Fuck off, Jamie!

Old subthreads
CaptainFluffyBunny
.
.
Posts: 7556
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:39 am
Location: Somewhere in the pipes
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3661

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:55 pm

Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Kirb.

I see through your crafty division of a super-wall of text into three mega-walls.
And of course "ethnic collectives" need an enemy, someone which controls something you want or threatens your "collective".
Who was the recent enemy of the Icelandic ethnostate? Though I note it is currently under pressure from Polish and Lithuanian migrants. So maybe it’s a moot point.
Have you ever been to Iceland? There are other people than white there now, and Iceland can be quite welcoming. The deterrence would be the climate, small urban centers and months of darkness. Not something that appeals to everyone, especially if one is used to a hot climate.
Sweden, Germany, Denmark. Jesus, poor sad UK. The climate seems not to be factor for economic migrants.

Re Iceland. They can’t do much about other EEA countries. But “others” only need to live there for seven years.

Oh wait .....
As for everyone else, the bad news for you non-EEA folks is that there are only three ways for you to secure a residence permit in Iceland.

Be married to an Icelander. This is pretty straightforward.

Attend a university. If you are accepted into a university in Iceland, you will likely be granted a residence permit and possibly a limited work permit. However, you will have to prove that you have enough money to support yourself while in Iceland.

Secure a work permit for a job. This sounds good, but it’s not so easy. It has to be for a specialized, desirable work skill like computer programming. A prospective employer has to show that you are needed for the job, one that they can’t find an Icelander or EEA citizen to fill. So if you’re looking for a job as a restaurant worker, journalist, wedding planner, teacher, or just about anything else, you’re basically out of luck. There’s a very short list of potential jobs for you. Also, you will have to have a signed work contract before you move to secure the permit. You cannot move to Iceland and look for work like EEA citizens can.

I’m sorry to be a buzz kill, but it’s very, very difficult to obtain this kind of permit. For more information, check out the Directorate of Immigration website at utl.is.
https://iheartreykjavik.net/2015/02/all ... reloaded=1

And like Switzerland, no anchor babies:
Icelandic nationality law is based upon the principles of jus sanguinis. In other words, descent from an Icelandic parent is the primary method of acquiring Icelandic citizenship. Birth in Iceland to foreign parents does not in itself grant Icelandic citizenship.
Also there is a test to be passed. I found the website that explains the hows and whens. It’s in Icelandic. :rimshot:
https://www.advania.is/vorur-og-thjonus ... thjonusta/
Also, why the rim-shot? My Icelandic is pretty shit, but Google agrees that link is information about web-hosting. Jesus, man.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3662

Post by Brive1987 » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:01 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
But, notice that while it's strict, it's not race-based. It is the fucking same no matter what your origins or race. So your point? My grandfather came from Iceland, didn't learn English until he was eight, and I have no better chance to become a citizen than a Somali immigrant. Your point sorta sucks.

Also, address the "democracy only coming from the west" while explaining Japan and Korea. I'll wait.
It’s Switzerland again. They draw from Europe and make alternatives fringe enough not to matter. My point wasn’t about race, it was about maintaining Icelandic identity, partly by not having unbalanced cultural overlays.

Stop looking for the Klansman under the bed. He’s not there. :whistle:

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3663

Post by Brive1987 » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:09 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Also, why the rim-shot? My Icelandic is pretty shit, but Google agrees that link is information about web-hosting. Jesus, man.
What you seriously thought I picked a random Icelandic website? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Must be a dead link. Which is sad. I thought it wonderful that the rules for the test was in Viking.

http://i.imgur.com/67YTBYT.jpg

MarcusAu
.
.
Posts: 7143
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:49 am
Location: Llareggub
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3664

Post by MarcusAu » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:12 pm

Wasn't the 1832 reform act to resolve the non-representative 'Rotten Boroughs'?

And to ask enfranchise Roman Catholics (for which read Irish, or people of Irish decent, for the most part) - meaning that they could not only vote but become members of parliament.

Similarly the 1868 (?) act allowed Jews to take part more fully in the political system.

Observing today - people can judge for themselves the effect these pernicious foreign influences had on the culture of formerly pure Anglo-Saxon English society.

SM1957
.
.
Posts: 845
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:01 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3665

Post by SM1957 » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:19 pm

Ireland was not a foreign country in 1832. It was part of the United Kingdom.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3666

Post by Brive1987 » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:53 pm

MarcusAu wrote: Wasn't the 1832 reform act to resolve the non-representative 'Rotten Boroughs'?

And to ask enfranchise Roman Catholics (for which read Irish, or people of Irish decent, for the most part) - meaning that they could not only vote but become members of parliament.

Similarly the 1868 (?) act allowed Jews to take part more fully in the political system.

Observing today - people can judge for themselves the effect these pernicious foreign influences had on the culture of formerly pure Anglo-Saxon English society.
I have geo-locked the goal posts for future reference.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3667

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:22 am

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:50 pm
I'd rather you list the failed western democracies, of which there are a few and likely to be joined by many more. I'd like you to do something other than handwave away non-western democracies while ignoring many European democracies are quite young and some are also at risk of failure.

Again, what you think is a "killer" point is a weak attempt to justify something that only someone with motivated reasoning would assume. It in no way justifies your continued arrogance, nor your defence of the indefensible. If we ignore the individual in favor of crimes of the group, all males are culpable for rape, all whites are slave-owners, etc. Have strict immigration policies. Don't base them on race or ethnicity. Why is this difficult for you?
[/quote]

You keep accusing me of arrogance when I’m arguing in good faith. This is a problem.

I don’t know if my point is killer or not. It did strongly contradict your own position that liberal democracy (presumably as we know it) has existed for centuries. What we have today is a unique formulation that is barely 100 years old and is now struggling under the tension of constituencies which don’t share the values (or heritage) which underpin it.

And overseas experience suggests that lib-dem finds it hard to exist outside its cultural womb. I’m sorry if you find this challenging or offensive - but I’d appreciate reading responses which aren’t abusive and ironically accusatory.

Then you expand the specific conversation into another racist-dog style strawman. Individuals are fine (until they kick your dog, or decide they’d like to call for “men only” sessions at the pool). Mass importation of alternative cultural collectives into ethnic hubs is not ok.

