In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

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SM1957
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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7681

Post by SM1957 » Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:11 am

CommanderTuvok wrote:Has anybody noticed this from the ever-increasingly deluded Guardian in the UK? There is shock, horror, and disgust at the fact that the UK publishing industry is "90% white", in a country where 82% (I think) of people are white. This is based on 1,000 or so respondents to a survey.
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2017/ ... rvey-finds
The Guardian believes that if 90% of people who work in an industry are white that is incredible evidence of racism.

The Guardian also believes that if a Muslim grooming gang selects 100% white children to anally rape and torture, then there is no element of race involved whatsoever.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7682

Post by Hunt » Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:32 am

If Jerry Brown reverses the parole, it'll be pure politics, which is exactly why I despise him. Truly weird that Brown and his father were governors at times that bracket the events in question. I wonder how much that will affect his decision. Anyway, the guy is a total creep. I used to know a California flight attendant who once worked for him and his entourage, said he was a total ass. I believe her.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7683

Post by John D » Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:22 am

MarcusAu wrote:
jimhabegger wrote:Speaking of Casey Kasem:

[youtube.]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMQj7YZ9eOU[/youtube]
We were?

Speaking of the voice of Shaggy...


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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7684

Post by MarcusAu » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:17 am

Did anyone notice Dave Rubin's recent return after one month 'off the gird'.

Based on his recent Q&A vid he seems to have changed his mind on atheism.

Apparently, there are many things you can't prove - the example he gave being love for your mother. He also states that it was during his talk with Peter Boghossian that he felt 'pinned' with the atheism tag (despite having identifying himself as such earlier during his talk with Milo).

I don't mind the softball questioning style so much - but nobody, absolutely nobody, should be pinning Davey in the corner. (Or any other interviewer for that matter).

Perhaps it was not such a good idea for Zelig to have his own chat show.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7685

Post by jet_lagg » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:39 am

jugheadnaut wrote:
Mulholland Dr. (the literal name of the movie, and the distinction is important as it gives a clue as to what's going on) is probably the most accessible of his 'weird' movies, as there's a relatively simple, non-obscure explanation for almost all the weirdness, and there's a compelling sad story behind the weirdness.
What's your explanation? It's not that I doubt Lynch uses extensive symbolism in his films, it's that he layers it on so heavy I think people are free to see their own narratives in the resulting fog and attribute any success in this personal effort back to the director. When I was young I wrote a story dense with all kinds of magical realism and metaphor that my family and friends really loved. Each person *knew* exactly what it was about, and not a single person's interpretation overlapped with anyone elses. One friend showed it to her father, a detective, and he did actually nail what I was thinking beat for beat, to the point I would have been sure he was cheating. Except I hadn't told anybody what I had in mind when writing it, so I guess we were just attuned.

Lynch's movies do work for me more often than they don't. He's got an intuitive feel for the rhythm of the human drama. It's hidden there beneath all the seemingly random weirdness, and that's what separates him from imitators who just come across as white noise. Swiss Army Man by Daniels pulls off a similar trick.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7686

Post by jet_lagg » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:42 am

MarcusAu wrote: Apparently, there are many things you can't prove - the example he gave being love for your mother.
This shit again. There's only one response we need.

"Love without evidence is... stalking." - Tim Minchin

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7687

Post by Shatterface » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:43 am

If Manson had been a millennial he'd have definitely been antifa.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7688

Post by Lsuoma » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:48 am

deLurch wrote:"Digital Terrorism." In other words they are going to DDOS some low grade websites. Sure one of them could have the skills to temporarily take out DNS infrastructure, but the Feds would be on them like fleas on Watson's mingy dog.

More sophisticated infrastructure attacks like the electric grid would require industry specific work experience, in addition to technical expertise. Work isn't exactly their strong suit there.

The worst I think they could do is target major retailers/payment processors during the holiday shopping season. But all that really does is differ sales by a day or two.
They're unlikely to be able to hit anyone big - professional groups have been trying to blackmail large websites for years now, and few actually go dark.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7689

Post by Lsuoma » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:50 am

MacGruberKnows wrote:
MarcusAu wrote:
jimhabegger wrote:Speaking of Casey Kasem:

[goutube.]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMQj7YZ9eOU[/youtube]
We were?

No, was not speaking about him, but I will take one potty mouthed yank and raise you one snothead forever better than you English pedant:

[goutube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V14PfDDwxlE[/youtube]

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7690

Post by Shatterface » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:54 am

jet_lagg wrote:What's your explanation? It's not that I doubt Lynch uses extensive symbolism in his films, it's that he layers it on so heavy I think people are free to see their own narratives in the resulting fog and attribute any success in this personal effort back to the director. When I was young I wrote a story dense with all kinds of magical realism and metaphor that my family and friends really loved. Each person *knew* exactly what it was about, and not a single person's interpretation overlapped with anyone elses. One friend showed it to her father, a detective, and he did actually nail what I was thinking beat for beat, to the point I would have been sure he was cheating. Except I hadn't told anybody what I had in mind when writing it, so I guess we were just attuned.

