207

Post by MarcusAu »

VickyCaramel wrote:
You know that makes absolutely no fucking sense don't you?
It's probably best not to make any assumptions about the level of my ignorance.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2208

Post by KenD »

I think I vaguely remember seeing this product's nipply packaging back in the 70s - even back then it stood out a little.

https://byronsmuse.files.wordpress.com/ ... th-dew.jpg

At the time that advert was printed in various mainstream magazines aimed at women.

Changing mores since Victorian times aside, I find it interesting that in 40 years we've gone from using a photographic knock off of Hylas and the Nymphs to sell bubble bath to the ladies, to the 'chocolate box' 1896 original being considered problematically sexual and offensive to women.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2209

Post by Shatterface »

We need to chip all the tits off statues while we are at it, and secure them in the Vatican vault where they hide all the dicks.

VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2210

Post by VickyCaramel »

MarcusAu wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
You know that makes absolutely no fucking sense don't you?
It's probably best not to make any assumptions about the level of my ignorance.
Indeed, you keep surpassing expectations.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2211

Post by shoutinghorse »

SM1957 wrote: F1 have listened to the feminists and so they are making sure there are fewer women in F1

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42890261
Watching BBC Breakfast this morning and they had a Grid Girl on to 'explain herself' The very first thing the female presenter (Naga Munchetty) said to her was "Most people would acknowledge that this kind of practice demeans women in a sexual manner blah blah blah surely this is a good thing" .. No thought whatsoever for the many girls who will now lose their jobs.

And we keep getting told the BBC are impartial. :lol:

MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2212

Post by MarcusAu »

VickyCaramel wrote:
MarcusAu wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
You know that makes absolutely no fucking sense don't you?
It's probably best not to make any assumptions about the level of my ignorance.
Indeed, you keep surpassing expectations.
That was sort of my point. Sorry if anything I said rubbed you the wrong way...

VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2213

Post by VickyCaramel »

MarcusAu wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
MarcusAu wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
You know that makes absolutely no fucking sense don't you?
It's probably best not to make any assumptions about the level of my ignorance.
Indeed, you keep surpassing expectations.
That was sort of my point. Sorry if anything I said rubbed you the wrong way...
If you want to keep taking digs and me, I'm happy to do the dance. Come at me bro.

Kirbmarc
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2214

Post by Kirbmarc »

Marcus and Vicki: get a room, you horny bastards.

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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2215

Post by MarcusAu »

VickyCaramel wrote: If you want to keep taking digs AT me, I'm happy to do the dance. Come at me bro.
Oh no - I have enough trouble maintaining my own coherency...I'll not be going through and nit-picking everything you say too.

Barbie's Boyfriend
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2216

Post by Barbie's Boyfriend »

MarcusAu wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
MarcusAu wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
You know that makes absolutely no fucking sense don't you?
It's probably best not to make any assumptions about the level of my ignorance.
Indeed, you keep surpassing expectations.
That was sort of my point. Sorry if anything I said rubbed you the wrong way...
I see Sticky Butterscotch hasn't changed her atiitude since I put her on ignore

CaptainFluffyBunny
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2217

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny »

MarcusAu wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote: If you want to keep taking digs AT me, I'm happy to do the dance. Come at me bro.
Oh no - I have enough trouble maintaining my own coherency...I'll not be going through and nit-picking everything you say too.
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VickyCaramel
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2218

Post by VickyCaramel »

Feminists aren't completely wrong about everything, male egos can be so fragile.

CaptainFluffyBunny
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2219

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny »

VickyCaramel wrote: Feminists aren't completely wrong about everything, male egos can be so fragile.
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MarcusAu
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Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#2220

Post by MarcusAu »

VickyCaramel wrote: Feminists aren't completely wrong about everything, male egos can be so fragile.
Did I every tell you that I rather like you Vicky?

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