“We hold these truths to be self-evident”

;)

Kirbmarc
.
.
Posts: 10577
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:29 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3668

Post by Kirbmarc » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:32 am

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 3:22 pm
Brive1987 wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 1:19 pm
Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Western Democracy in its modern form is under probation. But these are good vanilla cookie cutter motherhood statements.

They don’t protect western cultural or ethnic diversity.
Cultures are flimsy aggregates of concepts. They evolve through time. They're in flux. They absorb elements from other cultures all the time. Protecting culture is a vague slogan that doesn't mean much.

Values and principles, on the other hand, are precise, and their effects are easily verifiable. Liberal democracies work much better at providing people with high human development, technological development, individual freedoms and social mobility than any other system that has ever been tried.
If you say so. I’ve always thought national identity and culture was relatively robust, with organic change occurring due to a thin venn diagram of direct interplay. What we have now is direct overlay.

Liberal democracy is an output of western culture. It assumes it’s operating within a framework of trust and inter-dependency. I have grave doubts over the models viability when distanced from these roots.
Yeah, look at Japan and Korea. And Europe has always had a rich tradition of liberal democracy, it isn't something that just came up in the last century or so. What an excellent point, Brive.
According to the 2017 Democracy Index, the following "non-western" countries are rated as Full Democracies:

-Mauritius

The following "non-western" countries are rated as Flawed Democracies (Italy, the US, France, Belgium are also Flawed Democracies):

-South Korea -Japan -Cape Verde -Bostwana -Taiwan -Jamaica -South Africa -India -Timor-Leste --Ghana -Lesotho -Malaysia -Mongolia -Sri Lanka -Indonesia -Tunisia -Singapore -Hong Kong -Namibia -Senegal -Papua New Guinea

The case of Bostwana is very interesting. Bostwana has been a stable representative democracy since its independence. It's one of the least corrupt countries in Africa. It's also a very fast-growing economy: when it became independent in 1966 it was one of the poorest countries in the world, now it has one of the highest GDPs in Africa, and its wealth is still growing. And this is in spite of having HUGE issues with HIV infections.

Compare and contrast with neighboring Zimbabwe. Zimbabwe was much richer than Bostwana in the 1960s. But unlike Bostwana, Zimbabwe was plagued by political instability, ethnic tensions (between the Shona and Matabele ethnic groups) AND the tinpot dictatorship of Mugabe. Today Zimbabwe is an extremely impoverished country, with food insecurity threatening a large size of its population.

What's the origin of the huge differences between Bostwana and Zimbabwe? It's surely not ethnicity. It's kind of hard to put it down to "culture". It looks very likely that the difference is a matter of institutions. For all its flaws and issues Bostwana is a representative, pluralistic, moderate liberal democracy. Zimbabew is a failed experiment at building a Shona ethno-state that then collapsed into a personal dictatorship of an ethno-centric corrupt tyrant who tried to garner power by fanning the flames of anti-white ethno-policies.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3669

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:37 am

And in a surprising turn around ...... Reality cos plays as Lauren Southern.
THE South African government has begun the process of seizing land from white farmers.

Local newspaper City Press reports two game farms in the northern province of Limpopo are the first to be targeted for unilateral seizure after negotiations with the owners to purchase the properties stalled.

While the government says it intends to pay, owners Akkerland Boerdery wanted 200 million rand ($18.7 million) for the land, while the government was offering them just 20 million rand ($1.87 million).

“Notice is hereby given that a terrain inspection will be held on the farms on April 5, 2018 at 10am in order to conduct an audit of the assets and a handover of the farm’s keys to the state,” a letter sent to the owners earlier this year said.
https://www.news.com.au/finance/economy ... 648ea5c53b

MarcusAu
.
.
Posts: 7143
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:49 am
Location: Llareggub
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3670

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:42 am


Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3671

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:51 am

Kirbmarc wrote:
According to the 2017 Democracy Index, the following "non-western" countries are rated as Full Democracies:

-Mauritius

The following "non-western" countries are rated as Flawed Democracies (Italy, the US, France, Belgium are also Flawed Democracies):

-South Korea -Japan -Cape Verde -Bostwana -Taiwan -Jamaica -South Africa -India -Timor-Leste --Ghana -Lesotho -Malaysia -Mongolia -Sri Lanka -Indonesia -Tunisia -Singapore -Hong Kong -Namibia -Senegal -Papua New Guinea

The case of Bostwana is very interesting. Bostwana has been a stable representative democracy since its independence. It's one of the least corrupt countries in Africa. It's also a very fast-growing economy: when it became independent in 1966 it was one of the poorest countries in the world, now it has one of the highest GDPs in Africa, and its wealth is still growing. And this is in spite of having HUGE issues with HIV infections.

Compare and contrast with neighboring Zimbabwe. Zimbabwe was much richer than Bostwana in the 1960s. But unlike Bostwana, Zimbabwe was plagued by political instability, ethnic tensions (between the Shona and Matabele ethnic groups) AND the tinpot dictatorship of Mugabe. Today Zimbabwe is an extremely impoverished country, with food insecurity threatening a large size of its population.

What's the origin of the huge differences between Bostwana and Zimbabwe? It's surely not ethnicity. It's kind of hard to put it down to "culture". It looks very likely that the difference is a matter of institutions. For all its flaws and issues Bostwana is a representative, pluralistic, moderate liberal democracy. Zimbabew is a failed experiment at building a Shona ethno-state that then collapsed into a personal dictatorship of an ethno-centric corrupt tyrant who tried to garner power by fanning the flames of anti-white ethno-policies.
And here I thought the Shona were fucked when they were INVADED :shock: by the Ndebele and then exploited by the bastard whites before being ruled by a commie despot.

Hey Kirb. Do yourself a favour and watch why your ”pipe laying” screed is corrupt,


Kirbmarc
.
.
Posts: 10577
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:29 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3672

Post by Kirbmarc » Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:04 am

Brive1987 wrote: You keep accusing me of arrogance when I’m arguing in good faith. This is a problem.