Lynch's movies do work for me more often than they don't. He's got an intuitive feel for the rhythm of the human drama. It's hidden there beneath all the seemingly random weirdness, and that's what separates him from imitators who just come across as white noise. Swiss Army Man by Daniels pulls off a similar trick.
I call things like this 'paraidolic texts'. The writer or director supplies just enough stimuli for the audience to project their own meaning onto it which they assume corresponds to something intentional. All art is like that to some extent but with Lynch films it is taken to an extreme.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7691

Post by MarcusAu » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:06 am

Shatterface wrote:If Manson had been a millennial he'd have definitely been antifa.
I'm sure he'd have taken a stab at it.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7692

Post by Kirbmarc » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:22 am

jet_lagg wrote:
MarcusAu wrote: Apparently, there are many things you can't prove - the example he gave being love for your mother.
This shit again. There's only one response we need.

"Love without evidence is... stalking." - Tim Minchin
Also you can definitely prove that your mother exist, or, if she died, that she existed. Love for God is like falling in love with a fictional character, or, in the case of organized religion, like being scammed by a group of people practicing dating fraud.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7693

Post by Kirbmarc » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:24 am

Incidentally dating/romance fraud proves that people can fall in love with something which isn't a real person. This is a good answer for those believers who think that their love for God proves that their god exists.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7694

Post by John D » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:30 am

Kirbmarc wrote:Incidentally dating/romance fraud proves that people can fall in love with something which isn't a real person. This is a good answer for those believers who think that their love for God proves that their god exists.
I'm done with the whole god argument shit. People are just fucking stupid. If a person can't see that god is probably a fiction in today's media environment, then nothing I say or do will matter. I am open about my atheism and I am not shy about responding to religious bigots, but in general, I am sick to death of this topic.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7695

Post by Kirbmarc » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:34 am

Shatterface wrote:If Manson had been a millennial he'd have definitely been antifa.
Isn't Manson a white supremacist? I've seen pictures of him with a swastika on his forehead.

The Symbionese Liberation Army are more similar to a weird sort of fusion between Antifa and the SJWs.
In his manifesto "Symbionese Liberation Army Declaration of Revolutionary War & the Symbionese Program", Donald DeFreeze wrote, "The name 'symbionese' is taken from the word symbiosis and we define its meaning as a body of dissimilar bodies and organisms living in deep and loving harmony and partnership in the best interest of all within the body."[1]

This political symbiosis DeFreeze describes means the unity of all left-wing struggles, feminist, anti-racist, anti-capitalist, and others. DeFreeze wanted all races, genders, and ages to fight together in a left-wing united front, and to live together peacefully.[2]

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7696

Post by MarcusAu » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:53 am

As I recall the swastika on Manson's forehead is a scar which he carved in with a knife.

If you search long enough you will probably find reference to several of his actions and ideas which could be interpreted as offensive.

But if you are looking for someone with a coherent set of beliefs Ted Kaczynski is probably a better option.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7697

Post by Kirbmarc » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:56 am

MarcusAu wrote:As I recall the swastika on Manson's forehead is a scar which he carved in with a knife.

If you search long enough you will probably find reference to several of his actions and ideas which could be interpreted as offensive.

But if you are looking for someone with a coherent set of beliefs Ted Kaczynski is probably a better option.
I've read Unabomber's manifesto. It's well-written and the author is clearly a clever person. It's still nuts, though.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7698

Post by feathers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:09 am

Shatterface wrote:I call things like this 'paraidolic texts'. The writer or director supplies just enough stimuli for the audience to project their own meaning onto it which they assume corresponds to something intentional. All art is like that to some extent but with Lynch films it is taken to an extreme.
At the conclusion of the test, you can simply mop up his followers who are still obsessing "logical conclusions" a year later and put them somewhere where they can't hurt society too much. Case in point, Twin Peaks, 1991.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7699

Post by feathers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:15 am

MarcusAu wrote:As I recall the swastika on Manson's forehead is a scar which he carved in with a knife.
It started as a cross, in prison he made it into a swastika.

Don't try to find logic or principles in this man (any more than in a Lynch film). He's just blazing mad.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7700

Post by katamari Damassi » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:16 am

A consequence of my not taking Adderall is that I have music or songs(usually song fragments)playing in a continuous loop inside my head. Usually it's the last bit of music that I've heard, or something that I see or hear reminds me of a song, but sometimes it's something from the distant past that I hadn't thought about in over 20 years. This morning it's this:

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7701

Post by Shatterface » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:31 am

Kirbmarc wrote:Incidentally dating/romance fraud proves that people can fall in love with something which isn't a real person. This is a good answer for those believers who think that their love for God proves that their god exists.
People marry bridges and cars too.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7702

Post by MarcusAu » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:33 am

Shatterface wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:Incidentally dating/romance fraud proves that people can fall in love with something which isn't a real person. This is a good answer for those believers who think that their love for God proves that their god exists.
People marry bridges and cars too.
Isn't that illegal? Most countries have laws against bigamy.


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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7704

Post by feathers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:16 am

Shatterface wrote:Matt gets another nod from Jerry:

https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com
If you don't mind me going slightly deeper (I need enthusiastic consent):
https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.co ... c-schools/

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7705

Post by AndrewV69 » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:24 am

Latest Ally Fogg : Male victims, the CPS and the latest chapter in the saga

All I have to say is well done Ally. Yes I agree that while there has been progress, much remains to be done.
In terms of what policies I would have liked to see spelled out in the document, there is one area that remains apparently off-limits, which is the issue of sexual abuse of men by women – including forced and coerced penetrative sex.
When you have ideologues in charge of policy, stuff like this happens:

Tried for a sex crime... because I brushed past a film star in rush-hour: Artist, 51, accused of bizarre 'hit and run' assault on award-winning actress despite no evidence or witnesses - so why DID it come to trial?

Why did it come to trial?

Well, for starters Alison Saunders, responded thusly when her feet were held to the fire by Ally Fogg et al. But what a response. The misleading headline in that odious rag the Guardian* Some violence is targeted at women and girls – we can’t ignore that -- Alison Saunders
I fully accept the concerns raised by some, however, that we need to be clearer in our annual VaWG report about the inclusion of men and boys, which is why I have arranged for amendments to be made to the current, and all future, reports. We will clarify our introductory remarks and we will also, where possible, include a breakdown of gender volumes. So I reject the notion that we are excluding men and boys – rather, I stress that we are being inclusive in our approach.
Right. Right. That is why the stats for men were not broken out but included into the women's thus inflating the numbers.

When the real world does not match your ideology you have to do something. Mark Pearson was put on trial to buff their stats. Who else has been convicted because there was no CCTV evidence to contradict the narrative? Your guess is as good as mine.

No one is safe from prosecutors' terrifying incompetence on 'sex crimes'
There is undoubtedly enormous political pressure on the CPS to bring more prosecutions against sex offenders, and specifically more successful prosecutions. Yet, despite more than 5,000 extra rape prosecutions being brought in 2014, the CPS won only 77 extra convictions.
Again and again we hear of cases coming to court on the flimsiest of grounds when anyone, after a cursory glance at the facts, could see there would be no chance of conviction.
The Director of Public Prosecutions, Alison Saunders, must realise that she is not doing sexual assault victims any favours by bringing cases like Mr Pearson’s to court.
Say what you will about Ally but he is impossible to ignore. However, one day he will come under fire because of this. I suspect it is not happening now because he has impeccable leftist credentials and he will make no common cause with anyone who is the slightest to the right of Jeremy Corbyn. In fact he will attack them with vim and vigour. But that is not going to make any difference in the end.

So do a search on "Alison Saunders uk policy" to see what is going on. Basically, she is a political animal. Not interested in justice, but very interested in an agenda. This is why she is a walking bag of slime.

Anyway,

I am going to stop here before I start ranting. Not as if there is not plenty wrong with the justice system in Canukistan either. But that is a topic for another day.

* I once had an overseas print subscription to the Manchester Guardian. How the mighty have fallen.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7706

Post by Barbie's Boyfriend » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:34 am

jet_lagg wrote:
MarcusAu wrote: Apparently, there are many things you can't prove - the example he gave being love for your mother.
This shit again. There's only one response we need.

"Love without evidence is... stalking." - Tim Minchin
Whenever I argue with my friends about Atheism v Theism, they ALWAYS go "You can't prove 'Love", therefore Gawd". Either that is a mighty strange coincidence, or that is the first thing they find when they Google "Proof for Gawd"

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7707

Post by free thoughtpolice » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:50 am

Kirbmarc wrote:
Shatterface wrote:If Manson had been a millennial he'd have definitely been antifa.
Isn't Manson a white supremacist? I've seen pictures of him with a swastika on his forehead.

The Symbionese Liberation Army are more similar to a weird sort of fusion between Antifa and the SJWs.
In his manifesto "Symbionese Liberation Army Declaration of Revolutionary War & the Symbionese Program", Donald DeFreeze wrote, "The name 'symbionese' is taken from the word symbiosis and we define its meaning as a body of dissimilar bodies and organisms living in deep and loving harmony and partnership in the best interest of all within the body."[1]

This political symbiosis DeFreeze describes means the unity of all left-wing struggles, feminist, anti-racist, anti-capitalist, and others. DeFreeze wanted all races, genders, and ages to fight together in a left-wing united front, and to live together peacefully.[2]
During the winter of 1975/6 (I think that was the year) my girlfriend and I were driving through California in a pick up truck/camper. We ended up near a town called Vacaville near evening and decided to overnight there. As i recall, there weren't any campgrounds there, so we drove a little out of town and found a place to pull off the road to bed down.
About 3 am we awoke to super powerful military style floodlights and megaphones. Looking outside there were a dozen or more cop cars and a whole shitload of guns pointed at us.
After a few hours the cops moved on without explaining what the Apocalypse Now show was all about other than we were trespassing. When I mentioned there was no signage or other indication that we were on private land the cop said that there had been thefts at a building site down the road.
Some time later, I discovered there was a high security prison somewhere near there that had housed Charlie Manson from time to time, as well as Tim Leary after the Black Panthers had broken him out of another prison and other various high risk celebrity baddies. That and it was around the time that they arrested Patty Hearst and the SLA had been waging attacks on prison personnel and facilities.
And muslims snivel about being profiled as terrorists? :x