I don’t know if my point is killer or not. It did strongly contradict your own position that liberal democracy (presumably as we know it) has existed for centuries. What we have today is a unique formulation that is barely 100 years old and is now struggling under the tension of constituencies which don’t share the values (or heritage) which underpin it.
The main issues are issues of values and principles which stem from institutions. People aren't born Christians or Muslims or Conservatives or Liberals. They are TAUGHT to be that way. That teaching comes from both formal and informal socio-political institutions. If you control those institutions you control the people.

We've seen it with the SocJus: the Po-Mo "X studies" courses in universities (important institutions) produced changes in pop culture and the media which coalesced into a specific brand of nutty identity politics which now is aspiring to gather some actual political significance.

In "muslim communities" all the institutions (mosques, cultural centers, muslim tribunals, etc.) are utterly DOMINATED by ultra-conservatives/reactionaries, ESPECIALLY Salafis. The people who control those institutions have all been educated in or by theocratic countries, which provide money, textbooks, universities, websites, advertising, pop culture for a theocratic, conservative "muslim reinassance". They're FAR more powerful than the SocJus.

If your imam tells you that it's OK to hate the west, that "westerners" are impure dogs, their women are whores, that they're going to fall because of their "degeneration" (curiously similar to some alt-right ideas) and that a Muslim Caliphate is incoming, you tend to believe him. If you find online lectures, websites, books, visiting lectures, "community leaders" preaching the same thing, your beliefs are going to get more and more reinforced. The Salafi/ultra-conservative control of islamic institutions in the "west" is close to 100%, and the theocratic Sunnis are expanding their hold everywhere else. This is why Pakistan is going down the drain, and Indonesia, previously more secular, is going backwards.

Imagine if ALL Americans went to SocJus colleges, or conversely if ALL American schools taught creationism and biblical literalism.

What needs to be done is provide alternatives. In order to do so, secularists and leftists, those who CAN provide alternative models and take down conservative/reactionary institutions (as they've already done and do to Christian conservative/reactionaries), should stop siding with the islamic conservatives and reactionaries just to virtue-signal of "not racist" they are.

Someone like Linda Sarsour is not a liberal, she's a conservative muslim, who has NOTHING in common with leftist principles, or liberal democracy. The the "March for Women" gave her power is a travesty, one of the WORST moves of the Democratic party/progressives. Similarly other coddling to groups like Hamas, Hezbollah, the Muslim Brotherhood or other extremely conservative, even reactionary muslim groups from the likes of Corbyn are MAJOR mistakes, inconsistencies that are HARMING integration and only promoting violence and backwardness.
And overseas experience suggests that lib-dem finds it hard to exist outside its cultural womb. I’m sorry if you find this challenging or offensive - but I’d appreciate reading responses which aren’t abusive and ironically accusatory.
"Find it hard to exist" is a good euphemism for "were systematically undermined by one Big Power or another for geopolitical/ideological reasons". The US arranged a coup in Iran against the democratically elected Mossadegh in 1953. That ended "well". The Russians hijacked several independentist/reformist movements, many of which were at least in part liberal democratic (like the anti-Batista forces in Cuba, which included many who later moved to the United States when Cuba became a communist dictatorship), towards the establishment of authoritarian "People's Republics". That was a "success". The US financed the islamic resurgence in Afganistan to draw Russia into a war. We all know how that ended.

Even today 'Murica and the West support the Saudi theocracy and its efforts to export Sunni theocracies everywhere, despite the fact that "we" also bear the brunt of the Salafi indoctrination. Oil and weapon deals are too rewarding for lobbies which are beyond democratic control. Even Trump, he of the authoritarian "muslim ban", the one who bellowed about fighting islamic terrorism, rewarded the biggest source of islamic terrorism, Saudi Arabia, with a sweet weapon deal.

For all the "war for Democracy" bluster the US is very happy supporting the absolute worst theocracies in the middle east, and has done so for decades.

rayshul
.
.
Posts: 4871
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:00 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3673

Post by rayshul » Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:05 am

As a note Asia Argento did the Heart is Decietful Above All things whic is a fucke dup book and should never ever have been made into a movie. Very pedo. + Marilyn Manson. So I don't find it un believable she fucked with a kid.

DrokkIt
.
.
Posts: 1327
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:01 pm
Location: Brit-Cit
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3674

Post by DrokkIt » Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:17 am

ConcentratedH2O, OM wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:07 pm
shoutinghorse wrote: Hey Phil, did you not see the signs?

https://i.imgur.com/w1d8nGC.jpg
Horse, is this another one of those pictures of unknown origin doing the rounds of your retirement home Facebook group?
It's a 4chan hoax, like all those ones designed to make feminists look stupid. Only this time it's a different kind of confirmation bias perspective that it being mocked.

MarcusAu
.
.
Posts: 7143
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:49 am
Location: Llareggub
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3675

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:05 am

Brive1987 wrote: I have geo-locked the goal posts for future reference.
Not sure if this is a game - or that it requires goal posts.

The arc of something bends towards something. Possibly to the breaking point according to who you ask.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3676

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:47 am

Kirb, I’m not sure I’ve heard the “no true third world Scotsman” argument before.

Hunt
.
.
Posts: 3062
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:04 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3677

Post by Hunt » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:00 am

Kirbmarc wrote: If your imam tells you that it's OK to hate the west, that "westerners" are impure dogs, their women are whores, that they're going to fall because of their "degeneration" (curiously similar to some alt-right ideas) and that a Muslim Caliphate is incoming, you tend to believe him.
Strange how in Islam there doesn't seem to the be adolescent period of rebellion against established authority like there is in western societies. It would seem to me this would be the perfect antidote to the inheritance of Islamic radicalism. Islamic youth seem to become radicalized in direction of conformance, not rebellion. For an American, steeped in the tradition of James Dean 50s iconoclasm and 60s youth rebellion, this seems very strange.

Western societies, in some sense, have to "win back" youth into the culture. That phase seems to be missing in Islam. Now, it's true that in every society, demographics tend to become more conservative and conform more the more they age. Rebellious youth marry, have children, have jobs, pay bills. This in a sense crushes the rebellious instinct of youth, BUT the overall impression that establishment is not to be trusted often remains throughout life.