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7708

Post by Matt Cavanaugh » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:00 am

feathers wrote:
Shatterface wrote:Matt gets another nod from Jerry:

https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com
If you don't mind me going slightly deeper (I need enthusiastic consent):
https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.co ... c-schools/
If 4chan is weaponized autism, the Pit is at least weaponized alpaca burger.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7709

Post by Matt Cavanaugh » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:03 am

free thoughtpolice wrote: During the winter of 1975/6 (I think that was the year) my girlfriend and I were driving through California in a pick up truck/camper. We ended up near a town called Vacaville near evening and decided to overnight there. As i recall, there weren't any campgrounds there, so we drove a little out of town and found a place to pull off the road to bed down.
About 3 am we awoke to super powerful military style floodlights and megaphones. Looking outside there were a dozen or more cop cars and a whole shitload of guns pointed at us.
After a few hours the cops moved on without explaining what the Apocalypse Now show was all about other than we were trespassing. When I mentioned there was no signage or other indication that we were on private land the cop said that there had been thefts at a building site down the road.
Some time later, I discovered there was a high security prison somewhere near there that had housed Charlie Manson from time to time, as well as Tim Leary after the Black Panthers had broken him out of another prison and other various high risk celebrity baddies. That and it was around the time that they arrested Patty Hearst and the SLA had been waging attacks on prison personnel and facilities.
And muslims snivel about being profiled as terrorists? :x
Yeah, there still ain't much in "Cow Town", CA, other than a big shopping mall that causes traffic on I-80.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7710

Post by free thoughtpolice » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:29 am

Yeah, there still ain't much in "Cow Town", CA, other than a big shopping mall that causes traffic on I-80.
I am not surprised they haven't developed a thriving tourism/hospitality industry. :drool:

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7711

Post by Matt Cavanaugh » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:33 am

So yesterday Hemant wrote 8 blog posts, each about how stoopid evangelicals are, including 2 on Ken Ham.

I'm wondering if there's not a bit o' bipolar going on.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7712

Post by free thoughtpolice » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:36 am


So the jooze are behind antifa.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7713

Post by gurugeorge » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:45 am

Barbie's Boyfriend wrote:
jet_lagg wrote:
MarcusAu wrote: Apparently, there are many things you can't prove - the example he gave being love for your mother.
This shit again. There's only one response we need.

"Love without evidence is... stalking." - Tim Minchin
Whenever I argue with my friends about Atheism v Theism, they ALWAYS go "You can't prove 'Love", therefore Gawd". Either that is a mighty strange coincidence, or that is the first thing they find when they Google "Proof for Gawd"
It doesn't work as a syllogism, but it's suggestive as an argument by analogy. Love is the kind of thing that's not quite puttable into words, but instantly recognizable, and markedly different from lust. The religious feeling is the same.

Another, similar analogy, is musical sense. Most people thankfully have it, but a few don't. Is the melody "there" or not? Tricky philosophical question.

Or Magic Eye pictures. Most people can get that solid, 3-d image after a bit of squinting, doing "things" with their eyes that they've never done before; a few can't, no matter how hard they squint. Is the image "there" or not? Tricky philosophical question.

Fundamentally, some people see a kind of "music" in the world and some don't. The ones who do might be hallucinating - or the ones who don't might be missing something.

The question of the existence of God is far from settled. It's pretty obvious that there's no "testy senior of Genesis" (Crowley) up there in the sky; but whether there's a First Cause, a "God of the philosophers," some kind of intelligibility (Logos) intrinsic to the universe, or not - that's not settled at all. And the phenomenon of different religions is easily understandable as various simplistic (and Chinesely-whispered over generations) versions of that core idea of intrinsic intelligibility.

The "lottery argument" will only take you so far, because it depends on the presupposition that there were alternatives, which in turn is far from settled. The more necessary the universe we have turns out to be, the more its intelligibility must also be a necessary feature, the more God/Logos/Dao/Isvara, etc., etc. - i.e. something mind-like at the root of things - becomes plausible.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7714

Post by Sunder » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:54 am

Matt Cavanaugh wrote:So yesterday Hemant wrote 8 blog posts, each about how stoopid evangelicals are, including 2 on Ken Ham.