Also true is that in many strict Christian families you see the same type of conformance and missing period of rebellion. Not to the same extend. It may simply be that there is a threshold of crushing repression that obliterates adolescent rebellion.

I think you could say something similar about Israel.

Phil_Giordana_FCD
.
.
Posts: 11855
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:56 pm
Location: Nice, France
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3678

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:17 am

What's the origin of the huge differences between Bostwana and Zimbabwe? It's surely not ethnicity. It's kind of hard to put it down to "culture". It looks very likely that the difference is a matter of institutions. For all its flaws and issues Bostwana is a representative, pluralistic, moderate liberal democracy. Zimbabew is a failed experiment at building a Shona ethno-state that then collapsed into a personal dictatorship of an ethno-centric corrupt tyrant who tried to garner power by fanning the flames of anti-white ethno-policies.
Kirb, did you read what you wrote before posting it? Something seems off.

MarcusAu
.
.
Posts: 7143
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:49 am
Location: Llareggub
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3679

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:19 am

Hunt wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:00 am
Strange how in Islam there doesn't seem to the be adolescent period of rebellion against established authority like there is in western societies. It would seem to me this would be the perfect antidote to the inheritance of Islamic radicalism. Islamic youth seem to become radicalized in direction of conformance, not rebellion. For an American, steeped in the tradition of James Dean 50s iconoclasm and 60s youth rebellion, this seems very strange.

Western societies, in some sense, have to "win back" youth into the culture. That phase seems to be missing in Islam. Now, it's true that in every society, demographics tend to become more conservative and conform more the more they age. Rebellious youth marry, have children, have jobs, pay bills. This in a sense crushes the rebellious instinct of youth, BUT the overall impression that establishment is not to be trusted often remains throughout life.

Also true is that in many strict Christian families you see the same type of conformance and missing period of rebellion. Not to the same extend. It may simply be that there is a threshold of crushing repression that obliterates adolescent rebellion.

I think you could say something similar about Israel.
This plan sounds a bit chaotic...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKlJVB5rhUA

Kirbmarc
.
.
Posts: 10577
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:29 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3680

Post by Kirbmarc » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:30 am

Hunt wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote: If your imam tells you that it's OK to hate the west, that "westerners" are impure dogs, their women are whores, that they're going to fall because of their "degeneration" (curiously similar to some alt-right ideas) and that a Muslim Caliphate is incoming, you tend to believe him.
Strange how in Islam there doesn't seem to the be adolescent period of rebellion against established authority like there is in western societies. It would seem to me this would be the perfect antidote to the inheritance of Islamic radicalism. Islamic youth seem to become radicalized in direction of conformance, not rebellion. For an American, steeped in the tradition of James Dean 50s iconoclasm and 60Thes youth rebellion, this seems very strange.

Western societies, in some sense, have to "win back" youth into the culture. That phase seems to be missing in Islam. Now, it's true that in every society, demographics tend to become more conservative and conform more the more they age. Rebellious youth marry, have children, have jobs, pay bills. This in a sense crushes the rebellious instinct of youth, BUT the overall impression that establishment is not to be trusted often remains throughout life.

Also true is that in many strict Christian families you see the same type of conformance and missing period of rebellion. Not to the same extend. It may simply be that there is a threshold of crushing repression that obliterates adolescent rebellion.

I think you could say something similar about Israel.
It's not strange. The adolescent rage and rebellion is there, but at least in part it's directed against the "white crusaders". If you study the history of Nazism you'll see that the Hitlerjugend were MORE, not less loyal and fanatical to the Nazi regime. It's the same for those who are highly indoctrinated in Salafi/ultra-conservative muslim tropes.

Not all young muslims are ultra-conservative: a lot drink, sleep around and act like the non-muslim teens do. But there's a growing size of people who are indoctrinated by ultra-conservative forces to direct their rebellion towards the "Crusaders". Compare and contrast the SocJus youth, which is directed to hate "white supremacy".

Usually it's the MORE educated young muslim people who are MORE indoctrinated in muslim identity politics. Male muslim university students are incredibly conservative, reactionary even. Rates of support for islamic terrorism, honor killings, and various Salafi tropes are incredibly high among male muslim students who study at universities where Middle East-trained imams are welcomed.

Young muslims ARE angry and rebellious...they just see the "white crusaders" as the Oppressors, the Establishment, rather than their own conservative/reactionary imams. Also there is no Muslim Hollywood to celebrate rebels, like Hollywood celebrated James Dean or later the anti-Vietnam war movement. Muslim media instead celebrate the "triumph of islam", the future caliphate that will Make Islam Great Again. Even the so-called "moderate imams" preach that islam will take over the world, peacefully in their case, but it's still a narrative of strength through unity, not of promoting rebellions.

There's also A LOT of emotional manipulation and bullying in muslim communities. Those who don't behave as "good muslims" are shunned, isolated, harassed, guilt-tripped. Ghettoization makes this especially bad. If you are someone who wishes to do away with some prescriptions of islam you can quickly find yourself AT BEST with no friends, no support, and instead lots of people glaring at you, harassing you, shaming you. Unless you're able to build yourself a life beyond the "muslim community" it's kind of hard to hold out for long.

Long story short media manipulation and institutions matter. The best way to genuinely secularize islam is for secularists to face the conservative institutions head-on, criticizing them, mocking them, opening a public space for doubt, for leaving islam without being harassed, for receiving support in your choices instead of being cast into a ghetto, instead of waiting for them to "reform" or (even more stupidly) to side with them against "white supremacy".

THIS is what secular/atheist associations should have done. Heavily criticize islam and reach out to secular people in the muslim communities. Instead we get either Regressive Leftists which excuse islam because "muslims are oppressed" or alt-righters who just don't want to see those Damn Foreigners in Their Lands.

THIS is also why the ethno-staters are only idiots who are making things worse. If you cast together all people according to their ethnic origin you're only making the conservative "community leaders" stronger. If it's a matter of place of birth, or even worse skin color, then what you get is even MORE terrorism, MORE clashes of values, MORE ethnic tensions. Instead you should be coherently pushing for secularism.

If Lauren Southern or Brittany Pettibone actually wanted to deal with issues brought forth by muslim immigration they should be pushing for secular laws, for assimilation, allying themselves with people like Maajid Nawaz or Maryam Namazie or Ali Rizvi, instead of talking with conservative Christians/fascist like Dugin, or filming non-white people in Paris and calling it the end of France.

If Sargon of Akkad honestly wanted to reform the left to decrease the power of the SocJus, he should have stuck with working with Kyle Kulinski, or with Nawaz, and reach out to Rizvi or Namazie, instead of nodding along Jared Taylor and joining the UKIP.

But of course it's more economically rewarding and easier to appeal to the alt-right with simple slogans, empty platitudes ("Make America Great Again") and by stoking tribal feelings with some talks of "ethnic collectives".

Kirbmarc
.
.
Posts: 10577
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:29 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3681

Post by Kirbmarc » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:32 am

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
What's the origin of the huge differences between Bostwana and Zimbabwe? It's surely not ethnicity. It's kind of hard to put it down to "culture". It looks very likely that the difference is a matter of institutions. For all its flaws and issues Bostwana is a representative, pluralistic, moderate liberal democracy. Zimbabew is a failed experiment at building a Shona ethno-state that then collapsed into a personal dictatorship of an ethno-centric corrupt tyrant who tried to garner power by fanning the flames of anti-white ethno-policies.
Kirb, did you read what you wrote before posting it? Something seems off.
I mean that the difference between Bostwana and Zimbabwe surely is not an ethnic difference between the people of Bostwana and Zimbabwe. It's a difference in policies and institutions. An ethno-state is a policy choice. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

Kirbmarc
.
.
Posts: 10577
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:29 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3682

Post by Kirbmarc » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:36 am

To make an analogy, the difference between Bostwana and Zimbabwe is similar to the difference between France and Germany before World War Two: it wasn't a matter of "French genes" or "German genes", or even of cultural tendencies (anti-semitism was, at the time, very widespread in France, too) but a difference in political regime. Nazi Germany was an attempt to create an ethno-state...we all know how it ended. France instead was a liberal democracy, albeit not a perfect one, where minorities had rights and participated to the public life even if there were prejudices against them (Leon Blum was a prominent French politician of those times, and he had Jewish ancestry, for example).

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3683

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:43 am

Kirbmarc wrote: To make an analogy, the difference between Bostwana and Zimbabwe is similar to the difference between France and Germany before World War Two: it wasn't a matter of "French genes" or "German genes", or even of cultural tendencies (anti-semitism was, at the time, very widespread in France, too) but a difference in political regime. Nazi Germany was an attempt to create an ethno-state...we all know how it ended. France instead was a liberal democracy, albeit not a perfect one, where minorities had rights and participated to the public life even if there were prejudices against them (Leon Blum was a prominent French politician of those times, and he had Jewish ancestry, for example).
And here I thought the Shona were fucked when they were INVADED :shock: by the Ndebele and then exploited by the bastard whites before being ruled by a commie despot.

AndrewV69
.
.
Posts: 7966
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3684

Post by AndrewV69 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:57 am

Meanwhile Diana Davidson weighs in. Note that several videos ago she stopped opening with a rape joke (I am sure some of you will be relieved to here this).



from the description :
Caught up in the kangaroo court of their own design, feminists are now outraged that Avital Ronell has been found “responsible” by a university tribunal. Now Ronell and NYU will have to answer in a court of law – and that is the proper court.
Also the full statement of claim: https://blog.simplejustice.us/wp-conten ... nd-NYU.pdf makes some interesting reading. Here is a "teaser"
10. On or about January 30, 2012, Reitman was offered a position in the Ph.D. program in the Department of German at NYU. In addition to the offer to study at NYU, Reitman was awarded a scholarship, a stipend, and employment as a language instructor.

11. Though he was also offered entrance into Ph.D. programs at Yale, Brown, and Stanford, Reitman accepted the offer from NYU because he wanted to study under Professor Avital Ronell. Indeed, prior to his being offered a position at NYU, Reitman had been in contact with Ronell about having her supervise his doctoral work.

12. Ronell is a world-renowned academic and author. She is a Professor of German
and Comparative Literature at NYU, as well as the Jacques Derrida Chair and Professor of Philosophy at The European Graduate School. She previously held the position of Chair of both the German and Comparative Literature Departments at NYU. She has written numerous books, speaks at universities around the world, and has received many prestigious awards and fellowships. Put simply, Ronell is a “superstar” of the academic world.

13. Reitman’s dreams of working with a world-class scholar, however, turned into more than three years of continuous and unabated sexual harassment, sexual assault, and stalking.

14. Ronell created a fictitious romantic relationship between herself and her student Reitman, and asserted complete domination and control over his life, both inside and outside of his academic endeavors, repeatedly and forcibly groping, touching, and kissing him on a regular basis
I look forward to reading what Ronell has to say in court about this. Should be interesting reading too.

Oh, and I hear Ronell is a lesbian and the alleged boy-toy is gay.

Driftless
.
.
Posts: 298
Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:13 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3685

Post by Driftless » Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:11 am

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:33 pm

[...]

Also, address the "democracy only coming from the west" while explaining Japan and Korea. I'll wait.
I wonder why people are so vague in identifying the people who are properly democratic and/or individualistic? How do we know that it is anyone with ancestry from "the west" or who is "white"? What if it is only a small fraction of the population and the rest are just along for the ride?

Maybe in the future we'll have mandatory genetic testing and those without the "democracy gene" will be banished. I can see arguments and refinements until the whole thing collapses from purity tests, so it may not last.