I'm wondering if there's not a bit o' bipolar going on.
I don't think Hemant's behavior merits any explanation more complex than simple monetary motives. Evangelical bashing still inexplicably draws a crowd. As for Ham I stopped following the back and forth on his little tax dodge scheme for his big boat. Maybe there have been some genuine new developments worth briefing everyone on. But also perhaps not.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7715

Post by Shatterface » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:03 am

I don't think the 'I love me mum' argument works even by analogy. It's a declaration of an internal state. It might be true or it might not be, but the truthfulness of the statement depends only on the honesty of the speaker. All one can say about god is that you genuinely believe in his existence. This belief is an internal state analogous to love but it says nothing about the existence of the object of that love.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7716

Post by Kirbmarc » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:10 am

free thoughtpolice wrote:

So the jooze are behind antifa.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7717

Post by Guest_feb1d7eb » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:20 am

I just saw an article in the Graun about Tori Amos. I didn't read it, I'm just mentioning it because the blurb under the headline mentioned her "late Cherokee grandfather". Milky white skin, freckles, ginger hair. Is Caine Tori Amos?

I know someone who claims Native American heritage and she's always posting white man did this, europeans did that and all those oh so clever Native memds about whitey being illegal immigrants to the US. I also know she dyes her blonde hair black. She was raised evangelical and homeschooled, no point trying to explain why her native DNA amounts to a teaspoon in a bucket and that she's more whitey European oppressor than hard done by native. Her boyfriend knows though, you should see the look on his face every time she starts.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7718

Post by Really? » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:21 am

Education Secretary Betsy DeVos gave a speech in which she went against the "Dear Colleague" rape culture witch hunt bullshit.
In a major speech assailing the deprivation of due process protections under the Obama administration, Education Secretary Betsy DeVos will vow to rein in the federal guidance compelling colleges to adjudicate sexual assault disputes between students.

Reason has obtained excerpts from her prepared remarks, which DeVos will deliver at George Mason University this afternoon.

No one could accuse DeVos of pulling punches. Her speech accuses her predecessors of "weaponizing" federal regulations and turning them against students.

"The era of 'rule by letter' is over," her speech says, referencing the Obama-era Education Department's infamous "Dear Colleague" letter, which fundamentally changed the way schools handle sexual misconduct issues. "Through intimidation and coercion, the failed system has clearly pushed schools to overreach."
http://reason.com/blog/2017/09/07/betsy ... -ix-campus

As you might expect, the left is lying and/or stupid about saying that DeVos wants each woman in the country to be raped at least twice and by at least two different men. (I'm slightly exaggerating.) #StopBetsy. (Stop her from what, exactly.)

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7719

Post by Sunder » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:32 am

Jerry's got another post up wherein he blames religion for Republican denial of climate change. A couple people point out that there are already perfectly good secular reasons for their doing so (Reps don't like problems that imply govt. involvement in the solution, nor do they like the idea of placing limits on industry).

I think that crowd just never picked up the "correlation =/= causation" memo.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7720

Post by InfraRedBucket » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:38 am

AndrewV69 wrote: Why did it come to trial?

Well, for starters Alison Saunders, responded thusly when her feet were held to the fire by Ally Fogg et al. But what a response. The misleading headline in that odious rag the Guardian* Some violence is targeted at women and girls – we can’t ignore that -- Alison Saunders
I fully accept the concerns raised by some, however, that we need to be clearer in our annual VaWG report about the inclusion of men and boys, which is why I have arranged for amendments to be made to the current, and all future, reports. We will clarify our introductory remarks and we will also, where possible, include a breakdown of gender volumes. So I reject the notion that we are excluding men and boys – rather, I stress that we are being inclusive in our approach.
Right. Right. That is why the stats for men were not broken out but included into the women's thus inflating the numbers.

When the real world does not match your ideology you have to do something. Mark Pearson was put on trial to buff their stats. Who else has been convicted because there was no CCTV evidence to contradict the narrative? Your guess is as good as mine.

No one is safe from prosecutors' terrifying incompetence on 'sex crimes'

Say what you will about Ally but he is impossible to ignore. However, one day he will come under fire because of this. I suspect it is not happening now because he has impeccable leftist credentials and he will make no common cause with anyone who is the slightest to the right of Jeremy Corbyn. In fact he will attack them with vim and vigour. But that is not going to make any difference in the end.

So do a search on "Alison Saunders uk policy" to see what is going on. Basically, she is a political animal. Not interested in justice, but very interested in an agenda. This is why she is a walking bag of slime.
https://i.imgur.com/RBmnckX.jpg

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7721

Post by John D » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:58 am

Really? wrote:Education Secretary Betsy DeVos gave a speech in which she went against the "Dear Colleague" rape culture witch hunt bullshit.
In a major speech assailing the deprivation of due process protections under the Obama administration, Education Secretary Betsy DeVos will vow to rein in the federal guidance compelling colleges to adjudicate sexual assault disputes between students.

Reason has obtained excerpts from her prepared remarks, which DeVos will deliver at George Mason University this afternoon.

No one could accuse DeVos of pulling punches. Her speech accuses her predecessors of "weaponizing" federal regulations and turning them against students.