ThreeFlangedJavis
.
.
Posts: 1376
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:13 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3686

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis » Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:12 am

DrokkIt wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:17 am
ConcentratedH2O, OM wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:07 pm
shoutinghorse wrote: Hey Phil, did you not see the signs?

https://i.imgur.com/w1d8nGC.jpg
Horse, is this another one of those pictures of unknown origin doing the rounds of your retirement home Facebook group?
It's a 4chan hoax, like all those ones designed to make feminists look stupid. Only this time it's a different kind of confirmation bias perspective that it being mocked.
Except that it isn't very far removed from reality.

https://youtu.be/SLT9JOE64WQ

ThreeFlangedJavis
.
.
Posts: 1376
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:13 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3687

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis » Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:18 am

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:17 am
What's the origin of the huge differences between Bostwana and Zimbabwe? It's surely not ethnicity. It's kind of hard to put it down to "culture". It looks very likely that the difference is a matter of institutions. For all its flaws and issues Bostwana is a representative, pluralistic, moderate liberal democracy. Zimbabew is a failed experiment at building a Shona ethno-state that then collapsed into a personal dictatorship of an ethno-centric corrupt tyrant who tried to garner power by fanning the flames of anti-white ethno-policies.
Kirb, did you read what you wrote before posting it? Something seems off.
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.

Hunt
.
.
Posts: 3062
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:04 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3688

Post by Hunt » Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:59 am

MarcusAu wrote:
Hunt wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:00 am
Strange how in Islam there doesn't seem to the be adolescent period of rebellion against established authority like there is in western societies. It would seem to me this would be the perfect antidote to the inheritance of Islamic radicalism. Islamic youth seem to become radicalized in direction of conformance, not rebellion. For an American, steeped in the tradition of James Dean 50s iconoclasm and 60s youth rebellion, this seems very strange.

Western societies, in some sense, have to "win back" youth into the culture. That phase seems to be missing in Islam. Now, it's true that in every society, demographics tend to become more conservative and conform more the more they age. Rebellious youth marry, have children, have jobs, pay bills. This in a sense crushes the rebellious instinct of youth, BUT the overall impression that establishment is not to be trusted often remains throughout life.

Also true is that in many strict Christian families you see the same type of conformance and missing period of rebellion. Not to the same extend. It may simply be that there is a threshold of crushing repression that obliterates adolescent rebellion.

I think you could say something similar about Israel.
This plan sounds a bit chaotic...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKlJVB5rhUA
Well, that's pretty much the classic explanation for that period of American youth. Post WWII (during which 50s youth were children) left a nihilistic vacuum in American culture, particularly youth culture, which didn't know enough to breathe a sigh of relief. The sad truth is that people usually need some kind of calamity to give purpose to their lives. Kind of like when Buzz Aldrin returned from the moon and dropped into a depression. A great challenge had passed, and then there was nothing.

Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 12497
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3689

Post by Matt Cavanaugh » Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:49 am

CommanderTuvok wrote: All those tweets of Dan Arel talking about how starving what a soft, spoiled, self-centered, materialistic member of the bourgeoisie he is.
FTFY, comrade.

Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 12497
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3690

Post by Matt Cavanaugh » Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:52 am

Anyone who kicks a dog deserves to have their testicles crushed with a pipe wrench.

Tigzy
Pit Art Master
Pit Art Master
Posts: 6789
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:53 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3691

Post by Tigzy » Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:17 am

AndrewV69 wrote: Are they Syrians?

Say Omak masasa (roughly means your mother is a whore who gives blowjobs) or Nayek emmak (I fucked your mum) or Eri be ketabak (fuck your holy book) or Mus zubi ya ibn al kalb (suck my dick you son of a dog) or quite simply say Kalb (dog).

You should not be surprised if you are now in a serious fight for your life.
If you go that route, Phil, make sure you've got some backup. Those muzzoid fuckers rarely fight one-on-one, generally preferring to adopt the courageous strategy of making sure they outnumber you. Same goes for Klantifa, too - they're the worst offenders, in fact.

John D
.
.
Posts: 4607
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 4:23 am
Location: Detroit, MI. USA
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3692

Post by John D » Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:39 am

Hunt wrote:
Well, that's pretty much the classic explanation for that period of American youth. Post WWII (during which 50s youth were children) left a nihilistic vacuum in American culture, particularly youth culture, which didn't know enough to breathe a sigh of relief. The sad truth is that people usually need some kind of calamity to give purpose to their lives. Kind of like when Buzz Aldrin returned from the moon and dropped into a depression. A great challenge had passed, and then there was nothing.
I can't remember the name given to this phenomina, but it has been suggested by our head-shrinker friends that young people have a strong desire to seek out an enemy so they can defeat it. This is part of our biological programming. I think this is true (in a Sam Harris as well as Jordan Peterson way).

Young people, especially young men, have to break the old hierarchy in order to secure their own possessions and mates. Men who have a certain amount of rebelliousness end up having some chance of reproducing. If you are just a content happy family member then... well... you become a priest. You don't reproduce and your sexuality gets suppressed (and even gets perverted).

I think one of the main problems with Americans between the age of 16 and 25 is that we have no shared enemy. Life is safe and boring for these young people. This is due to the defeat of most of our existential threats (like the USSR). So, you end up with lots of pampered and bored young people who decide the real enemy is Western Civilization itself.

Ape+lust
Pit Art Master
Pit Art Master
Posts: 7364
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:55 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3693

Post by Ape+lust » Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:50 am

Matt Cavanaugh wrote:
CommanderTuvok wrote: All those tweets of Dan Arel talking about how starving what a soft, spoiled, self-centered, materialistic member of the bourgeoisie he is.
FTFY, comrade.
The sight of that dude always fucks me up. He a commie, but he looks like an Eisenhower-era cold warrior.

https://imgur.com/M4bvDkv.jpg

shoutinghorse
.
.
Posts: 2649
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2017 6:01 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3694

Post by shoutinghorse » Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:30 am

Well at least they're allowed to drive now .. baby steps :?


free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 10391
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3695

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.
Odd that democracy was compatible with the culture of Imperial Japan.

Phil_Giordana_FCD
.
.
Posts: 11855
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:56 pm
Location: Nice, France
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3696

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:38 am

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.
Odd that democracy was compatible with the culture of Imperial Japan.
Japan was an empire until the American occupation post WWII. Then, things changed (panties. Panties changed).

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 10391
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3697

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:46 am

Great. Now Brive is into the leather bar scene.

AndrewV69
.
.
Posts: 7966
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3698

Post by AndrewV69 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:56 am

You people are killing me.

Fortunately, I have a spill proof keyboard.

AndrewV69
.
.
Posts: 7966
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3699

Post by AndrewV69 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:05 am

shoutinghorse wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:30 am
Well at least they're allowed to drive now .. baby steps :?

If you have any contact with any NGO, you are conspiring with foreigners against the interests of KSA so they are justified in putting you to death as a traitor.

(they are not actually too far from the truth in that one actually)

AndrewV69
.
.
Posts: 7966
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3700

Post by AndrewV69 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:17 am

Still,

I am getting hints that Esraa al-Ghamgam may not have been executed just yet. Videos circulating and purportedly showing her beheading are an old one of a woman convicted of murdering her step-daughter (she claimed she was innocent up to the last).

Could be #FakeNews.

AndrewV69
.
.
Posts: 7966
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3701

Post by AndrewV69 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:05 am

Yep,

The smoke is really bad. Six hundred wild fires on the go right now according to reports. A fellow Pitter might have trouble breathing right now. Never mind seeing more than five feet away.

TheMudbrooker
.
.
Posts: 786
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 4:15 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3702

Post by TheMudbrooker » Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:34 am

Goddamn, I love Wisconsin.....http://www.weau.com/content/news/Man-ar ... 83671.html

That takes dedication.

MarcusAu
.
.
Posts: 7143
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:49 am
Location: Llareggub
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3703

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:42 am

TheMudbrooker wrote: Goddamn, I love Wisconsin.....http://www.weau.com/content/news/Man-ar ... 83671.html

That takes dedication.
I misread that.

The Owls are not what they seem.

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 10391
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3704

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:27 pm

What? You've never heard the expression "drunk as an owl"?

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 10391
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3705

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:36 pm

AndrewV69 wrote: Yep,

The smoke is really bad. Six hundred wild fires on the go right now according to reports. A fellow Pitter might have trouble breathing right now. Never mind seeing more than five feet away.
We're at level 7 here. Kind of unpleasant for most and dangerous for some. Nanaimo and some parts of Vancouver and the Fraser Valley are at 10+.

Stankeye
.
.
Posts: 114
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:35 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3706

Post by Stankeye » Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:16 pm

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote: Panties changed
I sometimes do searches of words people write. This one lead me to this.



Who knew.

AndrewV69
.
.
Posts: 7966
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3707

Post by AndrewV69 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:10 pm

Stankeye wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:16 pm
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote: Panties changed
I sometimes do searches of words people write. This one lead me to this.

https://www.amazon.com/MEO-Changed-Man- ... B01NB1UK6V

Who knew.
Edited your post to make the link visible (to me at any rate).

shoutinghorse
.
.
Posts: 2649
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2017 6:01 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3708

Post by shoutinghorse » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:39 pm

I'm telling you folks, we've crashed into a parallel universe, I don't know when or how it happened but sometime in the last 5 to 10 years there has been a tear in the space/time thing-a-ma-jig and we've entered fucked up world. :shock:
Merseyside Police are making ‘enquiries’ into a trans-sceptical group that distributed stickers saying ‘Women don’t have penises’. Yes, that’s right: the police,
http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/ar ... 3s-0sJG3IU

KiwiInOz
.
.
Posts: 4916
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:28 pm
Location: Brisbane
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3709

Post by KiwiInOz » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:39 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote: What? You've never heard the expression "drunk as an owl"?
Or pissed as a newt.

ThreeFlangedJavis
.
.
Posts: 1376
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:13 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3710

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:15 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.
Odd that democracy was compatible with the culture of Imperial Japan.
Hardly. Discipline and a sense of honour and duty can make any system work.

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 10391
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3711

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:32 pm

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.
Odd that democracy was compatible with the culture of Imperial Japan.
Hardly. Discipline and a sense of honour and duty can make any system work.
Well obviously it does work. It would seem that democracy would most likely be maintained in a culture that values individuality rather than just the collective and has at least some background of freedom from strict authoritarian rule. Apparently, not always.

DrokkIt
.
.
Posts: 1327
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:01 pm
Location: Brit-Cit
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3712

Post by DrokkIt » Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:09 pm

shoutinghorse wrote: I'm telling you folks, we've crashed into a parallel universe, I don't know when or how it happened but sometime in the last 5 to 10 years there has been a tear in the space/time thing-a-ma-jig and we've entered fucked up world. :shock:
Merseyside Police are making ‘enquiries’ into a trans-sceptical group that distributed stickers saying ‘Women don’t have penises’. Yes, that’s right: the police,
http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/ar ... 3s-0sJG3IU
It's news when the police arrest anyone- they'd "make enquiries" if I complained about pretty much anything that vaguely sounded like it was breaking some kind of law.

I'm all for discussion on the reformation of our frankly daft hatespeech laws, but we don't need this kind of silly nonsense to do that. I'd not be surprised if the terf group complained about themselves and then put out a press release saying they were being investigated. Makes great PR for basically nothing having happened.

DrokkIt
.
.
Posts: 1327
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:01 pm
Location: Brit-Cit
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3713

Post by DrokkIt » Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:11 pm

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
DrokkIt wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:17 am
ConcentratedH2O, OM wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:07 pm
shoutinghorse wrote: Hey Phil, did you not see the signs?

https://i.imgur.com/w1d8nGC.jpg
Horse, is this another one of those pictures of unknown origin doing the rounds of your retirement home Facebook group?
It's a 4chan hoax, like all those ones designed to make feminists look stupid. Only this time it's a different kind of confirmation bias perspective that it being mocked.
Except that it isn't very far removed from reality.

https://youtu.be/SLT9JOE64WQ
The wisdom of accepting Sargon as 'reality' notwithstanding, the poster is a hoax and fake. We ought to have standards about not holding up lies if they help a narrative we like.

Keating
.
.
Posts: 1946
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:18 pm
Location: South of anteater guy
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3714

Post by Keating » Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:23 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:32 pm
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.
Odd that democracy was compatible with the culture of Imperial Japan.
Hardly. Discipline and a sense of honour and duty can make any system work.
Well obviously it does work. It would seem that democracy would most likely be maintained in a culture that values individuality rather than just the collective and has at least some background of freedom from strict authoritarian rule. Apparently, not always.
I think it’s more that the vast majority of people have a shared identity, and therefore agree on most things. Democracy is easy, and hardly controversial, when everyone votes the ‘correct’ way. The problem comes when you attempt to explain ‘liberal’ democracies. The ‘liberal’ doesn’t follow from shared values.