"The era of 'rule by letter' is over," her speech says, referencing the Obama-era Education Department's infamous "Dear Colleague" letter, which fundamentally changed the way schools handle sexual misconduct issues. "Through intimidation and coercion, the failed system has clearly pushed schools to overreach."
http://reason.com/blog/2017/09/07/betsy ... -ix-campus

As you might expect, the left is lying and/or stupid about saying that DeVos wants each woman in the country to be raped at least twice and by at least two different men. (I'm slightly exaggerating.) #StopBetsy. (Stop her from what, exactly.)
The left despises DeVos for a number of reasons. The biggest one is that she is a really big promoter of vouchers. Vouchers are a big threat to the Teachers Union. She has been working on this in Michigan for decades. She is not a traditional politician and so she owes no one any favors. She is also a big supporter of Michigan republicans.

The Teachers Union has pulled out all the stops to discredit her saying stuff like vouchers are racist. The funny thing is that poor families want vouchers so they can get out of their shitty local school and get their kid into a better school.

https://www.usnews.com/news/education-n ... egregation

The problem is that public schools are costing more and more every year and they get worse results. A bunch of this is due to new requirement (mainstreaming, title IX, testing, etc.) but I think much of it is due to the teachers union. You can't fire bad teachers, and you can't reward good teachers (with bonus pay etc.). Many teachers sink to the lowest common performance level.

http://reason.com/reasontv/2017/08/22/s ... s-crush-in

I piss off my entire family (wife, mother, sister, cousins, brother) on Facebook cause every time DeVos does something I post it and write "GO BETSY!" Haha. It's fucking hilarious. My sister works in a school, my nephew is a teacher, my sister-in-law is a retired teacher, my wife is a secretary in a school. So.... it is me against them all.

GO BETSY!

Guest_feb1d7eb

Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7722

Post by Guest_feb1d7eb » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:07 pm

Vouchers are bullshit. Sure they'll help people who are already comfortably off to afford private schools that they otherwise might not, but it isn't going to get those poor people you mention get their kids into a private school because poor parents don't have the money to make up the difference. It's a private school assistance tax rebate for already wealthy people.

CaughtUpLockedOut

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7723

Post by Sunder » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:14 pm

John D wrote:The left despises DeVos for a number of reasons. The biggest one is that she is a really big promoter of vouchers. Vouchers are a big threat to the Teachers Union.
Vouchers are also a great way to get public money into religious schools, so you know, there's that reason as well to be a bit skeptical.

DeVos is doing the right thing in the case of pushing back against the Obama era OCR. But then there's a few policy points I agree with Hillary on while still thinking she's a big piece of shit on the whole. I dunno, I'm just wary of joining a team and signing up for anyone's newsletter right now.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7724

Post by Really? » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:18 pm

Guest_feb1d7eb wrote:Vouchers are bullshit. Sure they'll help people who are already comfortably off to afford private schools that they otherwise might not, but it isn't going to get those poor people you mention get their kids into a private school because poor parents don't have the money to make up the difference. It's a private school assistance tax rebate for already wealthy people.

CaughtUpLockedOut

This may shock you, but DeVos was Chairwoman of the Board for an organization dedicated to ensuring that public money flows to private hands.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_ ... ool_Choice

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7725

Post by John D » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:37 pm

Really? wrote:
Guest_feb1d7eb wrote:Vouchers are bullshit. Sure they'll help people who are already comfortably off to afford private schools that they otherwise might not, but it isn't going to get those poor people you mention get their kids into a private school because poor parents don't have the money to make up the difference. It's a private school assistance tax rebate for already wealthy people.

CaughtUpLockedOut

This may shock you, but DeVos was Chairwoman of the Board for an organization dedicated to ensuring that public money flows to private hands.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_ ... ool_Choice
No... I'm not surprised at all. I know a lot about DeVos. Something needs to change in public school. The left has no good ideas... well... really ... the only idea they have is to spend more, pay more, and grow the existing bloated bull shit. I am happy to experiment with options that will give some people a rug burn. In the short term things will get screwed up in some places, but at least something is changing.

At the very least, the poor parents who give a shit about their children's education will have some choice. The choice causes high quality parents to push their children into a better school. The parents who don't care will just take their kid to their lousy local school. This ability to choose will allow the most active and supportive parents to create a school environment that they can improve. The kids with bad parents will just end up in prison anyway... so who the fuck cares.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7726

Post by Oglebart » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:45 pm

Shatterface wrote:If Manson had been a millennial he'd have definitely been antifa.
Although we do know that he definitely wasn't anti-family.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7727

Post by Oglebart » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:53 pm

katamari Damassi wrote:A consequence of my not taking Adderall is that I have music or songs(usually song fragments)playing in a continuous loop inside my head. Usually it's the last bit of music that I've heard, or something that I see or hear reminds me of a song, but sometimes it's something from the distant past that I hadn't thought about in over 20 years. This morning it's this:
There could be worst earworms to get, try this for another Gabriel one.


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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7728

Post by Oglebart » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:01 pm

Matt Cavanaugh wrote:
feathers wrote:
Shatterface wrote:Matt gets another nod from Jerry:

https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com
If you don't mind me going slightly deeper (I need enthusiastic consent):
https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.co ... c-schools/
If 4chan is weaponized autism, the Pit is at least weaponized alpaca burger.
I've always thought it had a sort of Milwall Brick feel to it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millwall_brick

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-8fv7D6Rb0K8/T ... ksteps.jpg

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7729

Post by free thoughtpolice » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:10 pm

The kids with bad parents will just end up in prison anyway... so who the fuck cares.
Well you know, the little bastards couldn't be bothered to choose proper parents. They don't deserve a chance in life like a proper education so there really isn't any point in trying to improve public schools. Just shut the fuckers down and convert the buildings into prisons for children.
Did anyone ever tell you that you are a lovely person John? No? It's because you aren't.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7730

Post by Bhurzum » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:26 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote:
The kids with bad parents will just end up in prison anyway... so who the fuck cares.
Well you know, the little bastards couldn't be bothered to choose proper parents. They don't deserve a chance in life like a proper education so there really isn't any point in trying to improve public schools. Just shut the fuckers down and convert the buildings into prisons for children.
Did anyone ever tell you that you are a lovely person John? No? It's because you aren't.
It's like Torquemada said - "Nits become lice" (or words to that effect).

Be pure.

Be vigilant.

Behave!

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7731

Post by John D » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:34 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote:
The kids with bad parents will just end up in prison anyway... so who the fuck cares.
Well you know, the little bastards couldn't be bothered to choose proper parents. They don't deserve a chance in life like a proper education so there really isn't any point in trying to improve public schools. Just shut the fuckers down and convert the buildings into prisons for children.
Did anyone ever tell you that you are a lovely person John? No? It's because you aren't.
Most urban schools are little prisons where the students feel threatened and scared. There are maybe 10-15% of students who are essentially hard core criminals.... fighting, robbing, and drugging. Excuse me if I hold out little hope for these criminal delinquents. If there was any proof that we could save these kids using traditional methods in public schools then I would be all for it. But, nothing has worked and nothing is working for these dropouts.

These thug kids destroy the opportunities of the rest of the students. Vouchers at least provide a lifeline to the kids who care to learn and the parents who support them.

I am no fan of throwing good money at a fucking punk who just need to get locked up. Warehouse the little fuckers.

Yep... I'm a complete dick!

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7732

Post by free thoughtpolice » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:46 pm

These thug kids destroy the opportunities of the rest of the students. Vouchers at least provide a lifeline to the kids who care to learn and the parents who support them.
I'm not saying that I know the solution to that problem other than separating the lost cause from the salvageable, but I'm pretty sure that giving tax money in the form of vouchers to mardrassahs, scientology centers, and other vehicles for religious indoctrination isn't one.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7733

Post by Suet Cardigan » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:47 pm

Only men can be responsible for their own actions:
Betsy01.jpg
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Someone asks the obvious question: what if the man and woman are both drunk?
Betsy02.jpg
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Betsy03.jpg
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People are responsible for their own actions. Saying otherwise is infantilizing them.


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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7734

Post by Suet Cardigan » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:51 pm

Bhurzum wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
The kids with bad parents will just end up in prison anyway... so who the fuck cares.
Well you know, the little bastards couldn't be bothered to choose proper parents. They don't deserve a chance in life like a proper education so there really isn't any point in trying to improve public schools. Just shut the fuckers down and convert the buildings into prisons for children.
Did anyone ever tell you that you are a lovely person John? No? It's because you aren't.
It's like Torquemada said - "Nits become lice" (or words to that effect).

Be pure.

Be vigilant.

Behave!
Be Pure Be Vigilant Behave.jpg
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I always thought it would have been an appropriate motto for the Atheism+ forum.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7735

Post by feathers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:52 pm

Really? wrote:Education Secretary Betsy DeVos gave a speech in which she went against the "Dear Colleague" rape culture witch hunt bullshit.
So something good may actually emanate from the Trump administration? Excuse me while I check the weather forecast for Hell.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7736

Post by Kirbmarc » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:54 pm

John D wrote: No... I'm not surprised at all. I know a lot about DeVos. Something needs to change in public school. The left has no good ideas... well... really ... the only idea they have is to spend more, pay more, and grow the existing bloated bull shit. I am happy to experiment with options that will give some people a rug burn. In the short term things will get screwed up in some places, but at least something is changing.

At the very least, the poor parents who give a shit about their children's education will have some choice. The choice causes high quality parents to push their children into a better school. The parents who don't care will just take their kid to their lousy local school. This ability to choose will allow the most active and supportive parents to create a school environment that they can improve. The kids with bad parents will just end up in prison anyway... so who the fuck cares.
There should be a civic duty of society in general to provide citizens who are in poverty with at least decent education, though. Dismantling public education and not caring about children with negligent parents doesn't seem like a good idea. Also poor and non-negligent parents may really not be able to afford private education, even with vouchers. You ran the risk of creating castes of people who really cannot even have a chance to improve their socio-economic conditions.