ConcentratedH2O, OM
.
.
Posts: 6461
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2012 8:51 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3715

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM » Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:28 pm

shoutinghorse wrote: I'm telling you folks, we've crashed into a parallel universe, I don't know when or how it happened but sometime in the last 5 to 10 years there has been a tear in the space/time thing-a-ma-jig and we've entered fucked up world. :shock:
Merseyside Police are making ‘enquiries’ into a trans-sceptical group that distributed stickers saying ‘Women don’t have penises’. Yes, that’s right: the police,
http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/ar ... 3s-0sJG3IU
Look who turns up in the comments. I miss him here, he was a funny guy.

https://i.imgur.com/Sv62AnA.png

Keating
.
.
Posts: 1946
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:18 pm
Location: South of anteater guy
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3716

Post by Keating » Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:29 pm

Kirbmarc wrote: To make an analogy, the difference between Bostwana and Zimbabwe is similar to the difference between France and Germany before World War Two: it wasn't a matter of "French genes" or "German genes", or even of cultural tendencies (anti-semitism was, at the time, very widespread in France, too) but a difference in political regime. Nazi Germany was an attempt to create an ethno-state...we all know how it ended. France instead was a liberal democracy, albeit not a perfect one, where minorities had rights and participated to the public life even if there were prejudices against them (Leon Blum was a prominent French politician of those times, and he had Jewish ancestry, for example).
I’m not sure this is a good analogy. Africa, as would be expected from the source of humanity, has the biggest genetic variation, and thus population subgroups. Indeed, this still plays out a lot today, for example how shitty the Bantu are to the Bushmen. One could argue that a big part of the reason that both the Middle East and Africa failed as colonial endeavours is that the existing ethnic boundaries weren’t considered in drawing the new nations.

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 10391
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3717

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:31 pm

Keating wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:32 pm
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.
Odd that democracy was compatible with the culture of Imperial Japan.
Hardly. Discipline and a sense of honour and duty can make any system work.
Well obviously it does work. It would seem that democracy would most likely be maintained in a culture that values individuality rather than just the collective and has at least some background of freedom from strict authoritarian rule. Apparently, not always.
I think it’s more that the vast majority of people have a shared identity, and therefore agree on most things. Democracy is easy, and hardly controversial, when everyone votes the ‘correct’ way. The problem comes when you attempt to explain ‘liberal’ democracies. The ‘liberal’ doesn’t follow from shared values.
The word "liberal" is a bit problematic because it has so many meanings, including ones that have been put on it more or less recently by partisan politicians. Also the word is perceived differently in different places.
liberal (comparative more liberal, superlative most liberal)

(now rare outside set phrases) Pertaining to those arts and sciences the study of which is considered to provide general knowledge, as opposed to vocational/occupational, technical or mechanical training.
He had a full education studying the liberal arts.
Generous; willing to give unsparingly.
He was liberal with his compliments.
Ample, abundant; generous in quantity.
Add a liberal sprinkling of salt.
(obsolete) Unrestrained, licentious.
Widely open to new ideas, willing to depart from established opinions or conventions; permissive.
Her parents had liberal ideas about child-rearing.
(politics) Open to political or social changes and reforms associated with either classical or modern liberalism.
Forgive for not being fluent in Aussie but when you say:
The problem comes when you attempt to explain ‘liberal’ democracies. The ‘liberal’ doesn’t follow from shared values.
I don't understand what you are getting at here.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 16700
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3718

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:42 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:31 pm
Keating wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:32 pm
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am
ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Other than in dictatorships institutions are only implementable if they are compatible with the cuture. Seems kind of obvious.
Odd that democracy was compatible with the culture of Imperial Japan.
Hardly. Discipline and a sense of honour and duty can make any system work.
Well obviously it does work. It would seem that democracy would most likely be maintained in a culture that values individuality rather than just the collective and has at least some background of freedom from strict authoritarian rule. Apparently, not always.
I think it’s more that the vast majority of people have a shared identity, and therefore agree on most things. Democracy is easy, and hardly controversial, when everyone votes the ‘correct’ way. The problem comes when you attempt to explain ‘liberal’ democracies. The ‘liberal’ doesn’t follow from shared values.
The word "liberal" is a bit problematic because it has so many meanings, including ones that have been put on it more or less recently by partisan politicians. Also the word is perceived differently in different places.
liberal (comparative more liberal, superlative most liberal)

(now rare outside set phrases) Pertaining to those arts and sciences the study of which is considered to provide general knowledge, as opposed to vocational/occupational, technical or mechanical training.
He had a full education studying the liberal arts.
Generous; willing to give unsparingly.
He was liberal with his compliments.
Ample, abundant; generous in quantity.
Add a liberal sprinkling of salt.
(obsolete) Unrestrained, licentious.
Widely open to new ideas, willing to depart from established opinions or conventions; permissive.
Her parents had liberal ideas about child-rearing.
(politics) Open to political or social changes and reforms associated with either classical or modern liberalism.
Forgive for not being fluent in Aussie but when you say:
The problem comes when you attempt to explain ‘liberal’ democracies. The ‘liberal’ doesn’t follow from shared values.
I don't understand what you are getting at here.
Given his dog whistle to “shared identity” and “shared values” it’s probably best if you cut to the chase and simply call him a “nazi cunt”. :mrgreen: ;)

Keating
.
.
Posts: 1946
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:18 pm
Location: South of anteater guy
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3719

Post by Keating » Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:48 pm

Strewth, yeah, cactus phrasing. I can be true-blue drongo at sparrow’s fart, but, give a bloke a fair go, mate.

Basically, that I think a democracy can function as long as most of the population has shared values and will largely vote together.

A liberal democracy, requires that, and also that the population has liberal values.

Keating
.
.
Posts: 1946
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:18 pm
Location: South of anteater guy
Contact:

Re: Fuck off, Jamie!

#3720

Post by Keating » Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:51 pm

Japan is a special case, as it is an example of democracy being imposed by an external force, which hasn’t worked in places like Iraq.

Locked