Regardless of moral concerns (which do exist) breeding an eternal lower class of underpaid and unemployed (and likely unemployable) people isn't a good idea for any country, let alone one as rich in guns and people who use them as the US.

The US do spend a lot on public education, that's true, and results are actually lousy:
According to a 2005 report from the OECD, the United States is tied for first place with Switzerland when it comes to annual spending per student on its public schools, with each of those two countries spending more than $11,000 (in U.S. currency). Despite this high level of funding, U.S. public schools lag behind the schools of other rich countries in the areas of reading, math, and science
Switzerland, however, has better results. How does it happen?
A further analysis of developed countries shows no correlation between per student spending and student performance, suggesting that there are other factors influencing education. Top performers include Singapore, Finland and Korea, all with relatively low spending on education, while high spenders including Norway and Luxembourg have relatively low performance.[16] One possible factor is the distribution of the funding. In the US, schools in wealthy areas tend to be over-funded while schools in poorer areas tend to be underfunded.[17] These differences in spending between schools or districts may accentuate inequalities, if they result in the best teachers moving to teach in the most wealthy areas.[18]
The problem might not be spending more, but allocating the spending in a more efficient way.

However there's something weird going on with spending. Apparently there's lot of mismanagement of funds:
It has been shown that some school districts do not use their funds in the most productive way. For example, according to a 2007 article in the Washington Post, the Washington, D.C. public school district spends $12,979 per student per year. This is the third highest level of funding per student out of the 100 biggest school districts in the United States. Despite this high level of funding, the school district provides outcomes that are lower than the national average. In reading and math, the district's students score the lowest among 11 major school districts—even when poor children are compared only with other poor children. 33% of poor fourth graders in the United States lack basic skills in math, but in Washington, D.C., it's 62%.[24] According to a 2006 study by the Goldwater Institute, Arizona's public schools spend 50% more per student than Arizona's private schools. The study also says that while teachers constitute 72% of the employees at private schools, they make up less than half of the staff at public schools. According to the study, if Arizona's public schools wanted to be like private schools, they would have to hire approximately 25,000 more teachers, and eliminate 21,210 administration employees. The study also said that public school teachers are paid about 50% more than private school teachers.[25]

In 1985 in Kansas City, Missouri, a judge ordered the school district to raise taxes and spend more money on public education. Spending was increased so much, that the school district was spending more money per student than any of the country's other 280 largest school districts. Although this very high level of spending continued for more than a decade, there was no improvement in the school district's academic performance.[26][27]
It's weird that so much money is spent with lousy results. Something is wrong. Is it that incompetent teachers have perfect job security since teacher cannot be evaluated through merit pay due to union rules (which is actually a problem in, say, Italy)? Is it lack of control over local school spending? Lack of transparency? Badly-written syllabi (I evaluate syllabi for a living, believe me when I say that a badly written and programmed syllabus can really lower the quality of education)? Badly written tests, based on badly implemented standardized rules? Or a combination of the above?

I don't know. I'd love to review American public school performance and syllabi to have a better idea, since this is part of my job and if I had time I could at least point out a few things that don't work. However simply wrecking the system because it doesn't work and leaving children to for-profit private schools doesn't seem like a great solution to me.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7737

Post by fuzzy » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:58 pm

Camille Paglia says encouraging gender fluidity or transgenderism in children is abusive.
"In sex-reassignment surgery, even today, with all of its advances, cannot, in fact, change anyone’s sex," she said. "You can define yourself as a trans man or a trans woman or one of these new gradations along the scale, but ultimately every single cell in the human body, the DNA in that cell remains coded for your biological birth."

"So there are a lot of lies being propagated at the present moment," she said, "which I think is not in anyone’s best interests."

Paglia then remarked that encouraging gender fluidity or transgenderism in children is abusive [...]
https://www.cnsnews.com/blog/michael-w- ... ex-dna-set

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7738

Post by Matt Cavanaugh » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:02 pm

Betsy deVos is a cunt. The End.

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7739

Post by MarcusAu » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:06 pm

Bhurzum wrote: It's like Torquemada said - "Nits become lice" (or words to that effect).

Be pure.

Be vigilant.

Behave!
I remember that story. And while (sort of) true in context - the 'real' quote and history of the Sand Creek Massacre is interesting too.
John Chivington wrote: Damn any man who sympathizes with Indians! ... I have come to kill Indians, and believe it is right and honorable to use any means under God's heaven to kill Indians. ... Kill and scalp all, big and little; nits make lice.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Chivington


As for Torquey (from memory) :

"With Sword and Axe and Mace we cleanse and purify,

We never show any mercy,

All aliens must die, Die, DIE".

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Re: In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

#7740

Post by Bhurzum » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:22 pm

MarcusAu wrote:As for Trumpy (from Twitter) :

"With Law and Ballot and Presidential Decree we cleanse and purify,

We never show any mercy,

All aliens must leave, leave, LEAVE".
BRUTDFY (Brought that up to date for you - it's a new thing I'm trying out)

Locked